[News] Bettman upholds 20 game Wideman suspension. NHLPA files appeal to neutral arbitrator

[Igottago]

Originally Posted by 442scotty

This incident would make a great thesis for a masters degree in psychology. Two completely opposite views of what happened despite a pretty clear video...

Evil vs see no evil....

There is one pretty clear video...and another (that most, including the NHL, have chosen to ignore) that makes the same incident look pretty different in tone and intent.

Wideman is being tried by gif.

At the end of the day the NHL has made a mess of this situation. A 5-10 game suspension and it would've been over --- but now we're talking concussions, text messages, arbitration. This story isn't going away quietly.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Super-Rye

I hate the homer argument.

I mean I get it. People usually tend to develop bias', especially over something they're emotional or passionate about, but that doesn't make someone's point invalid.

Yeah that's what's eating me too.

Pages of people arguing two very extreme positions and then a guy here and there yelling homer if people disagree with them. Such a stupid comment.

This whole thing is odd to me, but in it are a bunch of truths (or at least what I believe to be true) that don't all line up on the same side to me ... so I don't see it as black or white.

-Wideman got hit
-Wideman looked to not see the guy was in his road until the last second.
-Wideman made a ######bag move by pushing the guy in anger (guessing pissed off from the hit)
-Wideman deserves to be suspended for the reaction.
-His reaction was similar to the surprised push Weber gave the same linesman
-The NHL has treated this like he rose to his feet and then planned and attacked an official
-The NHL in fearing PR reaction has handled this poorly
-The NHL in fearing the NFL concussion mess is handling this poorly
-The NHL dragged their feet on this for fear of not looking serious
-This appears to be more a NHLPA/NHL battle now for the first contested suspension since the new rules.
-The NHL may wish they didn't get into text messages

The guy is a suck, pissed that he got hit, surprised by an official and annoyed that he was in his way and shoved him. The league in fear of looking lenient has gone overboard and made a mess of things.

[Leeman4Gilmour]

I don't know if anyone heard Duhatschek on the East/West hot stove yesterday afternoon and before him, Johnson (I believe), but I am quite convinced they are on to something when they suggest this has become more about Wideman's choice of defense (concussion) for his actions than the action itself.

If the NHL opens the door to accepting concussion as an excuse for inexcusable actions, it's not a door, it's pandora's box. It could create a nightmare for the NHL in their ongoing concussion lawsuit, and another nightmare for how they move forward with the concussion protocol.

I mean, it's kind of already started. I may of heard incorrectly, but didn't Kadri pull out the "I was woozy" when discussing the throat slash?

This is all about setting precedence, not about the incident at this point.

[northcrunk]

I think when Wideman was talking about the "stupid media" he was talking about Eric Francis. Francis continues to takes runs at Wideman every chance he gets. I feel like there is a personal issue between them as Francis seems to have been doing it for a couple years now.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by Leeman4Gilmour

I don't know if anyone heard Duhatschek on the East/West hot stove yesterday afternoon and before him, Johnson (I believe), but I am quite convinced they are on to something when they suggest this has become more about Wideman's choice of defense (concussion) for his actions than the action itself.

If the NHL opens the door to accepting concussion as an excuse for inexcusable actions, it's not a door, it's pandora's box. It could create a nightmare for the NHL in their ongoing concussion lawsuit, and another nightmare for how they move forward with the concussion protocol.

I mean, it's kind of already started. I may of heard incorrectly, but didn't Kadri pull out the "I was woozy" when discussing the throat slash?

This is all about setting precedence, not about the incident at this point.

I'll be honest I am actually kind of surprised he took that route. Or rather that the NHLPA took that route. I think they could have stuck to "it was just an accident" and used all the evidence of the refs not caring and Wideman apologizing to show that no one thought it was a concern at first. He probably only would have gotten 5-10 games. I don't see a scenario where the concussion defense works. Even a defense around him being a little dazed but not concussed may have worked.

[Parallex]

I think the league is most pissed at the Flames.

[FlamesAddiction]

Sports are funny because it's a constant competition between different supporters. When something bad happens to one team, there is a fair amount of pleasure taken by fans outside of that team. Therefore, I don't think non-Flames fans tend to be any less biased in their assumptions or perspectives on Wideman's situation than Flames fans. In some ways, Flame supporters have more knowledge on the player and valid reasons for why he should get the benefit of the doubt.

A fair number of people in the media, within hockey circles and of course, the NHLPA; have come out in support of Wideman. The fact loud mouth fans on non-Flames message boards think it was intentional (or want to think that) means nothing.

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by Parallex

I think the league is most pissed at the Flames.

for what?

[Parallex]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

for what?

Not following proper concussion protocol.

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Parallex

Not following proper concussion protocol.

How does following concussion protocol have prevent this situation? The supposed concussion happened 15 seconds before the incident. What were the Flames supposed to do?

If anything, the league is pissed at the Flames for supporting their player as he tried to use the concussion as an excuse. Even that's a stretch though, really this is only a NHL and NHLPA issue at this point.

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by Parallex

Not following proper concussion protocol.

Wideman refused aid. They can't physically pull a guy off the bench.

It would have happened to any other team. In fact, many other teams have failed to follow concussion protocol in the past.

That's on the NHL for having a terrible protocol.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by 442scotty

This is just another of those threads that after a while, once everyone has their say, needs to be closed... Just creates bad blood among people on here... No winners here

I strongly disagree. This is what CP is all about, good discussion. Not everyone will agree with each other but for the most posters have been respectful of other posters. I think it is great when a discussion with differing opinions goes this well. As for bad blood I don't see that either. There are posters on here I almost never agree with, posters I have gotten right into with, but at the end of the day I still respect them because they contributed to the board with an opinion. There are certainly members on here I don't get along with but there is no bad blood, it is just hockey talk.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by northcrunk

I think when Wideman was talking about the "stupid media" he was talking about Eric Francis. Francis continues to takes runs at Wideman every chance he gets. I feel like there is a personal issue between them as Francis seems to have been doing it for a couple years now.

I don't think there is anything personal between them. I think Eric Francis is just being Eric Francis which equates to a d-bag.

[getbak]

I don't see how the text makes Wideman look worse at all. In fact, it seems like exactly what you'd expect him to say if things went exactly as he said they did.

Based on what he said after the game, in his mind, it was a non-issue during or immediately following the game. He apologized to the linesman, who presumably accepted the apology and that was it. He seemed genuinely surprised at the suggestion he'd get a call from the league about it.

Then (in his version of events, at least), the media decides to blow this story up because there's nothing else going on in the sports world. Suddenly, every pundit in the world is spouting off their opinions and the officials' union is up in arms over a perceived attack and he has to take the fall.


Wouldn't it look worse for him if his text said something like, "I hope they bought my story and think it was really an accident"?

[Parallex]

Originally Posted by Fire of the Phoenix

How does following concussion protocol have prevent this situation? The supposed concussion happened 15 seconds before the incident. What were the Flames supposed to do?

Well... my thinking goes that if the Flames send him down the alley to get checked out by the doctor. The Doctor basically either says "concussion" or "no concussion". If the doctor says "no concussion" then Wideman effectively has no medical argument to make on appeal and the league looks like it's taking concussions seriously. If the doctor says "concussion" then the league can still point to having done the right thing regarding player safety can use that as a mitigating circumstance and give Wideman a lesser suspension enough to mollify the NHLOA and maybe convince Wideman not to press further.

It's just really bad optics while the NHL is in the midst of a concussion lawsuit.

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by Parallex

The Doctor basically either says "concussion" or "no concussion". If the doctor says "no concussion" then Wideman effectively has no medical argument to make on appeal and the league looks like it's taking concussions seriously. If the doctor says "concussion" then the league can still point to having done the right thing regarding player safety can use that as a mitigating circumstance and give Wideman a lesser suspension enough to mollify the NHLOA and maybe convince Wideman not to press further.



It's just really bad optics while the NHL is in the midst of a concussion lawsuit.

As has been said, dazed/woozy/bell rung does not always = concussion. And not all concussions are the same. Not black and white, this is in the grey.


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[powderjunkie]

With respect to all the precedent setting talk, I'm not sure it's super relevant considering the league's history of precedents and spinning their wheel of justice...


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[Burner]

i want to read all of Bettmans texts and emails on this issue..

[Envitro]

We also need to examine the linesman's text messages, phone calls and emails regarding this. Is he really as hurt as he claims to be? LOL

This can go down a rather dark path now that the door has been opened by the NHL

[getbak]

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

With respect to all the precedent setting talk, I'm not sure it's super relevant considering the league's history of precedents and spinning their wheel of justice...

Yeah, look at the array of punishments that have been handed out for players doing the throat-slashing gesture. Andre Roy did it multiple times, the first time he got punished for it, he got two games. The next time, he got a fine.