2015 Alberta Budget Discussion

[Johnny199r]

Originally Posted by Slava

I think that everyone can agree on that point. The issue I have though (can't speak for everyone) is that the alternatives to what we have today seem to be fairly radical, and just not acceptable solutions. So while I know that something has to be done and something has to be changed I have no idea what that change should entail.

Yes, there seems to be no answer. Especially with a huge number of aging baby boomers on the horizon that will require hospital care.

[crazy_eoj]

Originally Posted by Johnny199r

Yes, there seems to be no answer. Especially with a huge number of aging baby boomers on the horizon that will require hospital care.

Introducing more private participation in health care, such as done in every country in Europe, would seem to make sense?

[CliffFletcher]

Unfortunately, there seems to be only two health care models in the public imagination: status quo, and the U.S. system. I expect the system will be more or less broken before true alternatives are considered (probably in 15 years or so).

[Mean Mr. Mustard]

Originally Posted by crazy_eoj

Introducing more private participation in health care, such as done in every country in Europe, would seem to make sense?

So you don't know anything about the Canada Health Act then?

[Mean Mr. Mustard]

Originally Posted by crazy_eoj

Healthcare spending in Alberta has grown at an ANNUAL rate of 10% in the perioud 2000-2010, or over 200% in that time-frame. In 2000, Alberta spent about the same as the rest of Canada on healthcare, and now we spend about 20% more on average. The single largest component of that increase is in salary costs.

Meanwhile health outcomes (waiting times, access to specialists, etc.) have not improved, mainly staying flat. As you have noted, it doesn't seem that these increases in spending have made a difference on the front line for workers.

This system is clearly broken. We cannot afford to increase public spending on health care 10% year over year forever without seeing any improvement in outcomes or working conditions. Simply assuming more taxes and more spending will solve the problem doesn't make any sense at all, as it hasn't made a difference over the past decade.

Using raw numbers as a means of arguing your point is pointless and provides for no context. During those years, there were a few things that were happening, the first being that there was a large population increase in the province of Alberta due to the Oil and Gas sector. This population increase requires more healthcare staff in order to run the health care system... especially since it is a healthcare system that was gutted in the 90s under the Klein administration.

https://secure.cihi.ca/free_products...sReport_EN.pdf

[crazy_eoj]

Originally Posted by Mean Mr. Mustard

So you don't know anything about the Canada Health Act then?

The Canada Health Act doesn't prohibit european style health care. Care to point out what you are talking about?

[Mean Mr. Mustard]

Originally Posted by crazy_eoj

The Canada Health Act doesn't prohibit european style health care. Care to point out what you are talking about?

Increased privatization of health care does go against the Canada Health Act.

7. In order that a province may qualify for a full cash contribution referred to in section 5 for a fiscal year, the health care insurance plan of the province must, throughout the fiscal year, satisfy the criteria described in sections 8 to 12 respecting the following matters:
(a) public administration;
(b) comprehensiveness;
(c) universality;
(d) portability; and
(e) accessibility.

Public administration

8. (1) In order to satisfy the criterion respecting public administration,
(a) the health care insurance plan of a province must be administered and operated on a non-profit basis by a public authority appointed or designated by the government of the province;
(b) the public authority must be responsible to the provincial government for that administration and operation; and
(c) the public authority must be subject to audit of its accounts and financial transactions by such authority as is charged by law with the audit of the accounts of the province.

So unless the Province of Alberta wants to risk losing Federal Government funding, an increased privatization of health care is not going to happen.

[crazy_eoj]

Originally Posted by Mean Mr. Mustard

Increased privatization of health care does go against the Canada Health Act.

7. In order that a province may qualify for a full cash contribution referred to in section 5 for a fiscal year, the health care insurance plan of the province must, throughout the fiscal year, satisfy the criteria described in sections 8 to 12 respecting the following matters:
(a) public administration;
(b) comprehensiveness;
(c) universality;
(d) portability; and
(e) accessibility.

Public administration

8. (1) In order to satisfy the criterion respecting public administration,
(a) the health care insurance plan of a province must be administered and operated on a non-profit basis by a public authority appointed or designated by the government of the province;
(b) the public authority must be responsible to the provincial government for that administration and operation; and
(c) the public authority must be subject to audit of its accounts and financial transactions by such authority as is charged by law with the audit of the accounts of the province.

So unless the Province of Alberta wants to risk losing Federal Government funding, an increased privatization of health care is not going to happen.

This says nothing about the ability to purchase private medical services or insurance, such as in Switzerland, Germany or Great Britain. It does not say physicians cannot operate within both a public or private system. It says nothing about a parallel system to alleviate pressure on the public system and it's failures. This only describes the behavior of the public provincial insurance plan.

The restrictions on private health care comes fromProvincial regulations which have likely been deemed unconstitutional by the Supreme Court in the Chiarelli decision; "the prohibition on private health insurance and its impact of limiting access to private health care was in violation of Section 7 of the
Canadian Charter and was not justifiable under Section 1."

I'm amazed that you are so entrenched in protecting a system that is often ranked as one of the poorer in the 'western' world outside of the US. Why wouldn't we want to learn from other places that have cheaper and better health care than here? Is it fear of change or competition, or simply wanting to ensure the best possible personal gain from a monopolized system?

While the U.S. ranked last in an international comparison of 11 countries in terms of five measures of performance, the report “Mirror, Mirror on the Wall: How the Performance of the U.S. Health Care System Compares Internationally- 2014 Update” rated Canada only slightly better in 10th position.

The Commonwealth Fund study used survey data from the last three years to compare the health care systems in Australia, Canada, France, Germany, the Netherlands, New Zealand, Norway, Sweden, Switzerland, the United Kingdom, and the United States. Quality indicators were grouped into four categories: effective care, safe care, coordinated care, and patient-centered care.

Despite the U.S. having the lowest score overall, Canada scored last on a number of measures:

Wait time for emergency care being two hours or more;
Wait time to see a specialist being two months or more;
Visiting an Emergency Department for condition that could have been treated by a general practitioner if he or she had been available;
Delays in patients being informed about abnormal laboratory test results;
Knowing who to contact about a condition or treatment;
Physician practices being able to electronically exchange clinical summaries and test results with other practices.

The Canadian health care system outperformed the other countries on only one measure – that being in the health equity category where survey results showed patients with above-income and below-income had to wait a comparable time to see a specialist.

So the only thing the Canadian health system does best is making sure everyone waits in an equally long line...

https://www.cma.ca/En/Pages/canada-r...cond-last.aspx