[Trade] Mark Stone (8yrs, $9.5mil AAV) to Vegas for Erik Brannstrom, Lindberg, 2020 2nd

[Classic_Sniper]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

I would rather face Vegas with Stone than 60-100 minute long wars of attrition against Erik Karlsson, Brent Burns, Marc Eduard Vlasic, and friends. We match up way better to the Knights' blue line who aren't able to throw out elite D againts all four of our lines.

True, but it’s likely we play Vegas or one of the wild card teams in the playoffs. To play San Jose in the 1st round would be highly improbable. A second round match would be inevitable against one of these 2 monster teams, but at the very least, that would mean that we won a round which im sure is the minimum goal going into the playoffs this season.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Stay Golden]

LV will be happy with Stone great all around player but i will be honest i don't want to see the Flames pay any player 9.5 million per season until they are absolutely forced to.

[Yobbo]

After all the hype of a big player coming in, I have to admit that I feel really disappointed in today's acquisition. I know it may be the safest method moving forward, but look how long it's been since the Flames have been in a position to really go for it. If we don't win the Cup this year, we can see where we need to improve our lineup for next year, and in waiting also makes the costs for acquiring the players we need less than it would have been today. I'll get over the disappointment, and maybe looking back next year we can say this was the right thing to do all along.

[Snuffleupagus]

A couple points to ponder.

Vegas didn't have to send salary back to fit Stone in, Ottawa is cheap!

Treliving likely had a deal for the trade but probably didn't like the price or term.

[Duffalufagus]

Originally Posted by Yobbo

After all the hype of a big player coming in, I have to admit that I feel really disappointed in today's acquisition. I know it may be the safest method moving forward, but look how long it's been since the Flames have been in a position to really go for it. If we don't win the Cup this year, we can see where we need to improve our lineup for next year, and in waiting also makes the costs for acquiring the players we need less than it would have been today. I'll get over the disappointment, and maybe looking back next year we can say this was the right thing to do all along.

I hear this argument too. If the Flames had landed stone we would be favorites this year in the west. It’s a short term pill for sure.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Stay Golden

LV will be happy with Stone great all around player but i will be honest i don't want to see the Flames pay any player 9.5 million per season until they are absolutely forced to.

Johnny's next deal will probably trump that number.

[Fire]

With Stone getting $9.5 million the Knights already has $82.375 million spent. That doesn't include Karlsson who will make at least $5.25 as a RFA, but it does include Clarkson's $5.25 on LTIR so it evens out. Never the less they will be very tight on the cap.

[Johnny Makarov]

At least we have something to cheer for on the Knights. Stone to be the new Tatar!

[bob-loblaw]

If Stone only wanted an eight year contract, then the Flames or some other teams may have dropped out on that as well, leaving only Vegas to negotiate with Ottawa.

[Macindoc]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

A couple points to ponder.

Vegas didn't have to send salary back to fit Stone in, Ottawa is cheap!

Treliving likely had a deal for the trade but probably didn't like the price or term.

Yes, Calgary would have had to pay more for Stone because the Flames would have had to offload some salary on Ottawa in return, so that would likely have added a first to Ottawa's firm ask for Valimaki. In addition, the Flames would probably have had to pay Stone more than the Knights offered, because of the very favourable tax laws in Nevada. Finally, if the Flames had added any medium to big ticket free agent, it would have also have cost them the cap space they have to pay bonuses this year, pushing those bonus overages into next year's cap space. As a result, Stone may have cost the Flames $10M/year to sign but may have cost them $11.35M in cap space next year due to bonus overages. As it sits now, the Flames have the cap space to cover their bonuses this year, so they will have an additional 1.35M in cap space next year (well, more precisely, they will not have that deduction from their cap space next season) that they would not have had if they had loaded up today.

[Duffalufagus]

Originally Posted by Macindoc

Yes, Calgary would have had to pay more for Stone because the Flames would have had to offload some salary on Ottawa in return, so that would likely have added a first to Ottawa's firm ask for Valimaki. In addition, the Flames would probably have had to pay Stone more than the Knights offered, because of the very favourable tax laws in Nevada. Finally, if the Flames had added any medium to big ticket free agent, it would have also have cost them the cap space they have to pay bonuses this year, pushing those bonus overages into next year's cap space. As a result, Stone may have cost the Flames $10M/year to sign but may have cost them $11.35M in cap space next year due to bonus overages. As it sits now, the Flames have the cap space to cover their bonuses this year, so they will have an additional 1.35M in cap space next year (well, more precisely, they will not have that deduction from their cap space next season) that they would not have had if they had loaded up today.

So never on the cards then?

[sureLoss]

the tax situation is overblown.

There was an article in the Athletic from the summer outlining how NHL players playing in Canada could mitigate the taxes they pay to match the taxes they would pay in the most favourable NHL US tax districts

https://theathletic.com/411211/2018/...canadian-team/

Every year it’s the same story. When the Canadiens strike out in free agency and have trouble attracting the best players to Montreal, taxes always come up as a serious deterrent. But it’s simply not true to say a player would automatically be crippled financially by taxes if he came to play for the Canadiens or the Maple Leafs or any other team in Canada.

“I can make it so signing in Montreal is the same as signing in Texas,” an agent told The Athletic.

Really? Residents of Texas pay federal tax at a lower rate than Canadians and pay no state tax on their home games. That’s tough to beat, no?

“In my opinion, the tax rate can be as low, or if not very close to what it is in Texas, Las Vegas, Florida or Tennessee,” confirms Jason Chevrier, an accountant and tax advisor with an expertise in cross-border taxes. “It’s a myth that Canadian players – I say that because taxes in Ontario are higher than they are in Quebec at that tax bracket – it’s a myth to say Montreal is the worst place to play hockey. Montreal can even be one of the best places if it’s planned properly.”

yes, there are some downsides, but the so called tax disadvantage can be overcome

[Mr.Coffee]

I think this would have made keeping Tkachuk virtually impossible and then combined with Valimaki... I think Calgary made the right call here for sure. They just need to believe in themselves. They are that good, they just have to believe in themselves and keep up the hard work mentality.

Which is why it's slightly concerning about line 1 deciding to go back to bad lazy habits but, I digress and we all know they'll come back soon.

[Roof-Daddy]

I'm not too disappointed the Flames didn't get Stone today given the cost and all but I am disappointed that he ended up on a division rival. I'm also annoyed that they locked him up long term.

Would have liked to see Tre take a run at him in the summer. Oh well, at least the cap structure is still in tact and hopefully Tre can dig up another Lindholm somewhere.

[DomeFoam]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

Brannstrom was not their best prospect. Glass is miles better.

Glass is not miles better in any way shape or form. Brannstroms absolutely tearing up pro hockey in his first season in the AHL while Glass still a baby down in junior. Elite puck-moving offensive machine. Going to be a star. Theres a reason everything that came with him in the trade was basically a thrown in. He is the trade and was absolutely their best prospect.

[Flamenspiel]

Brian Burke mentioned on Bob's show that he thinks it was the 8 year term that the other teams did want to give up for years 30-35, think about it, this player will be making 9.5 million from 30-35, I just don't think he is in that category of performance. Now if Vegas wins the cup in the next three years its worth it, but are they really that close?

Basically this is it for Vegas, they were very well positioned capwise last year and filled it with Patches, Stasny, and Stone. Really not bad but two of those players are over 30 and on the way down.

[wired]

Originally Posted by Ozy_Flame

Either FRACK or DODGED A BULLET.

Dodged a bullet. He is not worth over 9 million, for 8 yrs.
We have players who are just as good or better. IMO

[wired]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Johnny's next deal will probably trump that number.

It might, but I think he is better than Stone, different style of player, but better.

[GreenLantern]

I guess I am just spoiled with Treliving because that contract seems ridiculous. I am beyond happy that the Flames didn't pay that price to acquire and then keep.

[OldDutch]

Great resolve by BT today. Not that he would have been crazy enough to do that deal.

Everything aside I look back at the fist pumps when we landed Jokinen. He seemed perfect for Iggy. It was someone I wanted so bad to play with him.

Stone is different, but even if the trade is done there isn’t any guarantee he is as effective. Look at Neal. Again different but you never know.

We know what we have here. Will it go all the way, who knows but I am glad our future wasn’t mortgaged for a player that probably but not certainly helped.