2024/2025 Trade Rumours and Speculation thread

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by RedHawk12

100% agree. That's why it's so hard to rebuild in a Canadian market. There's so much pressure from the fanbase to shortcut the process. Even when we draft one superstar, the pressure will be on to build around that one guy and get in the playoffs again.

You look at the teams that win cups - they all have MULTIPLE home-grown star players, typically drafted very high after many years of basement-dwelling. Otherwise, you're at most building a team that will be 1st round playoff fodder.

You can see it right here on this board in terms of candian impatience. Your last paragraph is key to a rebuild and yet is constantly challenged here as a poor way to go. "Yeah but look at these teams where this didn't work, so it's bad!"

Okay, then let's just retool around no stars and aim to be a wildcard team, then?

[Goriders]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Stop looking for short cuts and put in the effort to draft and develop your own players.

There's no shortcutting this process, and if you go looking to do so all you're going to end up doing is hurting the long term ceiling of your team.

Draft. Develop. Patience is a virtue.

Do you think they don’t take the draft seriously. What are they going to do differently?

You’re not going to build a team solely through the draft though. You have to make trades and fill in gaps with free agency.

[Flamesfan05]

Originally Posted by Goriders

You’re not going to build a team solely through the draft though. You have to make trades and fill in gaps with free agency.

That should come only after you have built your core through the drafts. Right now the gap is humongous. The best prospect on the team is Coronato and he is no where good enough yet.

[Hackey]

Originally Posted by RedHawk12

100% agree. That's why it's so hard to rebuild in a Canadian market. There's so much pressure from the fanbase to shortcut the process. Even when we draft one superstar, the pressure will be on to build around that one guy and get in the playoffs again.

You look at the teams that win cups - they all have MULTIPLE home-grown star players, typically drafted very high after many years of basement-dwelling. Otherwise, you're at most building a team that will be 1st round playoff fodder.

Is there the pressure though? I feel like Canadian fan bases are the most knowledgeable in the league and if the organization was open and honest, the fan base would have zero issue getting behind a proper rebuild.
Rebuilds might not always work but they're definitely the most probable strategy this organization has of becoming elite. Thinking a retool is the answer seems insane to me. In a retool situation you'll need to get extremely lucky in later rounds. Drafting high for 5 years and rebuilding doesn't prevent you from drafting well in later rounds, it likely only adds to your talent pool. The probability of finding stars at the top of draft is exponentially higher so I really hope they acknowledge that and take advantage of that while still trying to excel in the later rounds, trades, free agents, etc. Use every method you can, especially the most probable one.

[Goriders]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

That should come only after you have built your core through the drafts. Right now the gap is humongous. The best prospect on the team is Coronato and he is no where good enough yet.

I’d say our best prospect is wolf. Coronato and Pospisil right in there too. But my point is the infatuation with being as bad as san jose is probably not going to transpire. The Flames have too many good players. They’ve turned over almost the whole roster in the last 3 years. At some point you have to show some loyalty to players and help them via trades and free agency.

If they move Markstrom and Mangiapane I think Anderson and Backlund might be the only players left from 3 or 4 seasons ago. That’s a 90% turnover. To be the worst in the league you’d probably have to turn over another 50% of the current roster. What good player in the league would possibly want to come here with that level of turmoil?

Just being realistic the Flames need to look at all avenues to improve. They probably will be drafting in the bottom third of the league for the next year or two. But I highly doubt they get into the top 5. They’ll need to keep making good trades and uncover gems in free agency. Just like every other team in the league does.

[Sidney Crosby's Hat]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Tkachuk was 24 and was (and is) a better player than 27 year old Mitch Marner is.

Tkachuk was signed for years 25-32, Marner will be signed for years 28-35.

All of these reasons point to Tkachuk being worth substantially more than Mitch Marner.

Except now the cap is higher and it's going to continue to grow each year versus how flat it stayed for so long. That alone should get Marner a better contract.

[Flamesfan05]

Originally Posted by Goriders

I’d say our best prospect is wolf. Coronato and Pospisil right in there too. But my point is the infatuation with being as bad as san jose is probably not going to transpire. The Flames have too many good players. They’ve turned over almost the whole roster in the last 3 years. At some point you have to show some loyalty to players and help them via trades and free agency.

If they move Markstrom and Mangiapane I think Anderson and Backlund might be the only players left from 3 or 4 seasons ago. That’s a 90% turnover. To be the worst in the league you’d probably have to turn over another 50% of the current roster. What good player in the league would possibly want to come here with that level of turmoil?

Just being realistic the Flames need to look at all avenues to improve. They probably will be drafting in the bottom third of the league for the next year or two. But I highly doubt they get into the top 5. They’ll need to keep making good trades and uncover gems in free agency. Just like every other team in the league does.

Yes they need to do everything but the drafts are still key. They mess that up then we’ll be in hockey hell for a long time.

I disagree on Wolf, the jury is still out on him. You just don’t know with goalie.

It’s also going to be extremely hard for him with the team as bad as it is. They have 2, maybe 3 competent NHL dmen at the moment

[Fan69]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

Yes they need to do everything but the drafts are still key. They mess that up then we’ll be in hockey hell for a long time.

I disagree on Wolf, the jury is still out on him. You just don’t know with goalie.

It’s also going to be extremely hard for him with the team as bad as it is. They have 2, maybe 3 competent NHL dmen at the moment

Agree on wolf. Hard to say what we have still.

[Bingo]

You don't just pick one lane and call it a day.

You look for value in every lane.

If team X has a player that you value more than the asset they want for them you do it.

Conroy wouldn't value an expensive 36 year old with 5 years left on his contract in a rebuild so no trade. He might be interested in a 23 year old center that seems buried somewhere and is worth more to him than a 2nd.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by Hackey

Is there the pressure though? I feel like Canadian fan bases are the most knowledgeable in the league and if the organization was open and honest, the fan base would have zero issue getting behind a proper rebuild.

This educated fan base thing just isn't true. Heck, there is a large contingent of posters on this site that think a rebuild is crazy talk and shouldn't happen and this is a cross section of the most diehard fans.

Casual fans will for sure check out during a rebuild but they are already checking out now because the team is full of vets and bad. The Flames should still do it but you can't wrap it in the soft blanket of the 'educated' fans will come out and pay big dollars to watch bad hockey. Thankfully the team is in no danger of relocating so bottom out hard and can sell some cheap tickets for a few years.

[Major Major]

I would put the odds of Conroy moving number 9 at 0.0001%.

Dude is an absolute draft dork. His hobby is scouting. The first thing he did when the trade deadline was over was hop on a plane to scout draft picks around the world.

Tre loved trades and didn't respect draft picks. I very much doubt Conroy will have the same zeal for deals and I would put sizeable amounts of cash on him not trading a top 10 pick in the next 5 years.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Bonded

This educated fan base thing just isn't true. Heck, there is a large contingent of posters on this site that think a rebuild is crazy talk and shouldn't happen and this is a cross section of the most diehard fans.

Casual fans will for sure check out during a rebuild but they are already checking out now because the team is full of vets and bad. The Flames should still do it but you can't wrap it in the soft blanket of the 'educated' fans will come out and pay big dollars to watch bad hockey. Thankfully the team is in no danger of relocating so bottom out hard and can sell some cheap tickets for a few years.

I sit beside fans in pretty expensive seats who clearly aren’t knowledgeable or strategic in their views on the Flames, based on what I overhear. Same goes for people I overhear in pubs. They are just there to see games and they hope the Flames win those games. They have superficial opinions on players and the team. A multi year rebuild isn’t something they think about.

[Burning Beard]

Yeah and let's be honest, I haven't heard a single poster on here who wanted a rebuild go out and buy season tickets now that it's started (myself included)

[Shazam]

I've been mulling getting some.

[Burning Beard]

Originally Posted by Shazam

I've been mulling getting some.

That's awesome! I hope we get some exciting prospects this year and it keeps butts in the seats.

[Buff]

Originally Posted by traptor

Not sure why the wold would do that but let's say they are.

Using Dach as an example it cost habs 13th oa + 3rd.

So Rossi would cost us 9th oa.

Would it be worth it?

No. However, I read an article that Minnesota would rather be making the playoffs and winning now. So trading Rossi is a way for them to get a contributing player. They're thin a center and Rossi is a center... who do we have at center that moves the needle for Minnesota? Probably doesn't work for both teams to be trade partners on a deal involving Rossi.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by Bonded

This educated fan base thing just isn't true. Heck, there is a large contingent of posters on this site that think a rebuild is crazy talk and shouldn't happen and this is a cross section of the most diehard fans.

Casual fans will for sure check out during a rebuild but they are already checking out now because the team is full of vets and bad. The Flames should still do it but you can't wrap it in the soft blanket of the 'educated' fans will come out and pay big dollars to watch bad hockey. Thankfully the team is in no danger of relocating so bottom out hard and can sell some cheap tickets for a few years.

I agree but the notion of Canadian team can't rebuilt also isn't true.
Ottawa, Edmonton, Montreal and Toronto have all done attempted rebuilds. Vancouver kind of did and still had a top 10 draft pick 6 out of 7 straight years.

Only Calgary and Winnipeg have never really gone full bottom out. I think Conroy will try to do more along the lines of what Vancouver did.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

I agree but the notion of Canadian team can't rebuilt also isn't true.
Ottawa, Edmonton, Montreal and Toronto have all done attempted rebuilds. Vancouver kind of did and still had a top 10 draft pick 6 out of 7 straight years.

Only Calgary and Winnipeg have never really gone full bottom out. I think Conroy will try to do more along the lines of what Vancouver did.

I think Canadian teams can rebuild and that the Flames should but there isn't going to be a line up of 'educated' fans standing there to pay big dollars to watch them.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

I agree but the notion of Canadian team can't rebuilt also isn't true.
Ottawa, Edmonton, Montreal and Toronto have all done attempted rebuilds. Vancouver kind of did and still had a top 10 draft pick 6 out of 7 straight years.

Only Calgary and Winnipeg have never really gone full bottom out. I think Conroy will try to do more along the lines of what Vancouver did.

I'm not sure any of those teams embraced a multi year rebuild a la Chicago/Pittsburgh. Edmonton, for example, just sucked. They sure weren't talking rebuild when McDavid fell into their laps.

[Ba'alzamon]

Originally Posted by Buff

No. However, I read an article that Minnesota would rather be making the playoffs and winning now. So trading Rossi is a way for them to get a contributing player. They're thin a center and Rossi is a center... who do we have at center that moves the needle for Minnesota? Probably doesn't work for both teams to be trade partners on a deal involving Rossi.

Rossi is a contributing player, though. He just had a 40 point season lol.