[News] New Arena - Plan B - Victoria Park

[Tacoman]

Originally Posted by Hot_Flatus

The team/owners are doing a good enough job of that in their own right. They certainly do not need that blowhole adding to the issues.

What a disgrace this entire ownership group/management team is proving to be. It's certainly no wonder this team cannot manage to build a winner with clowns like this running the show.

Right. The ownership group that has done more for this city from a philanthropic point of view than almost any group of individuals in the history of our town are a disgrace and an embarrassment. So says the guy with "Listen To My Farts" and location "Uranus" on his avatar. Got it. Junior High is going to be so exciting.

[NiklasSundblad]

Originally Posted by Northendzone

so according to an article in today's herald, diane coley-urquhart says the city and flames are in the "short-strokes of putting a deal together"

http://calgaryherald.com/news/local-...burkes-threats

so if this is true, would one not think that the head of hockey ops would be cc'd in on the email correspondence, or invited to the meetings that the flames held in their saddledome offices......

regardless of where the city is at, they should just tell the flames one way of the other soon, so the flames can make their plans accordingly

This also fits in the timeline of when CMLC is releasing their master plan for Victoria Park: http://www.calgarymlc.ca/riversdistr...terplan#vision

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by Tacoman

Right. The ownership group that has done more for this city from a philanthropic point of view than almost any group of individuals in the history of our town are a disgrace and an embarrassment. So says the guy with "Listen To My Farts" and location "Uranus" on his avatar. Got it. Junior High is going to be so exciting.

Leveraging charitable donations is only a couple of steps above leveraging a meeting with someone on their death bed.

[Mr.Coffee]

^^ not to mention, keep your ####ing charity dollars then? Edwards made billions off of oil and gas from Alberta in the first place, and I guarantee he has not paid $500 million (or whatever the total amount in CalgaryNext was from the city's contribution) in charitable donations to call it a wash.

The philanthropic argument is ridiculous. Hey I gave to charity last year too, can the city pay for my mortgage and I'll host a few community events throughout the year? Deal?

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Tacoman

Right. The ownership group that has done more for this city from a philanthropic point of view than almost any group of individuals in the history of our town are a disgrace and an embarrassment. So says the guy with "Listen To My Farts" and location "Uranus" on his avatar. Got it. Junior High is going to be so exciting.

Is this really true? I hear this argument quite a bit (although admittedly not to this extent) and I am just curious as to the details. Should they be renaming the Big 4 after Murray Edwards and co.?

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Is this really true? I hear this argument quite a bit (although admittedly not to this extent) and I am just curious as to the details. Should they be renaming the Big 4 after Murray Edwards and co.?

Hmmmm......tough call. They have done a helluva lot for this City.

Murray Edwards? I cant speak to that, but Doc Seaman was as close to a Saint as this City is going to get.

[Mr.Coffee]

It makes no sense. So you do a lot philanthropically and it entitles you to hundreds of millions of dollars of public dollars into your business? Couldn't be more asinine. Isn't the point of philanthropy to, ya know, BE PHILANTHROPIC?

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

It makes no sense. So you do a lot philanthropically and it entitles you to hundreds of millions of dollars of public dollars into your business? Couldn't be more asinine.

Well yeah, that statement is crazy. No one is entitled to anything really.

And yet its the game we all play.

[Mr.Coffee]

Well there are posters in this thread that seem to think these billionaires are entitled to hundreds of millions due to philanthropy. HUNDREDS. Of millions.

Also, what game? What are you talking about?

[GordonBlue]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

Well there are posters in this thread that seem to think these billionaires are entitled to hundreds of millions due to philanthropy. HUNDREDS. Of millions.

Also, what game? What are you talking about?

the game of rationalization, perhaps?

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

Well there are posters in this thread that seem to think these billionaires are entitled to hundreds of millions due to philanthropy. HUNDREDS. Of millions.

Also, what game? What are you talking about?

Originally Posted by GordonBlue

the game of rationalization, perhaps?

The Game where you do things with your left hand while doing other things with your right.

I think its called....what is it....Politics?

Where you make friends with people who can help you by giving you money that isnt theirs.

This isnt new. Its been going on since forever.

[jayswin]

A lot of millionaire/billionaire philanthropists hold their philanthropy up as a card in their ever going life of wealth accumulation.

Call me cynical, but I believe most people on earth would be decent to excellent philanthropists given extreme wealth, as it doesn't take a lot to give millions when you have billions, yet you look like you're giving the world away to the common earner, and they're too often held up this way by society.

I'm much more impressed by low income earners that struggle with bills and still see it important in their lives to give what little they can spare. But those people don't have the media in their pocket to show up and take their picture as they make their donation.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by jayswin

A lot of millionaire/billionaire philanthropists hold their philanthropy up as a card in their ever going life of wealth accumulation.

Call me cynical, but I believe most people on earth would be decent to excellent philanthropists given extreme wealth, as it doesn't take a lot to give millions when you have billions, yet you look like you're giving the world away to the common earner, and they're too often held up this way by society.

I'm much more impressed by low income earners that struggle with bills and still see it important in their lives to give what little they can spare. But those people don't have the media in their pocket to show up and take their picture as they make their donation.

I think theres even a Biblical tale along those lines.

Giving what you can.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

Burke, King etc can keep posturing and trying to paint the city as the bad guys, but it clearly does nothing but set back the process.

Based on King's interview from a few weeks ago, it's clear they're trying to whip up support for public financing. The Flames feel the negative side gets too much press, and that they need to motivate supporters to write to their politicians, speak up in the media, etc.

Problem is, both King and Burke are tone-deaf, and don't seem to understand how patronizing and entitled their comments come across. I'd chalk that up to too much time golfing and going out for dinner with well-heeled corporate chums, and a blithe detachment from how average Calgarians feel about this issue.

[Mr.Coffee]

Originally Posted by Locke

The Game where you do things with your left hand while doing other things with your right.

I think its called....what is it....Politics?

Where you make friends with people who can help you by giving you money that isnt theirs.

This isnt new. Its been going on since forever.

for sure, wasn't sure that's what you meant.

[Jason14h]

It really doesn't matter if we SHOULD give them money. The point is in a world with limited NHL teams (Supply) some city WILL build a stadium (Hello Seattle!)

At the end of the day it isn't a bluff. These businessmen will take their team to a city that WILL build them a stadium.

[Mr.Coffee]

oh well.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

It really doesn't matter if we SHOULD give them money. The point is in a world with limited NHL teams (Supply) some city WILL build a stadium (Hello Seattle!)

At the end of the day it isn't a bluff. These businessmen will take their team to a city that WILL build them a stadium.

I hope this is the last time I do this.

Yes and no.

Yes. The City will give them money, and I do not have a problem with that, so long as its reasonable. CalgaryNEXT was crazy. There is a Public benefit to having the Flames here, yes, I know its nebulous and difficult to quantify, so dont hand them a blank cheque.

But No. They cant 'just leave.'

They really cant. When was the last time an NHL team left a Canadian City?

[Mr.Coffee]

Originally Posted by jayswin

A lot of millionaire/billionaire philanthropists hold their philanthropy up as a card in their ever going life of wealth accumulation.

Call me cynical, but I believe most people on earth would be decent to excellent philanthropists given extreme wealth, as it doesn't take a lot to give millions when you have billions, yet you look like you're giving the world away to the common earner, and they're too often held up this way by society.

I'm much more impressed by low income earners that struggle with bills and still see it important in their lives to give what little they can spare. But those people don't have the media in their pocket to show up and take their picture as they make their donation.

Exactly and then they don't turn around and expect free handouts from government or the like.

Now to be fair, we don't exactly hear these sentiments from Flames ownership either (so, I don't actually think they expect this- can't imagine they would anyway), it's people on this site or random people making that argument, but the point of that argument is asinine.

[Fighting Banana Slug]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

It makes no sense. So you do a lot philanthropically and it entitles you to hundreds of millions of dollars of public dollars into your business? Couldn't be more asinine. Isn't the point of philanthropy to, ya know, BE PHILANTHROPIC?

Not entitled to millions of dollars, but probably shouldn't be considered "a disgrace" to the city, which is what that poster was responding to.