Burke Speaks - January 30, 2014

[troutman]

Originally Posted by Pliddy

Then how do you explain the Detroit Red Wings?

Luck - in any random distribution some teams will appear to do better and others will appear to do worse. Not even the most optimistic DET scout would have predicted that Zetterberg and Datsyuk would become NHL all-star players.

[Beatle17]

Originally Posted by Pliddy

Then how do you explain the Detroit Red Wings?

Detroit hasn't done that well either. You have to go back to the 2005 draft to find any players that have played actual meaningful time on their team, and thats Abdelkader and Helm.

Everyone wants to give them credit but the majority of their cup winning teams were bought for the highest dollars. When they needed to plug someone in to help they would go out and sign a Brett Hull, Luc Robitaille, Igor Larionov etc. Also some of the guys they drafted out of Europe were older players that had been overlooked for 1-2 years and Detroit drafted them because their scouts kept track of them (see Kronwall in 2000)

[Beatle17]

Matter of fact, if you check out Detroit's drafting of European talent the majority of them were 20 years old, except Lidstrom, or older when they drafted them. They understood the rules about Euro players better than the other teams and heavily scouted the area when other teams didn't. Jimmy Devallano was a genius, have to admire them for that.

But in saying so they haven't done better than anyone else since the late '90s for drafting Euros.

[puckluck2]

Detroit looks to be one of the worst teams at the draft in the last 10 years or so. Look at their picks. Nothing to write home about. They're living off past glory.

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by puckluck2

Detroit looks to be one of the worst teams at the draft in the last 10 years or so. Look at their picks. Nothing to write home about. They're living off past glory.

Their drafting from 2004-2009 has produced 9 NHLers. (Franzen, Kindl, Helm, Abdelkader, Matthias, Andersson, Smith plus Nyqvuist and Tatar who are breaking out)

That can't be one of the worst. Probably closer to one of the best.


EDIT: Plus, 2003 produced their current starting goalie, and another full time NHLer in Quincey.

[EYE_Overstand]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

Their drafting from 2004-2009 has produced 9 NHLers. (Franzen, Kindl, Helm, Abdelkader, Matthias, Andersson, Smith plus Nyqvuist and Tatar who are breaking out)

That can't be one of the worst. Probably closer to one of the best.


EDIT: Plus, 2003 produced their current starting goalie, and another full time NHLer in Quincey.

Can't disagree with anything here but I think they traded for Quincey

[DAN0383]

They traded for Quincey but they also originally drafted him then lost him on waivers.

[Sylvanfan]

Detroit is still living off Datsyuk, Zetterberg, and Kronwall. Since the draft changed to 7 rounds vs 9 and the rules for drafting European players changed they are not getting the same calibre of players. They are having a hard time holding down the last playoff spot in the East right now.

I still believe the best way to succeed at drafting is to have more picks. Chicago, Nashville those teams tend to have 6-9 picks per draft. Hopefully Burke can find a way to add at least 2-3 more picks in the first 4 rounds of the next two drafts. If you make 10 selections instead of 6 outside the top 5 picks, you have a much better shot to find 2 guys who become regular contributors.

[moon]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

Their drafting from 2004-2009 has produced 9 NHLers. (Franzen, Kindl, Helm, Abdelkader, Matthias, Andersson, Smith plus Nyqvuist and Tatar who are breaking out)

That can't be one of the worst. Probably closer to one of the best.


EDIT: Plus, 2003 produced their current starting goalie, and another full time NHLer in Quincey.

That is a pretty crappy list of NHLers though.

Kindl fringe NHLer/bottom pairing d-man, Helm and Abdelkader dime a dozen bottom 6 guys, Matthias bottom 6 guy, Smith more potential than substance at this point. Andersson, Tartar, Nyqvuist may be something but haven't been impressive so far in the NHL. Franzen is the best player and he is pretty meh living off Zetterberg and Datsyuk handing him free points.

Over that same time the Flames drafted Prust (Abdelkador), Backlund (Helm), Pardy (Kindl), Bouma (Andersson), Erixon (Smith), Boyd (Matthias). The Flames have Ortio who could turn into something and Cracknell who is playing (albeit very sparingly) for St. Louis this year.

That leaves Detroit with Franzen and Calgary with TJ Brodie. So overall looks fairly similar and Calgary has been raked over the coals for their drafting during Sutter's time here.

[Scoreface]

Detroit sucks.

[FAN]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

Which teams are those? The teams that draft well are generally the teams drafting really high.

The drafting record of the best drafting teams are mostly misses. Look it up.

So in terms of drafting performance, does it really matter how many scouts we have, who we have as scouts, who we have as chief scout, who we have as the GM ,and the drafting criteria/preferences set by the GM? I like to think all of the above matters.

There are going to be misses and it's certainly much harder not having high picks or multiple picks, but the best drafting teams find players: whether they nail their top picks, continually find support players in the late rounds, or draft a star player every few years. The Canadiens are considered one of the best drafting teams in the past decade and while they have misses, it's hard to argue that their drafting record isn't a step above many teams. Or take the Pens. Take away their top 5 picks and their drafting record is still really good. After a while it's hard to call it luck and flukes and acknowledge the fact that some teams simply draft better.

[TjRhythmic]

Originally Posted by Gaskal

Heck, if I was one of Johnny Hockey's teammates ribbing him good-naturedly on his height, I'd go further than Burke.

I'd hang one of these over his dressing room stall just a few inches higher than his normal height.

I think it would be awesome if at the first preseason game they put a booster seat on the bench for him... can totally see Grats doing it