High-Profile Sexual Abuse Epidemic

[GGG]

Originally Posted by JohnnyB

Obviously there are laws against public nudity or sexual acts in public. Exposure to pornographic material, in most work places, is also going to be prohibited.

I'm thinking more of this issue of consent for acts that don't clearly violate any other law. If someone wants to puke in a cup in front of me and proceed to drink their puke, I will find that horrific, deranged and very offensive, and I may feel violated, but could I say they violated my right to consent if I'm free to leave at any point?

Consent for what is done with my own body seems clear. Consent for what others do with their bodies is not so clear.

The anti abortion protests might be a good test case for this thought experiment.

I think it depends on the location.

If you go to a kids playground the behaviour that is acceptable is much more limited then say in a par. I'd say that while you don't have a right not to be offended there is a reasonable limitation on free speech of don't have your anti abortion protest in a kids playground.

There is certainly a social norm at play.

[rubecube]

I understand that there can be some miscommunication when it comes to consent but I've always found if pretty easy to tell when someone isn't into something and to not proceed once you get to that point, and I don't think I'm particularly special or anything when it comes to sensing or decoding people's comfort levels.

[JohnnyB]

Originally Posted by GGG

The anti abortion protests might be a good test case for this thought experiment.

I think it depends on the location.

If you go to a kids playground the behaviour that is acceptable is much more limited then say in a par. I'd say that while you don't have a right not to be offended there is a reasonable limitation on free speech of don't have your anti abortion protest in a kids playground.

There is certainly a social norm at play.

So whose consent matters in that situation? I mean, it's one thing to call an action offensive and vulgar, but it's another to say that the offensive action should require another person's permission or else be a violation of their rights.

Referencing social norms suggest that it's the consent of general society that needs to be provided, which seems intuitive but is also a pretty slippery slope and definitely provides a lot of grey area.

[killer_carlson]

Nm

[direwolf]

Originally Posted by BlackRedGold25

Add George Takei to the list of Hollywood people who have committed sexual assault.

Takei is flat out denying that it happened and claims he doesn't even remember the guy.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...-a-young-actor

On Saturday morning, Takei posted a series of statements on Twitter in which he denied knowing Brunton and said he was “shocked and bewildered” by the allegation.

“The events he describes back in the 1980s simply did not occur,” Takei wrote, “and I do not know why he has claimed them now. I have wracked [sic] my brain to ask if I remember Mr Brunton, and I cannot say I do.”

In his tweets on Saturday, he said: “I do take these claims very seriously, and I wanted to provide my response thoughtfully and not out of the moment. Right now it is a he said/he said situation, over alleged events nearly 40 years ago.

“But those that know me understand that non-consensual acts are so antithetical to my values and my practices, the very idea that someone would accuse me of this is quite personally painful.”

[Cole436]

Considering how Takei has championed sexual assault awareness for years, this is the first allegation I have trouble taking at face value.

[Flamenspiel]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

And I find it sad that you would think discussing a topic like this is funny.

We all have mothers, most of us, wives, girlfriends, sisters, daughters, aunts, nieces etc.

Why in the hell wouldn't we discuss how they might feel? How they might react if this happened to them? What the consequences should be for someone who was guilty of perpetrating these acts?

Do you seriously believe that all men are so disconnected from their female counterparts that's it's impossible and even insulting for us to even attempt to comprehend what their lives are like? Think about what you're saying about the relationship you have with the women in your life when you make a statement like that.

Well, I think thats just it though, the point is that the most important person(s) you need to talk to about this topic are the women in your life.

[transplant99]

This whole thing is startnig to take on the feel of a good old fashioned witch hunt.

No question in my mind that sexual assault can be on par with the most heinous of all person on person crimes. I lived with a victim of it for 10 years and she simply was never ever able to get past the events enough to live a normal life. One of the saddest things I will ever experience in all honesty.

However, I think just as heinous is the false accusation possibility against anyone. Particualrly when it is clear now that the court of public opinion is the over riding one in terms of doing "justice" in the eyes of so many. You can't put the toothpaste back in the tube.

You just know that this avalanche of real assault victims coming forward will also include those that weren't but have to be part of it all. I think it is a 1000 times worse to convict an innocent person than it is to let a guilty one go free.

[CampbellsTransgressions]

It might look like a witchhunt but that would not be the case if not for the mountains of sexual abuse being uncovered.

And keep in mind that in a witchhunt, none of the witches end up actually being witches.

[wittynickname]

Originally Posted by rubecube

I understand that there can be some miscommunication when it comes to consent but I've always found if pretty easy to tell when someone isn't into something and to not proceed once you get to that point, and I don't think I'm particularly special or anything when it comes to sensing or decoding people's comfort levels.

Pretty much. If there's even a chance that the response to sexual advances is less than "yes," it's a no. Pretty straightforward stuff.

No one is saying you need a signed affadavit before getting naked but ensuring consent is pretty simple.

[Sainters7]

Judging by the reaction I'm seeing on the internets to LCKs response, I'm actually starting to think he's going to wriggle out of this once he takes a step back for a bit. I'm surprised, he's really managed to charm the general populace these past few years since his fame exploded late in his career, dude gets away with everything others can't it seems. I don't know how he does it.

[Itse]

Originally Posted by Sainters7

Judging by the reaction I'm seeing on the internets to LCKs response, I'm actually starting to think he's going to wriggle out of this once he takes a step back for a bit. I'm surprised, he's really managed to charm the general populace these past few years since his fame exploded late in his career, dude gets away with everything others can't it seems. I don't know how he does it.

Well, he gave pretty much the perfect answer, taking ownership and recognizing the problem. Plus what he's been accused of is pretty far from the worst stuff that's come out.

I do however suspect he's now burned most of the goodwill he's gathered in his career.

[Major Major]

Originally Posted by Sainters7

Judging by the reaction I'm seeing on the internets to LCKs response, I'm actually starting to think he's going to wriggle out of this once he takes a step back for a bit. I'm surprised, he's really managed to charm the general populace these past few years since his fame exploded late in his career, dude gets away with everything others can't it seems. I don't know how he does it.

Maybe it's because he comes off as a genuine guy making a genuine apology for something that happened a long time ago?

Seems odd that you'd assume this is some kind of malicious sorcery. Feel free to never watch him again, but I wouldn't jump to the conclusion that the general public are a bunch of idiots for not begrudgingly sewering his career.

[Itse]

I also think it's important to keep a cool head here and keep in mind what every person is accused of individually, instead of lumping them all together as "a bunch of sexual predators". (Attracting as that is. considering how many accusations there are.)

[Sainters7]

For the record he's been my favourite comedian for over a decade, still love his work (mostly his older stuff before his fame exploded). I've just noticed over all that time he has an innate ability to say and do things that most could never get away with, yet he does.

I actually find he's gotten rather pompous the past couple years and has changed a lot from the stressed out everyman dad I first fell into comedy love with back in the day, actually thought these allegations would knock him back to earth a bit which I felt was probably needed. But it seems like he's going to successfully spin out of it, I'm just amazed at his continuous ability to get away with things that would sink most others.

[AFireInside]

Originally Posted by calgarybornnraised

I find it funny that a bunch of guys are debating how sexually violated a women should feel.

Alright everyone this is a great point, we should never discuss anything unless we have direct experience with something. Good news is we won't see Calgarybornnraised in the flames forum anymore. He has never played in the NHL so he can't debate and discuss it.

I find it funny that people still have idiotic thoughts like this. It's comments like this that make these conversations difficult.

Do you think no man has ever experienced something similar? Is that not possible? Is it not possible to have empathy? Is it impossible to imagine what victims feel like? Some people here live with victims of this kind of behaviour or may have experienced it themselves.

Second, a lot of the discussion is surrounding legalities. People can be treated badly and feel extremely violated and victimized. It doesn't mean anything illegal occurred. I don't think many here are saying that the victims feelings are invalid.

[Bootsy]

Originally Posted by Cole436

Considering how Takei has championed sexual assault awareness for years, this is the first allegation I have trouble taking at face value.

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/m.huffpo...7d2f37c8e8/amp

This Stern interview from a couple weeks ago doesn’t help his case much.

[Yamer]

I have no idea how this might be received, but I had this thought last night.

It really is a shame that when a star like Louis CK, Kevin Spacey, or Bill Cosby is accused of what they are that their entire catalogue - films, series, specials, etc. - are either pulled or completely neglected.

I grew up developing and learning lessons from the Cosby Show, as I'm sure many other have. And while I never really cared for House of Cards, Louie, or Lucky Louie, Louis CK's comedy was entertaining, and his self-deprecating humour actually made me look at myself in a different way. And the Usual Suspects is still an absolutely brilliant film regardless of Spacey's involvement.

There's no doubt that it would be awkwardly uncomfortable to watch any of those shows or specials now. Even so, does the monster in Bill Cosby completely pervert what was otherwise an entirely wholesome show?

This also leads to another sub-sect of victims: cast, crew, and collaborators on all of these projects. I know they would never want to diminish the true victims of these acts, but how terrible must it feel to have your work buried because some jack-ass couldn't do what everyone else was capable of doing: being a not ####ty human being?

I'm sure in some cases it's clear that certain people were complicit or did not step up for victims. However, I wonder if fear over having your work buried or having a show cancelled is what kept certain people from speaking out (if they knew)?

[Reggie Dunlop]

There's a lot of hockey team hazing rituals that could be categorized as sexual abuse.

[killer_carlson]

Reports now out that Gal Gadot has said she won't be part of a Wonder Woman sequel if Brett Ratner is involved as a producer.

Ratner's company was a producer in the first one.

I'd love to be a fly on the wall when a predator is informed he's on the other side of a power leverage imbalance involving a female.

Quite frankly I think it's fricken awesome that Gadot would take this stance.