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Old 07-01-2012, 04:37 PM   #2641
Cecil Terwilliger
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Well it's good to know that peteL is as much of an ignorant jack no matter which sport we're talking about.
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Old 07-01-2012, 05:23 PM   #2642
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I thought that was a great game until Italy went down to 10 men. Too bad it couldn't have been a closer game though.
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Old 07-01-2012, 07:07 PM   #2643
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some have all ready been mentioned but

50's Hungarians
70's Dutch
70's West Germany
early 70's Brazil
98-2000 France

Those are just teams that I have read about/watched and I am sure there are others, and I almost put in 2002 Brazil there as well

I would take all of those over this Spanish team
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Old 07-01-2012, 07:21 PM   #2644
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How about the 2000 Canada team. we beat Mexico and Colombia. and tied South Korea.
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Old 07-01-2012, 07:22 PM   #2645
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Quote:
Originally Posted by diane_phaneuf View Post
some have all ready been mentioned but

50's Hungarians
70's Dutch
70's West Germany
early 70's Brazil
98-2000 France

Those are just teams that I have read about/watched and I am sure there are others, and I almost put in 2002 Brazil there as well

I would take all of those over this Spanish team
You can late 70s Argentina and early 90's Italy to the list. having watched all but the Hungerians I can say that the game Spain plays would have beaten them all 9 times out of ten, possesion will trump offence almost every time.
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Old 07-01-2012, 07:46 PM   #2646
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You can late 70s Argentina and early 90's Italy to the list. having watched all but the Hungerians I can say that the game Spain plays would have beaten them all 9 times out of ten, possesion will trump offence almost every time.
Don't think the Spanish would get all the possession, and the one thing they have always lacked is an elite striker (unless you count Torres from 08 even though the rest of the side is better now)

I think in 10 years this is going to be looked back on as a time when they were first among mediocre, the Germans are too young, Brazil was too old at the last WC, England/France/Dutch had huge issues

there was no great team they had to go against and prove their worth
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Old 07-01-2012, 08:07 PM   #2647
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That first among mediocre may come off as the Spanish being mediocre, I didn't mean that, I meant that the rest of the teams around them were.

I would have loved to see them go against the last great French teams

Zizou, Deschamps, Viera, Henry, Thuram, Pires etc. that was a team
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Old 07-01-2012, 09:43 PM   #2648
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yeah that 98 and 2000 France team was crazy good.
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Old 07-01-2012, 09:56 PM   #2649
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yeah that 98 and 2000 France team was crazy good.
It was crazy good but also crazily inconsistant.
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Old 07-01-2012, 10:00 PM   #2650
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Quote:
Originally Posted by diane_phaneuf View Post
Don't think the Spanish would get all the possession, and the one thing they have always lacked is an elite striker (unless you count Torres from 08 even though the rest of the side is better now)

I think in 10 years this is going to be looked back on as a time when they were first among mediocre, the Germans are too young, Brazil was too old at the last WC, England/France/Dutch had huge issues

there was no great team they had to go against and prove their worth
While I would agree this year I think 4 years ago both Italy Portugal France and Brazil would all have been considered strong teams.
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Old 07-02-2012, 02:49 AM   #2651
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Cruijff's Oranje were the masters of possession football. They had wonderful playmakers and clinical finishers. The Total Football style that they played had a massive impact upon the way the game was played, even though they failed to bury they Germans in 1974. That was pure arrogance on their part, wanting to humiliate them and beat them. It backfired.

Hungarian tactics of a deep-lying CF and choosing players for the national side from a very small group of clubs (sound familiar) and the flexibility of having players able to play out of position (early Total Football) helped revolutionize the game. Puskas and Kocsis were an incredible 1-2 punch, scoring 160 goals in 152 games at the national level. Legends.

I guess one could argue whether winning a tournament or 2 is more significant than playing football that changes the way the game is played at a fundamental level and going undefeated against all comers for 6 years, home and away.

I'm not sure I know the answer to this.
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Old 07-02-2012, 12:56 PM   #2652
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Quote:
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Cruijff's Oranje were the masters of possession football. They had wonderful playmakers and clinical finishers. The Total Football style that they played had a massive impact upon the way the game was played, even though they failed to bury they Germans in 1974. That was pure arrogance on their part, wanting to humiliate them and beat them. It backfired.

Hungarian tactics of a deep-lying CF and choosing players for the national side from a very small group of clubs (sound familiar) and the flexibility of having players able to play out of position (early Total Football) helped revolutionize the game. Puskas and Kocsis were an incredible 1-2 punch, scoring 160 goals in 152 games at the national level. Legends.

I guess one could argue whether winning a tournament or 2 is more significant than playing football that changes the way the game is played at a fundamental level and going undefeated against all comers for 6 years, home and away.

I'm not sure I know the answer to this.
The counter arguement though would be that it is more of an acheivement to dominate playing against rivals that know and are clear how to handle what you are doing and yet you are so good at it they can't, both Holland and Hungery had a period where they were playing a game that their opposition, was, to a large degree was witless as to how to play against.
Spain isn't doing anything special tactically, nor are they relying on a Pele or Cruyff of exeptional talant, in fact unlike every other team mentioned, Spain is the best in the world without the best player, they are, as a team, just outplaying everyone.
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Old 07-02-2012, 01:07 PM   #2653
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I don't think Brazil from 94-02 gets enough love. Lest we forget they were a road game loss in the 98 Finals against another historically great team from winning three World Cups in a row. A top three of Rivaldo, Ronaldo and Ronaldinho is about as good as it gets.
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Old 07-02-2012, 01:12 PM   #2654
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Quote:
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I don't think Brazil from 94-02 gets enough love. Lest we forget they were a road game loss in the 98 Finals against another historically great team from winning three World Cups in a row. A top three of Rivaldo, Ronaldo and Ronaldinho is about as good as it gets.
Don't forget about Cafu and Roberto Carlos tearing down the wings. Those teams were like the anti-Spain. All forwards and wingers/fullbacks and no midfielders. Spain is all midfielders!
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Old 07-02-2012, 01:17 PM   #2655
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How could I forget Roberto Carlos? You need some balls (and likely won't have any) if you stand in front of one of his bombs.
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Old 07-02-2012, 02:21 PM   #2656
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Don't forget about Cafu and Roberto Carlos tearing down the wings. Those teams were like the anti-Spain. All forwards and wingers/fullbacks and no midfielders. Spain is all midfielders!
Thats just Brazilian football, no one wants to be a goalie or D, everyone wants to run with the ball and shoot.
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Old 07-02-2012, 07:30 PM   #2657
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classy by Iker, asks the ref to blow ft out of respect for italy

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Old 07-02-2012, 08:11 PM   #2658
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that's a classy guy. what a move.
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Old 07-03-2012, 09:37 AM   #2659
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Quote:
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there was no great team they had to go against and prove their worth
I disagree - the quality of teams around the world is higher now than it was in the 1950s to 1970s.

Surely, the fitness of players today is at a much higher level too.

Last edited by troutman; 07-03-2012 at 09:40 AM.
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Old 07-03-2012, 05:40 PM   #2660
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Quote:
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I don't think Brazil from 94-02 gets enough love. Lest we forget they were a road game loss in the 98 Finals against another historically great team from winning three World Cups in a row. A top three of Rivaldo, Ronaldo and Ronaldinho is about as good as it gets.
meh they couldn't even contain Eddie Berdusco
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