Matthew Tkachuk & Johnny Gaudreau Signing Watch Thread

[BlindMilwaukee]

Yeah I agree with everything you guys have said. Johnny gets my vote too. In a perfect world we move forward with all of Johnny, Chucky, and Mangi, but salary cap is a thing. If I was the GM I'd really look to first extend 13 then 88 and move Tkachuk.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by chedder

If we're talking 8 year deal I'd say you have to keep Tkachuk as he's 4 years younger. I think he has a better chance of maintaining his level of play throughout the contract. Johnny at age 35, 36 and 37 almost certainly won't he worth 10 million.

I agree if Tkachuk signs a 8 year deal he becomes the captain and it makes some sense.

Flip side is Johnny would likely be lost for nothing where Tkachuk brings in futures so keeping Johnny and getting picks/prospects for Tkachuk could be their best bet

[Knightslayer]

Originally Posted by chedder

If we're talking 8 year deal I'd say you have to keep Tkachuk as he's 4 years younger. I think he has a better chance of maintaining his level of play throughout the contract. Johnny at age 35, 36 and 37 almost certainly won't he worth 10 million.

Thing is I would actually be disappointed if Tkachuk maintained his level of play throughout the contract.

Does no one else see how bad he's been last 2 years?

[chedder]

Originally Posted by Knightslayer

Thing is I would actually be disappointed if Tkachuk maintained his level of play throughout the contract.



Does no one else see how bad he's been last 2 years?

Agree and think he's more likely the one that wants to head south. I was only looking at it from asset management side.

In a perfect world I'd way rather sign Johnny to a 5 or 6 year/10 million per deal but I don't think there's any way he's goes that short.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by chedder

If we're talking 8 year deal I'd say you have to keep Tkachuk as he's 4 years younger. I think he has a better chance of maintaining his level of play throughout the contract. Johnny at age 35, 36 and 37 almost certainly won't he worth 10 million.

Johnny has a better chance of being useful at the end of his deal than Tkachuk does.

What’s going to happen to cause his edgework and vision to decline?

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

They haven't been wrong yet either. That's the problem with your angle.

They have been wrong all along. They said Gaudreau would go straight to UFA from college, and they were wrong about that. They said he would demand a trade after his ELC, and they were wrong about that.

Do these things not count as ‘wrong’ in your language?

[Classic_Sniper]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

How does this team afford to lose Hanifin? They have a guy who was 8-9 on most depth charts playing top 4. Hanifin-Andersson-Taney are the only true top 4 D this team has. Right now Monahan is very overpaid for what he brings but I would say Hanifin has been a bargain the last season and this one

What were the big cap moving trades they missed out on that would have done wonders?

I’ve been putting Hanifin in my trade proposals for quite some time now because I always knew Kylington could replace him in a pinch. Now that Oliver has actually surpassed him (in my opinion), the. it makes Hanifin expendable. If Hanifin’s contract needs to be moved out in order to pay for Mangiapane and Kylington’s new contracts, then I have absolutely no problem shipping Noah out.

I get that people look at his age and his draft position and think “potential, potential, potential!” But all I see is a $5M player who can skate, but is vanilla in every other aspect of the game. With Gio gone, I figured the increased opportunity would actually elevate his offensive production, but that hasn’t happened at all. I don’t think his current 3 assists would be that hard to replace at all. There are plenty of left shot vanilla defensemen who can defend relatively well and will come at a fraction of the price in the open market.

[Knightslayer]

I agree. You trade Hanifin and get some assets and then use that money for difference makers.

[Jay Random]

So if Kylington replaces Hanifin, who replaces Kylington? Or are you just going to make him play 40 minutes a night?

[Heavy Jack]

I have to admit I’d look at shopping Hanifin too at this point, there’s nothing game breaking enough in what he brings that would make me disappointed to see him go. Solid defender who can eat minutes but it’s appearing more and more like that’s what his ceiling is and to me it’s only a matter of time before Kylington takes his PP time.

Shipping Hanifin and Monahan out also would give the flames a ton of flexibility to not only retain high end expiring talent (Gaudreau, Mangiapane, Tkachuk, Kylington, Vladar) but it might even allow them to pursue another top 6 forward and would certainly force the Flames to look at giving some of their ELC draft choices time vs league min or 1 mill contracts on the Pitlicks and Richardson’s of the league.

[The Fisher Account]

Two years ago, I would have said lock Chucky up long term.

After his last two seasons of play? Trade him at the deadline please.

[Heavy Jack]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

So if Kylington replaces Hanifin, who replaces Kylington? Or are you just going to make him play 40 minutes a night?

Valimaki slots back in which I would be totally fine with. We also have Stone and also Mackey who has shown well in the AHL and had a good showing late last year in the NHL. Lots of options and honestly as I type them out it is becoming increasingly clearer to me that Hanifin is expendable.

What teams are needing a top 4 minutes eating LD right now?

Any chance Vancouver would consider Hanifin for Miller?

Vancouver has been hot garbage on the backend and didn’t Hanifin play considerable minutes with Hamonic? Not insinuating Hanifin for Miller is a fair trade as that would be a fleecing but Dim Jim is talking live right now and sounds incredibly desperate and still thinks his club is a playoff contender.

Maybe he covets stability at D which Hanifin could probably help provide.

[Knightslayer]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

So if Kylington replaces Hanifin, who replaces Kylington? Or are you just going to make him play 40 minutes a night?

They'll find someone. 31 teams in the league ice 6 defenceman or more a game and Hanifin isn't one of them.

Flames will have no problem icing 6 defenceman without Hanifin. Same way we replaced Fleury, Iginla, Giordano, Bouwmeester. Every player gets replaced and most of the time you barely notice.

[Knightslayer]

Carolina just added a defenceman for free who I think provides much more than Hanifin does.

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by Heavy Jack

I have to admit I’d look at shopping Hanifin too at this point, there’s nothing game breaking enough in what he brings that would make me disappointed to see him go. Solid defender who can eat minutes but it’s appearing more and more like that’s what his ceiling is and to me it’s only a matter of time before Kylington takes his PP time.

Shipping Hanifin and Monahan out also would give the flames a ton of flexibility to not only retain high end expiring talent (Gaudreau, Mangiapane, Tkachuk, Kylington, Vladar) but it might even allow them to pursue another top 6 forward and would certainly force the Flames to look at giving some of their ELC draft choices time vs league min or 1 mill contracts on the Pitlicks and Richardson’s of the league.

I agree. Hanifin just doesn't seem to have the offensive instincts that match his skill set. Maybe he will figure it out one day but when it comes to managing the cap and if someone has to go he should be an option as he only has 2 years left after this year and is unlikely to resign for less than $5 per next contract. Lindholm will be getting a huge raise that year too

I'd keep Hanifin if we can move Monahan or Backlund or both though. If you look at who is coming that can most likely replace vets it's Zary, Coronato and Pelletier. If Coleman and Dube or Zary play center it might make the most sense. Just not sure of Monahan and Johnny being so close changes Johnny's plans to re-sign here if Monahan is traded.

Lucic is only 1 year away from being off the books too. Monahan as well. If the Flames can figure out this summer the following summer looks very positive when it comes to cap space.

If Tkachuk doesn't want to sign long term then he needs to go. IMO he's been the 3rd best player on his line and would probably bring back a quality return.

If Kylington, Mangiapane, Johnny and Tkachuk all sign for 5 or more years you need to keep all 4. I'm still hopeful that the total cap hit for the 4 is less than some suggest and comes in under $28 total for the 4 of them. I still think Johnny will take less than some are suggesting he gets if he gets the 8 year deal

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by Knightslayer

Flames will have no problem icing 6 defenceman without Hanifin. Same way we replaced Fleury, Iginla, Giordano, Bouwmeester. Every player gets replaced and most of the time you barely notice.

They'll have no problem as long as they're willing to ice a bad defenceman. The question is who is going to take Hanifin's place in the top 4. There are no plausible candidates in the system right now, which means they would have to use assets to acquire someone… which pretty much takes away the whole point of trading Hanifin for assets in the first place.

When Fleury left the team, there was nothing left but Young Guns. Seven years in a row out of the playoffs, terrible hockey, and the team almost went broke. When Iginla and Bouwmeester left, there was a full-on rebuild. It's ridiculous to say that their departures were ‘barely noticed’.

[Heavy Jack]

Originally Posted by Knightslayer

Carolina just added a defenceman for free who I think provides much more than Hanifin does.

Well of course he does Tony has always had amazing offensive instinct but he did only sign a 1 year 1 mill deal for a reason with all the negative attention he had gotten from his time in NYR and over social media and that can’t be understated.

It’s looking like a solid choice for Carolina right now though no doubt with 3 goals and 14 points through 14 games. Still don’t know if I’d like him on the Flames though just from the distraction and debates it would bring in pretty much every thread if the discussion turned to him.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Knightslayer

Thing is I would actually be disappointed if Tkachuk maintained his level of play throughout the contract.

Does no one else see how bad he's been last 2 years?

Bad is not the right phrase here.

He's been above average but not a gamebreaker. And for $9M on a long term extension you want to make sure you are getting a gamebreaker.

Originally Posted by Knightslayer

They'll find someone. 31 teams in the league ice 6 defenceman or more a game and Hanifin isn't one of them.

Flames will have no problem icing 6 defenceman without Hanifin. Same way we replaced Fleury, Iginla, Giordano, Bouwmeester. Every player gets replaced and most of the time you barely notice.

You only move Hanifin for a good return. Maybe he's not a gamebreaker but for $4.95M he doesn't have to be.

And since the start of the 19/20 season he's first among our dmen in 5v5 goals, second in 5v5 points, and has a 51.8% xGF percentage on the ice.

His performance is fine for his salary, even if he never really lives up to his draft potential. Maybe not that flashy, but doesn't have to be.

[Heavy Jack]

^^ still though for a guy who is getting as much PP time as he’s getting you’d want to see more than 3 assists out of him. Hanifin always leaves me wanting more even though I like many elements of what he brings. I’ve always felt like his skating ability is wasted as he doesn’t have the offensive flare and instinct to turn it into consistent offence.

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

They'll have no problem as long as they're willing to ice a bad defenceman. The question is who is going to take Hanifin's place in the top 4. There are no plausible candidates in the system right now, which means they would have to use assets to acquire someone… which pretty much takes away the whole point of trading Hanifin for assets in the first place.

When Fleury left the team, there was nothing left but Young Guns. Seven years in a row out of the playoffs, terrible hockey, and the team almost went broke. When Iginla and Bouwmeester left, there was a full-on rebuild. It's ridiculous to say that their departures were ‘barely noticed’.

Kind of like no way we were replacing Gio with this years bad d core and now we actually look like we have a better d core than last year?

I wouldn't completely give up on Valimaki either.

IMO Monahan or Backlund rank ahead of Hanifin for cap dumps.

Also think if this team is good enough they could trade a pick to dump Lucic next summer. Arizona would be game I'm sure. Lucic is a good leader for a young team. This might be option #1 if the pick is less than a first