[News] Flames buyout Michael Stone's contract after clearing waivers

[zuluking]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Of course we would. But not because Treliving is actually terrible at his job. Most of the stuff in the E=NG thread is so over the top that it is obvious satire and humour. It is often difficult to distinguish the difference between hilarity and reality because Edmonton is in fact THAT bad, so deploying the old "if it was the Oilers" trope as some sort of defense for the legitimacy of your opinion is completely moot.

Thanked solely on the merit of the appropriate usage and spelling of "moot".

[Heavy Jack]

I feel like Kylington would excel playing with Giordano in the same type of role that Brodie was; he’s in mad shape, he is a very good skater/puck mover and he is definitely ready to start taking reps at the NHL level but there is a log jam on the left side of Defence.

What I’m hoping for is for Brodie and possibly Jankowski being packaged for a solid RW option with Frolik being dealt for picks to open up the rest of the cap space for Tkachuk and Mangiapane.

Brodie + Jankowski for a Gallagher or Toffoli type player

Frolik for a pick or picks depending

Sign Tkachuk and Mangiapane

Gaudreau - Monahan - Lindholm
Tkachuk - Backlund - Gallagher/Toffoli
Lucic - Ryan - Bennett
Mangiapane - Dube - Czarnik
Quine

Giordano - Kylington
Hanifin - Hamonic
Valimaki - Andersson
Yelesin

Rittich
Talbot

[CsInMyBlood]

Originally Posted by AC

Weird, I disagree.

The Flames as a whole looked bad, but Hamonic looked like a rock out there to me.

26 blocks in 5 games, which is insane. He was especially solid on the PK despite the Colorado onslaught.

While he finished -4, looking at the goals it was a lot of bad luck or bad coverage by the forwards.

Game 2 tying goal: bad flubbed pass that bounces off his skate.
Game 3: Backlund blew his coverage on Makar's goal.
Game 4: Hamonic didn't look great on Compher's goal.
Game 4: OT goal was on Backlund and Neal.
Game 5: A shot hit Hamonic in the face, then Rantanen banks the puck off Smith from behind the net.

Uhhhh. Colorado scored 17 goals in the series. Hamonic was on the ice for 10 of them. 26 blocks, just like Kris Russell, backing in and standing around. I've never seen a player deflect more pucks past his goalie than Travis Hamonic.

His advanced stats were some of the worst on the team.

This misconception that Hamonic is some great physical asset is also totally false. I keep hearing this. Also the term "Warrior" thrown his way. Its simply way off base.

Put it this way, the Flames are getting run over in the series and our "physical" defenseman Travis Hamonic throws 4 hits all series. FOUR hits total in 5 games. Yes, thats correct both tough guy Sean Monahan (5)and big bad Johnny Gaudreau (5) each threw more hits than Travis Hamonic in that series. Simply pathetic.

He wont fight anymore after getting his face broken which is understandable. So whats the point of having this physical defenseman that is not physical?

Obvious to me the game is passing him by. Re-signing him would be an epic mistake with what we have waiting in the wings.

The guy needs to get dealt while we can still get something for him.

[AC]

I guess we'll just have to disagree.

I think in a series where the whole team was drowning, and were dominated for the vast majority of it, the top defenders will have bad stats. Of course as one of the 2 shutdown D, he didn't get the job done. But I think relative to the terrible team defense, especially when trying to handle Colorado's speed, he didn't look bad individually.

All I know is in the 5 game series Hamonic made virtually all of the team's good defensive plays... breaking up 2 on 1s and blocking point blank MacKinnon one timers on the PP with his back. I'd say we won Game 1 on the backs of Tkachuk, Smith, and Hamonic.

[GioforPM]

Yes. When Peters could manage it Hamonic was up against the toughest competition.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

I've watched Hamonic for a long time and I'll just say this.

That 5 game playoff series was NOT representative of his body of work. He's simply not that player. In fact, none of our players played like they could during that playoff series.

I don't exactly know what happened. It seemed to be something mental that affected the entire team.

Whatever the reason, I'm not about to throw Hamonic out the door, just like I'm not about to throw Gaudreau out the door. Doing so based on a 5 game sample would be ####ing stupid. You look at what they do all year long, and from year to year.

Hamonic is only going somewhere if it's a good deal. Brodie is only going somewhere if it's a good deal. Brad likes good defensemen too much to give them up for scraps.

[KootenayFlamesFan]

The entire team was garbage in the playoffs (besides Smith), but Hamonic in the regular season was excellent far more often than not. You don't trade him unless it's a no-brainer. In reality, he's probably not going anywhere, which is fine with me.

[David Struch]

I could see Hamonic being dealt for a top 6 forward.. the Flames would need to add some physicality to the 5 and 6 bottom pairing positions though. (a couple of Engelland types)

[Sylvanfan]

The lesson to learn here is how impactful contract terms are. Stone for 1 or even 2 years was fine. In fact 9 million over 2 years would have hurt less than having that extra year.

I think the Flames need to prepare to go into next season without both Brodie and Hamonic. Slot what they have in the top 5 and don't pay a premium salary or a term of more than 3 years to keep the other one. There is a market shift happening where you can get a veteran guy in the offseason on a short term deal. Its becoming a bit like the NFL in that way.

I think Hamonic is tougher to replace off the ice and in the room. But in an analytic driven league its these traits that seem to consistently get over appraised and result in bad contracts. I respect Hamonic a lot....but if he can be traded for a top 6 winger and the money can work I think you make that move because whoever signs him to his next contract might find themselves in a cap bind in two years.

[VladtheImpaler]

Let me put this out there - I would rather have Engelland than Hamonic. I prefer to slot the "intangibles/toughness" on the 3rd pairing, and Engelland brings a whole lot more intimidation/bite than Hamonic. I would say Hamonic is a better skater, but otherwise there is not much to separate them offensively or defensively. With Hamonic I think you wind up overpaying for the intangibles and giving him too much ice time. I think it was a bad trade to start with and they would have been better off with Engelland or some facsimile thereof at a lower price...

[Enoch Root]

Hamonic is a better defenseman than Engelland, and I like Engelland.

IMO, Hamonic is probably the most underrated player on the roster currently.

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Hamonic is a better defenseman than Engelland, and I like Engelland.

IMO, Hamonic is probably the most underrated player on the roster currently.

I like Hammer too but I think they shouldn't re-sign him. I think he'll get 5 or 6 years and won't age well. He already doesn't look as good as his Islander days.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by VladtheImpaler

Let me put this out there - I would rather have Engelland than Hamonic. I prefer to slot the "intangibles/toughness" on the 3rd pairing, and Engelland brings a whole lot more intimidation/bite than Hamonic. I would say Hamonic is a better skater, but otherwise there is not much to separate them offensively or defensively. With Hamonic I think you wind up overpaying for the intangibles and giving him too much ice time. I think it was a bad trade to start with and they would have been better off with Engelland or some facsimile thereof at a lower price...

Yep Engelland at these cheap 1 year deals he is signing + keeping the Hamonic picks is > Hamonic.

Unfortunately I don’t think keeping Engelland was an option. Yes he could have been re-signed and protected but I don’t think he would have signed here with Vegas on the horizon.

I’m with you in the Hamonic overpay department. But I also thought we would have capitalized on all this quality D depth by now.

[jlh2640]

Liked the player, not at that salary and there isnt room anymore

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by VladtheImpaler

Let me put this out there - I would rather have Engelland than Hamonic. I prefer to slot the "intangibles/toughness" on the 3rd pairing, and Engelland brings a whole lot more intimidation/bite than Hamonic. I would say Hamonic is a better skater, but otherwise there is not much to separate them offensively or defensively. With Hamonic I think you wind up overpaying for the intangibles and giving him too much ice time. I think it was a bad trade to start with and they would have been better off with Engelland or some facsimile thereof at a lower price...

Hamonic is terrific at positioning, puck retrieval and a nice, safe, effective pass out of the zone. That's what makes him a good defensive defenceman, not toughness, and that's why he gets paid more. Engelland is OK at puck retrieval, but a terrible first passer. He tends to give up possession with a blind ring around.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Hamonic is terrific at positioning

His neutral zone positioning is far from terrific, he is one of the easiest entries against in the NHL. And that will only get worse into his next contract as he loses a step.

I'm fine with keeping him around for a year as Andersson still has his own questionmarks, but extending him will be doomed to fail.

He is however a good bit better than Engelland, but that isn't the high bar this fanbase pretends it is.

[djsFlames]

Shipping out Brodie and Hamonic isn't smart if you're not bringing in a solid vet D to fill one of those roles.

I'd lean towards not re-signing either of them if they stayed for this season though. But you have three NHL caliber kids, Gio and Hanifin then. If they can bring in a more ideal fit for the blue line for after this season then I hope they do.

If we had cap space you could make a pitch for Gardiner and shop our guys but alas we're short on spare change.

[David Struch]

Another possibility we haven't discussed is trading Hanifin (for a core 1st line RW) and re-signing one or both of Brodie and Hamonic.

Gaudreau - Monahan - (RW)
Tkachuk - Backlund - Lindholm
Lucic - Ryan - Bennett
Mangiapane - Dube - Czarnik

Giordano - Brodie
Kylington - Hamonic
Valimaki - Andersson
Yelesin

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by David Struch

Another possibility we haven't discussed is trading Hanifin (for a core 1st line RW) and re-signing one or both of Brodie and Hamonic.

Gaudreau - Monahan - (RW)
Tkachuk - Backlund - Lindholm
Lucic - Ryan - Bennett
Mangiapane - Dube - Czarnik

Giordano - Brodie
Kylington - Hamonic
Valimaki - Andersson
Yelesin

Your core first line RWer probably needs to make equal or less than Hanifin given the cap situation.

That would also likely improve the expansion draft situation.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

His neutral zone positioning is far from terrific, he is one of the easiest entries against in the NHL. And that will only get worse into his next contract as he loses a step.

I'm fine with keeping him around for a year as Andersson still has his own questionmarks, but extending him will be doomed to fail.

He is however a good bit better than Engelland, but that isn't the high bar this fanbase pretends it is.

His D zone play is great. He has to be a little easier zone entry because his speed isn't top notch, so he can't play as tight in the neutral zone. He's still probably at least the second best defensive defenceman on the team. Subtract him and who is it.