Last thing on the checklist - Sign Monahan and Gaudreau

[JerryUnderscore]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Re: highly valuable endorsement deals in large American markets. Is this really true? Does Doughty make big endorsement money in LA? Tavares in NY? It's an honest question but I rather doubt it personally. I think those guys are pretty invisible in their cities.

Okay, I think it's time we put this whole endorsement deal conversation to bed. Endorsements deals don't impact hockey players the same way they impact the bigger sports like basketball and football.

According to this article in Forbes, this is a list of the top 10 highest paid hockey players last year:

1. Sidney Crosby: $12.0M Salary + $4.5M Endorsements ($16.5M)
2. Jonathan Toews: $13.8 Salary + $2.2M Endorsements ($16.0M)
3. Patrick Kane: $13.8M Salary + $900k Endorsements ($14.7M)
4. Shea Weber: $14.0M Salary + $100k Endorsements ($14.1M)
5. Alex Ovechkin: $$10.0M Salary + $3.0M Endorsements ($13.0M)
6. Henrik Lundqvist: $10.0M Salary + $800k Endorsements ($10.8M)
7. Evgeni Malkin: $9.5M Salary + $350k Endorsements ($9.85M)
8. Eric Staal: $9.5M Salary + $250k Endorsements ($9.75M)
8. Zach Parise: $9.0M Salary + $750k Endorsement ($9.75M)
10. Ryan Getzlaf: $9.25M Salary + $150k Endorsements ($9.4M)


There's also this article from Opendorse.com that lists the top 12 highest endorsed players in the league. It's a couple years old, but I think the idea still transfers.

1. Sidney Crosby: $4.5M
2. Alex Ovechkin: $3.5M
3. Steven Stamkos: $1.7M
4. Jonathan Toews: $1.2M
5. Zach Parise: $800k
6. Jarome Iginla: $750k
7. Brad Richards: $600k
8. Zdeno Chara: $500k
9. Evgeni Malkin: $400k
10: Vincent Lecavalier: $250k
11: Eric Staal: $250k
12: Rick Nash: $150k

There are reports that Conor McDavid signed a $1M endorsement deal with CCM at the draft combine last year, which would put him up there as well.

All of this tells us a couple things:

1. Endorsements do not make up a statistically significant portion of most players overall income. (Conor McDavid would be the one exception, only because he's still on his ELC).

2. If you read the linked articles, it seems like most of this endorsement money is coming from things like CCM, Sportchek, Adidas, Reebok, Gillette, etc. The odds of Gaudreau or Monahan making $500k in a local endorsement deal (i.e., a Philly car dealership or Boston restaurant) is virtual zero.


All of that leads me to believe that any player would be ludicrous to base their location decision on what kind of local endorsements they could receive. If either Gaudreau or Monahan are going to get any kind of endorsement deals, they will most like be global deals, not local. There is no evidence to support the idea that either player wants to move down to the States in order to get a bigger endorsement deal.

They will sign in Calgary. When they do, it will be for big money, long-term deals. The sky is not falling and everyone can relax.

[JJsChaos]

Sean and Johnny seem pretty tight. Do you think they're discussing their offers from the team with each other? Do you think they want to be paid similar term and AAV?

I'm thinking the Flames have them 1 - 1.5 million AAV apart.

[jaikorven]

Originally Posted by JJsChaos

Sean and Johnny seem pretty tight. Do you think they're discussing their offers from the team with each other? Do you think they want to be paid similar term and AAV?

I'm thinking the Flames have them 1 - 1.5 million AAV apart.

I suspect they are talking, as this is what all people do when reviewing offers, they discuss with their friends and family. I don't expect that they are truly looking for identical offers though. They know one of them brings more offense than the other. Term could be what they want to match though.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Re: highly valuable endorsement deals in large American markets. Is this really true? Does Doughty make big endorsement money in LA? Tavares in NY? It's an honest question but I rather doubt it personally. I think those guys are pretty invisible in their cities.

This was specifically the point I was trying to make, albeit poorly. There is NO EVIDENCE of any correlation between the value of endorsement deals and local markets. Ricardo had suggested that since Gaudreau is an American he stands to make huge monies in endorsement deals so long as he plays in a large US market. This idea is patently false, and one of the reasons being that hockey players are simply not very high profile athletes in the US. This is why many of the highest endorsement contracts to NHL players are offered by Canadian and multi-national companies.

[dabrit]

Originally Posted by jaikorven

I suspect they are talking, as this is what all people do when reviewing offers, they discuss with their friends and family. I don't expect that they are truly looking for identical offers though. They know one of them brings more offense than the other. Term could be what they want to match though.

I worry that Gaudreau is pushing for a 5 year contract so that he can walk away as a UFA and that perhaps is what is holding things up. the Flames want longer term, Gaudreau just isn't sure he wants to play for the Flames once he becomes a UFA.

Here's hoping that Johnny meets a nice local Calgarian girl and stays put....Who want's to pimp out a girl to Johnny??

[JerryUnderscore]

Originally Posted by dabrit

I worry that Gaudreau is pushing for a 5 year contract so that he can walk away as a UFA and that perhaps is what is holding things up.

Why is this a worry? When he signed with the Flames, he was 1 NCAA year away from becoming a free agent and choosing where to play.

If someone doesn't want to play in a city, they don't sign an ELC and then bank on negotiating a 5 year deal so as to become a free agent as soon as possible. They would pull a Justin Schultz or Jimmy Vesey and bypass ever signing with that city in the first place.

Furthermore, where would Gaudreau rather play? He's a great player, but would he be the #1 LW on every other team? Also, he's competitive as all get out, so he wouldn't want to go to a team that's on the cusp of winning, just to ride their coattails. He wants to win and he wants to be the player to make it happen.

Calgary is a good young team on the rise with a decent front office. Why wouldn't he want to continue here? He'll get term, money and a good team to play with.

[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

Originally Posted by dabrit

I worry that Gaudreau is pushing for a 5 year contract so that he can walk away as a UFA and that perhaps is what is holding things up. the Flames want longer term, Gaudreau just isn't sure he wants to play for the Flames once he becomes a UFA.

Here's hoping that Johnny meets a nice local Calgarian girl and stays put....Who want's to pimp out a girl to Johnny??

5 years is a lifetime in hockey terms, way too far off in the future, so much can change. Johnny could sign an 8 year deal, but if he wants to leave in 5 years time, his 8 year deal isn't going to stop him, he'll just let the team know and force a trade. In the same breath, if he signs a 5 year deal and he never wants to leave he sign an extension (assuming the team wants him back).

Truth is, no matter what is going through his head, managements heads, and our heads right now, none of us know how we are going to feel about this in 5 years, so why worry? Any decisions made now based on 5 years from now likely won't be the exact same when that time arrives.

[Stay Golden]

I think what is holding this up is that the Flames have 15m in capspace and Johnny and Monahan probably want 7.2-7.5 based on what the recent signings have been.
The Flames do not want to be right up against the cap wall. 6m deals each still allow the Flames 2m space to operate for the season.
Also with Meehan being Monahan's agent he is not known to give into a teams cap when it comes to his star clients.
Further reason why Wideman and his 5.25 m has to go.

[JerryUnderscore]

Originally Posted by Stay Golden

I think what is holding this up is that the Flames have 15m in capspace and Johnny and Monahan probably want 7.2-7.5 based on what the recent signings have been.
The Flames do not want to be right up against the cap wall. 6m deals each still allow the Flames 2m space to operate for the season.
Also with Meehan being Monahan's agent he is not known to give into a teams cap when it comes to his star clients.
Further reason why Wideman and his 5.25 m has to go.

What Monahan comparables have signed deals for that price?

Tarasenko is a good comparable for Gaudreau and I wouldn't be shocked to see him land in that range. But there's virtually no way Monahan makes that much.

[Justin]

I'm living in Newfoundland and unfortunately I can't get the local rumours on Johnny and Monahan's contracts.

What's all the water cooler talk in Calgary these days about said topic? I've tried searching Google News but really can't find any articles or speculation on it.

[blender]

Originally Posted by Justin

I'm living in Newfoundland and unfortunately I can't get the local rumours on Johnny and Monahan's contracts.

What's all the water cooler talk in Calgary these days about said topic? I've tried searching Google News but really can't find any articles or speculation on it.

It's all here in this thread:
Sky is falling, Johnny and Sean hate Calgary, it's Wideman's fault, time to scoop out each other's brains...

[saillias]

Originally Posted by Justin

I'm living in Newfoundland and unfortunately I can't get the local rumours on Johnny and Monahan's contracts.

What's all the water cooler talk in Calgary these days about said topic? I've tried searching Google News but really can't find any articles or speculation on it.

There's really nothing. We're all in the dark

[Justin]

Originally Posted by saillias

There's really nothing. We're all in the dark

Thanks!

I started reading through this thread, and then it went off the rails a bit and got off topic.

[Moneyhands23]

Originally Posted by blender

It's all here in this thread:
Sky is falling, Johnny and Sean hate Calgary, it's Wideman's fault, time to scoop out each other's brains...

Hahaha! Best post in the thread!

Can't wait until both guys sign their 7/8 year deals at reasonable numbers! ☺

[sureLoss]

Originally Posted by sureLoss

Gaudreau makes an appearance at Hartley's hockey camp:

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=1086869291356234

FWIW both Gaudreau and Hartley wearing Flames gear

And Sean Monahan makes an appearance at Hartley's camp today

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=1088081787901651

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=1088085401234623

[StrykerSteve]

I'm convinced Hartley has gotten Money and Johnny to sit out until Hartley is reinstated as head coach.

[schooner]

Originally Posted by StrykerSteve

I'm convinced Hartley has gotten Money and Johnny to sit out until Hartley is reinstated as head coach.

Hartley to be named new coach in Vegas. Sean and Johnny sit out to force a trade to Vegas to rejoin their former coach and continue their party lifestyle.

[dabrit]

So this is maybe slightly off topic but still circles back to the topic of Gaudreau's contract. See attached link for Johnny Gaudreau's Report card for the 2015-2016 from the Matchsticks and Gasoline site one of the writers thinks the Flames may only sign Gaudreau to a short term contract....come on really why would they do that when the guy has clearly shown he is our best player and top 10 player in the NHL?

http://www.matchsticksandgasoline.co...ohnny-gaudreau

[bigrangy]

^If Johnny thinks he can be the best player in the NHL, why would he want to get paid like he's only a top 10 player? He'd want a 1 or 2 year deal to prove he's elite, then get 10 million over 8 years instead of 7.5 like he will based on his current body of work. That's an extra ~20 million if he thinks he's good enough.

[JerryUnderscore]

Originally Posted by dabrit

So this is maybe slightly off topic but still circles back to the topic of Gaudreau's contract. See attached link for Johnny Gaudreau's Report card for the 2015-2016 from the Matchsticks and Gasoline site one of the writers thinks the Flames may only sign Gaudreau to a short term contract....come on really why would they do that when the guy has clearly shown he is our best player and top 10 player in the NHL?

http://www.matchsticksandgasoline.co...ohnny-gaudreau

The question marks have always been around Johnny's ability to make it "at the next level" due to his size. However, at every level he's proved them wrong and absolutely crushed it.

The last question was, "Can his game translate to the NHL?" During his rookie season he may have caught other teams off guard, but everyone knew who he was this last season.

After two successful seasons, it's clear to everyone that Johnny Gaudreau can play in the NHL.

The only bit that could be potentially worrisome is the drastic difference in his home and away point totals. However, I doubt that's cause for much alarm. Most players slump their sophomore season. Johnny only "slumped" away from the Dome. He's still learning and growing and will probably be more dominant on the road this coming season than he was last season.

Edit: After posting, I realized I didn't actually directly respond to the text I quoted. There's no reason for Gaudreau or the Flames to be interested in a short term bridge deal. Those deals generally happen because either the team doesn't believe the past success will be repeated or the player believes their long term deal is low balling their true talent.

Neither of those seem to be the case here. Both sides know that Gaudreau will be a big, consistent point producer.