Yeah they didn't go into much detail while it was happening and it's really unclear exactly what happened. Admittedly it was poorly executed.
From what I can gather on a quick rewatch was:
1) M locks O in their room and start a fire at the entrance
2) O escapes through some sort of hatch and proceeds through a tunnel
3) At the end of the tunnel she reaches some sort of reactor room?
4) M is now in the reactor room and there is an explosion (maybe she did something to cause the reactor to explode?)
5) They have some pretty poor dialog lol then they both fall but the Jedi is able catch O
6) They run into another area and there is debris lying everywhere along with all the dead witches
7) They enter another room, more debris and the dead mother
Spoiler!
I'm going to assume that the powerful person we see at the end of the first episode who is guiding Mae is the other witch mother who looks to be the same species as Maul. Never saw her body specifically I don't think.
Yeah, I assumed there's something more going on there. Especially as they made a point of that loud gasp from the people dying. That whole scene was very bizarre. The direction and writing seemed very amateurish. Like something out of a children's adventure movie from the 80s. Maybe they were aiming for that kind of style?
Leslye Headland seems to be a pretty accomplished writer and director. She, however, has zero experience with action and sci-fi before this.
"Hello Mr. Emperor...I'm your local OHSA Rep. So. I've toured your 'Death Star' and I have some notes. Open pits are a concern, the blatant and almost preposterous lack of railings? Thats something we have to talk about.
Are you aware that you have an entirely open reactor core? Its just...its just right there...anything could happen! You get a torpedo in there? This place is history!
I'm not even going to get into Trash Compactor safety protocols! Thats just nonsense what you've got going on there!
And have you seen the horrific dangers of basic tractor beam maintenance? You have to climb on some tiny ledge to operate the equipment! We need to have words with your engineers.
Now. Lets talk about 'Forest Moon Installations' because it seems to us as though they have some flaws as well. You just rock an AT-AT right up to them and think thats totally fine? I saw that one with the 'Disabled Parking Pass' and I also saw that you do not have adequate Disabled Parking!
Somebody explain to me the moving death forcefields in TPM.
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To be fair, the death star was apparently so well built that its only weakness was a single exhaust vent. That's kind of dumb and clearly a plot device.
A group of ancient and force sensitive witches being unable to deal with a fire, without a single survivor, is kind of dumb on a whole other level.
Also, why are there so many witches in Star Wars all of a sudden? I've never read the expanded materials, is that a major thing there?
I'm guessing that these witches are con artists with a bunch of flibber flabbery phony thread tricks.
Quick pretend to block my thread push, the rubes love it.
Meanwhile Kaanan who was not a fully trained Jedi Knight in Rebels is holding off a wall of flame from a exploding fuel tank that's he's standing on top of.
Or Star Killer pulling a Star Destroyer out of the sky.
These dudes would laugh at a little fire.
I expect that none of those witches were burned to death, but during a meeting with the Jedi one of them said a snarky "Nice robes", and it was on like donkey kong because the Jedi seem to be fashion conscious.
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My name is Ozymandias, King of Kings;
Episode 4 was a lot better then what I would kindly call last weeks awful episode. There are still some moments of just awful dialogue and pacing.
Spoiler!
Mae doing the about face, I quit, I don't want to do this anymore, was just really bizarre. And then she hangs Qimir in a tree and runs off to surrender, and threatens basically the secrecy of the Sith Order.
They've completely thrown powder into the Sith and the Darkside since Disney took over.
Remember Yoda lecturing Luke about the Darkside, and how once you go down its path, forever will it dominate your destiny, or something like that. Therefore when Luke redeemed Vader, it felt special.
Now we look at it, everyone who joins the Darkside is redeemed, I'm surprised they didn't redeem Palapatine. But now Mae was willing to give up her bargain and redeem herself joining Ben Solo, Reva, Ventress and Offee. I wish they would do something different here, and have Mae have some regrets but continue to break her chains, and follow her Master. Instead its just cliched.
In terms of Qimir and the theory that he's the master. He says little things that hint at it. Like he's never seen the Master's face.
But I have a theory, Qimir is not the Master. He is the apprentice.
If you look at legends Darth Tenebrous was a Sith Lord and Master around this time, and of course he had his apprentice Darth Plagueis, who would eventually become the master of Darth Sidious. Of course the rule of two being what it was, Tenebrous had trained a secret apprentice In Darth Venamis as he feared that Plageius was a failure.
So here's my theory, There is a Sith Master out there, it could be Darth Tenebrous or something else. There could be an apprentice out there, also extremely powerful, and that would be Darth Plageuis.
This Sith Lord, that has been manipulating Mae, as Qimir who's a little too erratic and clumsy, is a secret Apprentice. A Benamis so to speak.
The Jedi seem to be able to make up excuses for their murderous nature. Its easy to slay something or someone, and say "Lets celebrate his or her or it becoming one with the Force".
We saw the hint of what's to come with the Jedi. When Vernestra wanting to keep secrets from the High Council for political reasons. The Jedi moving away from the will of the Force for real world concerns is what got them their death Penalty 100 years later.
Cameo alert, Ki-Adi-Mundi makes an appearance.
You can see the Jedi arrogance, when they're looking at Mae, and she's not well trained and weak according to the Jedi, and would lead to their defeat 100 years later.
What's with the run time of 30 minutes on this one.
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My name is Ozymandias, King of Kings;
Episode 4 was a lot better then what I would kindly call last weeks awful episode. There are still some moments of just awful dialogue and pacing.
Spoiler!
Mae doing the about face, I quit, I don't want to do this anymore, was just really bizarre. And then she hangs Qimir in a tree and runs off to surrender, and threatens basically the secrecy of the Sith Order.
They've completely thrown powder into the Sith and the Darkside since Disney took over.
Remember Yoda lecturing Luke about the Darkside, and how once you go down its path, forever will it dominate your destiny, or something like that. Therefore when Luke redeemed Vader, it felt special.
Now we look at it, everyone who joins the Darkside is redeemed, I'm surprised they didn't redeem Palapatine. But now Mae was willing to give up her bargain and redeem herself joining Ben Solo, Reva, Ventress and Offee. I wish they would do something different here, and have Mae have some regrets but continue to break her chains, and follow her Master. Instead its just cliched.
In terms of Qimir and the theory that he's the master. He says little things that hint at it. Like he's never seen the Master's face.
But I have a theory, Qimir is not the Master. He is the apprentice.
If you look at legends Darth Tenebrous was a Sith Lord and Master around this time, and of course he had his apprentice Darth Plagueis, who would eventually become the master of Darth Sidious. Of course the rule of two being what it was, Tenebrous had trained a secret apprentice In Darth Venamis as he feared that Plageius was a failure.
So here's my theory, There is a Sith Master out there, it could be Darth Tenebrous or something else. There could be an apprentice out there, also extremely powerful, and that would be Darth Plageuis.
This Sith Lord, that has been manipulating Mae, as Qimir who's a little too erratic and clumsy, is a secret Apprentice. A Benamis so to speak.
The Jedi seem to be able to make up excuses for their murderous nature. Its easy to slay something or someone, and say "Lets celebrate his or her or it becoming one with the Force".
We saw the hint of what's to come with the Jedi. When Vernestra wanting to keep secrets from the High Council for political reasons. The Jedi moving away from the will of the Force for real world concerns is what got them their death Penalty 100 years later.
Cameo alert, Ki-Adi-Mundi makes an appearance.
You can see the Jedi arrogance, when they're looking at Mae, and she's not well trained and weak according to the Jedi, and would lead to their defeat 100 years later.
What's with the run time of 30 minutes on this one.
Spoiler!
was that him? or just another of his species?
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Originally Posted by Locke
Thats why Flames fans make ideal Star Trek fans. We've really been taught to embrace the self-loathing and extreme criticism.
My hot take is that this show is perfectly fine Star Wars. there's been better, there's been worse, but entertaining enough for me. And the Star Wars fans are awful people who hate the product they purport to love (especially if the lead is a girl).
I can get on board with bashing Boba Fett, Mando III, Ahsoka, The rise of Skywalker.
But like Obi Wan, this isn't a hit, it's just not bad enough to sit around complaining about.
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Ok, I haven't done any major propeller spinning for a long time, because Star Wars doesn't really inspire me to do it like I used to when I was absolutely in love with Star Wars Lore.
But here's the theory on the Sith Lord that we've seen, and why the Sith would risk exposing themselves to the Jedi.
Don't read the spoilered if you don't like these kind of posts.
Spoiler!
Basically the Sith have stayed hidden for a few thousand years, since Darth Bane reformed the Sith Order (killed them all in a horrible fashion) and enacted the rule of two.
The Sith since then had been dedicated in building their grand plan to take back the galaxy. They have been gathering strength. A master gains knowledge and teaches his apprentice, then when the apprentice becomes stronger then the master he kills his master and takes an apprentice, and the cycle continues over and over again.
By doing this the Sith grow more knowledgeable, and more powerful until in the end you get what was basically a black hole in the force like Palpatine who literally is the chosen one.
Each Master has a different interest too. Darth Bane was interested in eternal life, Darth Cognus could see into the future basically. Darth Zannah was into sorcery. So their knowledge base grew in a lot of directions. Darth Tenebrous the master of Plageuis was interested in math, he felt that he could calculate to the moment when the Jedi and the Republic would fall. With Plageuis he was obsessed with eternal life.
Quote:
"I thought not. It's not a story the Jedi would tell you. It's a Sith legend. Darth Plagueis... was a Dark Lord of the Sith so powerful and so wise, he could use the Force to influence the midi-chlorians... to create... life. He had such a knowledge of the dark side, he could even keep the ones he cared about... from dying."
"He could actually... save people from death?"
The Master became obsessed with it. So when he suddenly hears that a clan of force using witches have managed to conceive a baby that's force sensitive with the force, he would be intrigued, the fact that there were twins, would be too much to resist.
Now . . . how would Plagueis know? Because he was there, he either has a tap into the Jedi, a traitor, or he is a Jedi.
Impossible you say, the Jedi would pick up a uber powerful Dark Side user in their midst. I'd say sure, until we saw Darth Sidious mingling with Jedi all the time, and they never had a clue.
So now we're the who or what, we've seen three of the four Jedi that were there at the scene of the slaughter that are dead, with only master Sol left, and I doubt he's the traitor. But I doubt that the 4 Jedi weren't reporting to someone, so they get on the horn back to their manager, who says, seize these children no matter what. They need to be bought back to the Temple. But and I'll call our traitor Plagueis doesn't want them at the temple. He wants to study them. So Plagueis tells his/her apprentice jumps into a ship and goes there. The Apprentice then slaughters the witches putting the blame on the Jedi and on Mae, the Apprentice realizes that he might only get one, so while Mae and Osha are on the bridge, the Sith Apprentice collapses the bridge sending Mae to her supposed death, meanwhile Sol saves Osha and takes her to the Jedi to be trained.
Meanwhile our Apprentice finds Mae, and fills her with hate and rage and takes her to be "trained" and studied, how did the witches create life from nothing?
So for the next few years, the Dark Lord gives Mae purpose through the apprentice who takes on the mantle of "Master", get your revenge, and I'll give you power as my apprentice, now Mae has never seen her master's face. So she wouldn't know that she was dealing with a mere apprentice.
Now, why not the true Master? Because Dark Lords of the Sith are the repository of few thousand years of Sith Knowledge and Force Mastery, they won't risk their exposure at all. However the apprentice is somewhat disposable, another apprentice can be found, we saw that with Palpatine and Maul and Dooku.
So the years pass, and our Sith Lord a high ranking Jedi manipulates things, we see it in this episode, as the Sith Lord keeps the disclosure of this situation from the High Counsel. The Sith Lord manipulates these Jedi based on purely political reasons, "we can't cause mistrust of the jedi by disclosing this to the High Counsel nor the Senate". Meanwhile our Sith Lord manipulates Osha during her training for the Jedi, to the point, that Osha leaves the Order, and goes out into the wild, she even arranges for the blame for the Jedi murders going to Osha, and the ridiculous prisoner transfer without the Jedi in the hopes that Osha would die.
Meanwhile the Apprentice continues to play the role of master, meanwhile the master knows that Mae is weak, she will never succeed and we saw her quit.
This was the first wrinkle in the Sith Lords plan, that Mae would find a way to expose the Sith coming back to the Jedi. So when the apprentice is trapped easily by Mae, he easily broke loose, and changed as his outfit was in that big backpack, and using his superior Force abilities got ahead of Mae and killed the wookie Jedi, this also presented an opportunity for the Sith. Everyone with knowledge of what was going on was in one place. And the Master knew that his apprentice who was the beneficiary of thousands of years of training and knowledge was more then a match for a bunch of Knights, Padawans and a Master. So . . . kill them all, seize Osha and Mae, and Plageuis could continue to study them to find the key to not only eternal life, but the creation of life.
And here's the biggest benefit, even if some of the Jedi survive, they have to report back to their manager, the Sith Lord in hiding, who would keep that knowledge away from the high council, and eventually elimiate those lose ends.
Now looking ahead, I fully expect that this fight against the Sith Apprentice is going to go badly, with Sol and either Yord or Jecki surviving, because you have to have meaningful emotional deaths.
The Apprentice will take Mae and Osah, and return to his master.
Meanwhile Darth Plagueis will implicate Sol and the other surviving Jedi as traitors and report them to the High Council.
At some point the Apprentice will be killed, and it will be framed to look like Murder by Sol. That gets rid of a loose end. I mean the apprentice is just a normal looking smuggler. No big deal, because by this point our Sith Lord will have learned the secrets of manipulating midicholorians and still have time to create his next apprentice, in Palpatine.
And the season will end with our Sith Lord looking out the window with a satisfied smirk on her face after talking to Yoda and completely pulling the wool over his eyes. Then Vernestra will return to her Jedi duties knowing that the grand plan is safe, the Jedi will continue to be blinding by their arrogance, and she will have a new and more powerful Sith Apprentice, now what to do with the twins?
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My name is Ozymandias, King of Kings;
I suspect the reason you have gotten tired of star wars is because you are sitting around wondering "why would the sith risk revealing themselves now". Simple answer is because this is when the story is set. They could have gone 200 bby and that's when the sith would have risked it. Or 50 bby. But they chose 100.
Spoiler!
I've at least consider that Sol is Plagues and he's actually running the masked guy we've been seeing, or possibly Vernestra
Just got caught up and watched all four episodes over the last two nights. I went in with low expectations but I am actually enjoying it. New live action Star Wars content, with new characters, and actors that I like (Lee Jung-Jae, Carrie-Ann Moss!). As always with Star Wars, you can just enjoy the different aliens, droids, ships, and settings.
The character of Sol in particular is really good. A Jedi purist who seems to have the best of intentions and a unique style.
It’s no Mandalorian or Andor but I can embrace the cheese and just go along for the ride. It’s comfort food.
I also liked Obi-Wan, and I even liked a few episodes of Ahsoka.
The latest episode of Acolyte was pretty good in my opinion, far better than the previous.
I think there were good parts to Obi-Wan, but just sooo much fat around it that needed to be cut out and served nothing to enhance the product.
It could have been 2-3 very good episodes, and instead we got 6(7?) OK episodes, with one really good duel at the end.
Reva and the inquisitors were comically terrible. They weren't the least bit intimidating or interesting, and many of the side characters were terrible.
If you have some key interesting developments to focus on, there's no reason to take such a roundabout way of getting to it where 80% of the episodes are uninteresting filler arcs no one asked for.
The first half of Ahsoka was promising. But then it went nowhere.
Spoiler!
Characters just swapped locations. It largely ended up having no payoff except for the Anakin sequences.
It also didn't help that some of the main characters were bland. Baylan and Shin deserved more love from the showrunners. I think they didn't realize that the show was at its best when those two were involved, so they were under-used and ultimately just kind of discarded.
Thrawn's reveal was good, but after that I think him and the witches were more of an afterthought.
Last edited by TrentCrimmIndependent; 06-20-2024 at 11:08 AM.
I think there were good parts to Obi-Wan, but just sooo much fat around it that needed to be cut out and served nothing to enhance the product.
It could have been 2-3 very good episodes, and instead we got 6(7?) OK episodes, with one really good duel at the end.
Reva and the inquisitors were comically terrible. They weren't the least bit intimidating or interesting, and many of the side characters were terrible.
If you have some key interesting developments to focus on, there's no reason to take such a roundabout way of getting to it where 80% of the episodes are uninteresting filler arcs no one asked for.
I agree with all of this, but the fan-service of Obi Wan versus Vader was enough to make me like this show even despite all its flaws.
