Seattle Expansion Draft Speculation

[GS Skier]

Originally Posted by Poe969

Extend Gio?? If he gets an extension, it should be between 2-3 million and that won't stop thr bitch pigeons from taking him.

what is with some fans? Honestly, this team isn't good so why do what you can to keep it together? They should not give Seattle any extra assets for any reason whatsoever. I've joked before "we'll give you Backlund if you take Lucic" but that helps the Flames more than anything. They need to cut salaries like Gio, Backlund and Lucic and move on, crowd favourites or not, they need to start thinking of doing what's right for the team not what's right for some players.

Not about "keeping it together" at all. The Kraken don't look like they are going to take anyone's ugly contracts. For the Flames to change the core it will have to be by trade. They're not taking "Backlund to take Lucic" LOL.

What it is with some fans? Honestly they under value our pieces and think everybody else's problem players and contracts will somehow save us!

I heard Morganti from Philly the other day almost salivating at the thought the Flames and Flyers might make a deal involving "Star Quality" players like a Gaudreau or Tkachuk. Centers with multi 20 goal seasons on their resumes command a heck of a lot in trade including a great skating solid 200 foot center like Backlund!

Keeping together isn't the point but throwing away players for crap returns or "picks" is not only foolish it isn't going to happen under any GM, Tre or not.

[tkflames]

Originally Posted by GS Skier

Every thing I'm hearing about the Krakens "plan" is that they want to play their cap really smart. They do NOT have any intention of spending much more than the floor so in this fixed cap future for a few years they will have a major advantage.

I would just note that exposing Gio and Lucic is pretty darn safe from everything I've read. They aren't taking ANYONE's "Cap" problems away for them. Most mock drafts have them taking Oshie at 5.5 as a local boy. They will likely take Kjillington from Calgary and almost every mock draft show that.

FWIW Even Vegas only drafted 1 single $6 Mil player and that was of course Fleury. The Kraken have lots of goalies to choose from however there is NO Fluery caliber goalie available or even anything close.

There may not be a Fleury calibre goalie available. But Fleury will likely be available...

[1qqaaz]

Originally Posted by GS Skier

Every thing I'm hearing about the Krakens "plan" is that they want to play their cap really smart. They do NOT have any intention of spending much more than the floor so in this fixed cap future for a few years they will have a major advantage.

I would just note that exposing Gio and Lucic is pretty darn safe from everything I've read. They aren't taking ANYONE's "Cap" problems away for them. Most mock drafts have them taking Oshie at 5.5 as a local boy. They will likely take Kjillington from Calgary and almost every mock draft show that.

FWIW Even Vegas only drafted 1 single $6 Mil player and that was of course Fleury. The Kraken have lots of goalies to choose from however there is NO Fluery caliber goalie available or even anything close.

I actually think it would be very silly of them not to take Gio if he were to be exposed.

He could probably fetch a late 1st or a 2nd+ if he were a rental at the 2022 trade deadline. Unless he suddenly takes huge regressive steps. This is especially true if Seattle retains half his cap at the deadline.

I don't see any other available Flames fetching draft capital like that. Kylington went through waivers. Lucic, though useful, has negative value.
Ryan doesn't have value (otherwise he would have been traded).

And if Seattle does compete in year 1, Gio would likely be one of the best defensemen on the team.

With all that said, I don't think the Flames should spend assets to keep Gio. Just enjoy the freed up cap space and move on.

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by cam_wmh

That's a helluva risk for Seattle to take, without some "insider" knowledge like what occurred with Engelland, a pending UFA whom they'd own the rights to for a few days.

Pretty sure VGK has negotiating rights with pending UFA's who are exposed for 3-4 days before the ED. Using the ED pick would essentially be trading for 'signing rights', like we see teams do to get ink on paper before the frenzy.

Of course, if a team had a juicy young guy exposed, you might agree to terms with a UFA and wait to make it official until July 28 (albeit with some risk).

Originally Posted by tkflames

There may not be a Fleury calibre goalie available. But Fleury will likely be available...

They don't get to draft from VGK, but that might actually hurt VGK as they'll definitely have to pay to shed salary and have no chance of an ED miracle.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Poe969

Extend Gio?? If he gets an extension, it should be between 2-3 million and that won't stop thr bitch pigeons from taking him.

what is with some fans? Honestly, this team isn't good so why do what you can to keep it together? They should not give Seattle any extra assets for any reason whatsoever. I've joked before "we'll give you Backlund if you take Lucic" but that helps the Flames more than anything. They need to cut salaries like Gio, Backlund and Lucic and move on, crowd favourites or not, they need to start thinking of doing what's right for the team not what's right for some players.

I personally believe big changes to the roster includes Gio going to the Kraken. He's been a great player for the organization but it's time for new leadership and changes in the core of the roster. The organization needs to accept change and the cap space that losing him in the expansion draft will provide.

[GhostCookie]

[QUOTE=powderjunkie;7876726]Pretty sure VGK has negotiating rights with pending UFA's who are exposed for 3-4 days before the ED. Using the ED pick would essentially be trading for 'signing rights', like we see teams do to get ink on paper before the frenzy.

Of course, if a team had a juicy young guy exposed, you might agree to terms with a UFA and wait to make it official until July 28 (albeit with some risk).


Seattle will get an exclusive 2 day window to talk to UFA's, but one caveat is that if they reach an agreement with a player that counts as their pick from the players team. So I would imagine any deals signed there would be for players they don't want to risk getting to open UFA, or from teams where they aren't enamored with any of the signed options. Otherwise they might have a lot of verbal agreements made to players to sign once FA starts.

I do hope that whoever we expose (I'd honestly prefer Gio) we don't pay anything to have them picked or protected. We have given up too many picks and paid too heavy for the world leaders in mediocrity team we have now, no point in adding some fuel to the dumpster fire.

[Tkachukwagon]

The Athletic ran the 7th version of the Seattle Kraken draft, with the panel choosing Kylington and Giordano:

Clark: He’s another pending RFA. But Oliver Kylington would give the Kraken another young depth defensemen who could either work his way into the top six, become the team’s seventh defensemen or someone who goes back and forth from the AHL.

Duhatschek: Mark Giordano. Lots of safe, easy and cost-effective choices elsewhere, so Seattle can swing for the fences here. Giordano can retun real value in the beginning by helping to create a positive organizational culture, and if they choose, he can be flipped as a rental at the 2022 trade deadline to a contender.

Luszczyszyn: I don’t believe Mark Giordano is washed. He can still be a solid presence on the blue line and even if he can’t handle tough minutes like he used to, sliding him down the lineup can still prove fruitful. A rag-tag team of misfits can use a leader too, and Giordano has plenty of experience in that department.

[transplant99]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1405538405258121221

[Funkhouser]

Originally Posted by Tkachukwagon

The Athletic ran the 7th version of the Seattle Kraken draft, with the panel choosing Kylington and Giordno:

Agree with this, I think Gio is gone unfortunately (unless Hanafin disappears in an Eichel trade or we give up a 2nd to Seattle to avoid him)

[The Yen Man]

Other than Gio, who on the Flames exposed list would even need any type of protection consideration? And I'll be real disappointed if we gave up assets to entice Seattle not to take Gio.

It's almost like win win if Gio is exposed. Seattle skips on him, we don't waste a protection slot. Seattle takes him, we free up $6.75M in cap space.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Tkachukwagon

The Athletic ran the 7th version of the Seattle Kraken draft, with the panel choosing Kylington and Giordno:

Yeah and someone ran the cap numbers and Duha's team that included players like Dumba, Druin, Gio, Henrique, Khudobin, etc and they still come in at $54 million with $27 million left in cap space. The Kraken will have no issues absorbing several larger than average contracts. Also thought this was pretty funny;

Luszczyszyn: Zack MacEwen. Really didn’t matter who I picked here as it was unlikely anyone available from Vancouver would actually make the team. MacEwen seems fine, I guess. He didn’t produce at all, but his possession numbers were among the team’s best.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by transplant99

https://twitter.com/user/status/1405538405258121221

Why even bother if that's the case? Seems like it's more prudent to just accept the loss of the player as we saw last expansion that teams got burned trying to protect players.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Yeah and someone ran the cap numbers and Duha's team that included players like Dumba, Druin, Gio, Henrique, Khudobin, etc and they still come in at $54 million with $27 million left in cap space. The Kraken will have no issues absorbing several larger than average contracts. Also thought this was pretty funny;

Dumba? I suspect either Minnie will go the 8 skater route (thy really don't have that many forwards to worry about) or they will talk Suter into waiving his NMC.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Why even bother if that's the case? Seems like it's more prudent to just accept the loss of the player as we saw last expansion that teams got burned trying to protect players.

That is completely right.

Now, the one exception is if a team is a SC contender, but has a relatively short window, it might make sense to try and keep the band together. But I'm not seeing that situation.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Why even bother if that's the case? Seems like it's more prudent to just accept the loss of the player as we saw last expansion that teams got burned trying to protect players.

I genberally agree. the only way you protect Gio IMO is if you think the price paid (eg. a second plus of course they take Kylington) is less than you get at the TDL for Gio (if you think you could get a first).

If they would agree to take Lucic, who helps with the floor plus isn't paid his AAV in cash, so they don't have to spend as many real dollars, I'd offer them something pretty good. Not a first, but maybe a later pick and a decent prospect.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Dumba? I suspect either Minnie will go the 8 skater route (thy really don't have that many forwards to worry about) or they will talk Suter into waiving his NMC.

I was surprised but they had him as available in their mock draft. I assume the person covering the Wild for the Athletic feels that he will be unprotected. Personally I feel that would be foolish. There has to be a handful of teams that could trade for him and protect him.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Sounds like they are potentially high on Greenway and that could be why they need to expose Dumba. I've also seen ones where Hartman is exposed and the one taken.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Sounds like they are potentially high on Greenway and that could be why they need to expose Dumba. I've also seen ones where Hartman is exposed and the one taken.

I’ve read Talbot exposed in some mock drafts too which would be tempting.

Minny has 5 NMC’s, and I expect none of them waive it. I predict Dumba is one of the Krakens top guys chosen.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I was surprised but they had him as available in their mock draft. I assume the person covering the Wild for the Athletic feels that he will be unprotected. Personally I feel that would be foolish. There has to be a handful of teams that could trade for him and protect him.

A lot of the mock drafts take the existing rosters with NMCs etc and ignore the reality that some will be waived and teams will make moves beforehand.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Why even bother if that's the case? Seems like it's more prudent to just accept the loss of the player as we saw last expansion that teams got burned trying to protect players.

It actually bothered me that Vegas was allowed to do this. It’s pretty much just extortion. The expansion teams should have to pick from the assets left unprotected and both teams should have to live with the decision with players not being able to be reacquired for a a full season.

By allowing side deals, it allows the expansion team to threaten other teams to take an asset that they might not really want just to make them give up something else while taking the player or prospect they really wanted anyway.

For example, I could see Kylington being a better pick for the Kraken in the big picture due to cost control and future upside, but threatening to take Giordano because it might entice the Flames to give up something else to not take him. Just a hypothetical example.