[Rumour] TSN: Peters status. Shake up trade. Hamonic's future

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Well the player has some pretty easy numbers you can pull and analyze. He had the same coach as last year, and has for the most part played with the same players.

I'm having a heck of a time coming up with why Gaudreau's lack of chance generation this year can be blamed on coaching, but as you say ... I'm not on the inside and can't say for sure.

The numbers you can analyze are the result, not the root cause

The way you do things ends up in the events that you can count

[Manhattanboy]

Flames should bring back Jiri Hudler to work with Johnny and Mony.

Some of their best moments were when Hudler was part of that line.

[Knut]

Originally Posted by Manhattanboy

Flames should bring back Jiri Hudler to work with Johnny and Mony.

Some of their best moments were when Hudler was part of that line.

He would probably only lead to more Nose Beers for the line.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Manhattanboy

Flames should bring back Jiri Hudler to work with Johnny and Mony.

Some of their best moments were when Hudler was part of that line.

Nah, they were never better than with Lindholm last year.

[midniteowl]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

Lol. It’s as easy as that right? Just tell him to do things different?

What the hell do you think they’re doing?

At what point do you start to wonder if Gaudreau really listens and absorbs anything our coaches say? That’s where I’m at with him. Some players just aren’t very coachable. There’s enough smoke we’ve got to be wondering if that’s the fire.

Or there are some coaches just don't know how to coach?

[Gaskal]

No matter what happens, I'm very positive Bill Peters will be playing out the season, and likely at least given a shot next season to get off to a good start.

Flames ownership and Treliving are correct to stand by their guy at least for that amount of time. That's three coaches now under this core that after one bad season have been let go, so they need to act with the club's long term interests in mind. This core had a 107 pt season under this coach so it's not like he came in and neutered the team.

During the year Gulutzan got fired, we talked about going after Trotz, Vigneault, Boudreau etc etc. If Peters joins the pattern of Calgary coaches getting fired after one bad season following a good season and never seeing another head job in the show afterwards, then who the hell amongst the big names would want to actually come here to coach? It's a dubious body of work at this point.

Peters will be allowed to at least begin the season next year or this club might start having serious issues attracting legit head coaching talent if he gets canned earlier.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

Lol. It’s as easy as that right? Just tell him to do things different?

What the hell do you think they’re doing?

At what point do you start to wonder if Gaudreau really listens and absorbs anything our coaches say? That’s where I’m at with him. Some players just aren’t very coachable. There’s enough smoke we’ve got to be wondering if that’s the fire.

LOL that's it. A guy that had a successful college career, has played over 400 NHL games at almost a point a game pace isn't coachable. I get it. You hate small guys, love big knuckle dragging players, but that's a laughable post. Giordano is playing some of the worst hockey in his career I guess he's not coachable as well.

[theinfinitejar]

Originally Posted by Gaskal

No matter what happens, I'm very positive Bill Peters will be playing out the season, and likely at least given a shot next season to get off to a good start.

Flames ownership and Treliving are correct to stand by their guy at least for that amount of time. That's three coaches now under this core that after one bad season have been let go, so they need to act with the club's long term interests in mind. This core had a 107 pt season under this coach so it's not like he came in and neutered the team.

During the year Gulutzan got fired, we talked about going after Trotz, Vigneault, Boudreau etc etc. If Peters joins the pattern of Calgary coaches getting fired after one bad season following a good season and never seeing another head job in the show afterwards, then who the hell amongst the big names would want to actually come here to coach? It's a dubious body of work at this point.

Peters will be allowed to at least begin the season next year or this club might start having serious issues attracting legit head coaching talent if he gets canned earlier.

Or we stop shopping for coaches off the clearance rack.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by theinfinitejar

Or we stop shopping for coaches off the clearance rack.

Sometimes you get lucky with the odd bargain but you often get what you pay for. Peters isn't a terrible coach like Gulutzan but his NHL coaching record leaves a lot to be desired.

[Red_Baron]

I'd say that it is safe to say that Peters as a coach is not going to spin straw into gold so we can't lose too much by firing him.


Get someone else in, even on an interim basis and then evaluate whether you need to make personnel decisions. Right now, the least coveted asset the team has is Peters.



Either way this organization needs to address the on-ice product, it is pure garbage right now.

[Erick Estrada]

I realize everyone wants to fire and trade everyone but it's not December yet. As bleak as things look it's still possible for this team to turn things around. I don't think there are any franchise altering trades out there in the Flames favor and I doubt the GM fires the head coach. They just have to keep playing through this as things can change a lot over the course of an 82 game season.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I realize everyone wants to fire and trade everyone but it's not December yet. As bleak as things look it's still possible for this team to turn things around. I don't think there are any franchise altering trades out there in the Flames favor and I doubt the GM fires the head coach. They just have to keep playing through this as things can change a lot over the course of an 82 game season.

Even then though do you think this team has the pieces to really compete for a championship? they are missing at least two high end parts in my view.
And the best way to get that is via the draft.
This is a damn good draft - both at the top and overall depth.
A top 5 pick in this draft would add a critical piece.
Look what the Avs got with Makar from a down year (or was that their Ottawa pick?)

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Even then though do you think this team has the pieces to really compete for a championship? they are missing at least two high end parts in my view.
And the best way to get that is via the draft.
This is a damn good draft - both at the top and overall depth.
A top 5 pick in this draft would add a critical piece.
Look what the Avs got with Makar from a down year (or was that their Ottawa pick?)

Their Ottawa pick was last season. Makar was the fruit of their downswing I do believe. They got Byram from Ottawa.

...we need to do what the Avs did if we want to become a true top tier team.

Trade Gaudreau to Buffalo for their 2020 1st round pick and Dylan Cozens (7th overall last year) or something. Buffalo is desperate to make the playoffs and are still a deeply troubled roster.

Sell Hamonic and Brodie for more picks. Deal with the pain of this year.

[GullFoss]

The flames haven't really looked right since the dismantling by the Avalanche. I'm starting to think that in the series, they lost trust in each other and in themselves.

- No one has "figured out" Johnny
- No one has quit on the coach
- Peters is a good coach, but maybe not the right coach


This team was identified as emotionally and mentally fragile and weak team by Gully and Tre and Peters. Multiple times over multiple years. That is the problem. It's the same problem they have now.

Two solutions:

1) bring in a leader who is mentally tough. Darryl Sutter would not let this happen.

Or

2) ride it out and hope things turn around with some help from father time and Lady luck. It worked for Gully that one time they lost in 4 straight to Anaheim.

[rooster]

Maybe we need a bigger monitor in the f$%^^*& floor!

[dammage79]

Treliving: Didnt get his vision done in the offseason. I fully believe he knows what's wrong, but his hands are tied because he can't find a dance partner right now. Hes not the type to overpay for a quick fix. Of all the GMs I've followed before, Brad Treliving is as pragmatic as they come. Ultimately very fault this team has is on his plate, he'd tell you that himself. What's frustrating for me as a fan is hes not going to pull trigger like Daryll did at the height of his team unravelling, hes going to go through his process and find a way to get it done.

Gaudreau: one does not si.ply fall off the face of the earth like he has this year without some serious issues. My take? Bruised Ego. And, hes not kid with boundless energy anymore. If he intends to be at the top of his game for a long time, the skittles gotta go.

Peters: Has tried everything he can with lines and the blender. Message may be overly negative but it is simple and true in nature.


Overall: this roster is stuck in ther heads. They're at that point where they can't fight their way out of a paper bag. There's no one thing causing them all this strife, it's a total package of suck.

[oldschoolcalgary]

at this point, part of me just wants to say #### it...

If i'm BT, i'd tell the team in no uncertain terms: no trades are coming, no coach is being fired.

suck it up and play and coach like you did last year....

tank for all i care; maybe we'll finally draft a elite blue chip player that doesn't disappear in the playoffs.

[FanIn80]

Originally Posted by theinfinitejar

Or we stop shopping for coaches off the clearance rack.

This.

Option A: Pay 5 million for a coach who ends up being good enough that you get 5 years out of him.

Option B: Pay 3 million for a coach, and fire him in two years. Then pay 3 million for another coach while still paying 3 million for the fired coach, only to fire the new coach in two years. Then pay 3 million for a third coach while still paying 3 million for each of the first two coaches...

[browna]

Originally Posted by dammage79

Treliving: Didnt get his vision done in the offseason. I fully believe he knows what's wrong, but his hands are tied because he can't find a dance partner right now. Hes not the type to overpay for a quick fix. Of all the GMs I've followed before, Brad Treliving is as pragmatic as they come. Ultimately very fault this team has is on his plate, he'd tell you that himself. What's frustrating for me as a fan is hes not going to pull trigger like Daryll did at the height of his team unravelling, hes going to go through his process and find a way to get it done.


Overall: this roster is stuck in ther heads. They're at that point where they can't fight their way out of a paper bag. There's no one thing causing them all this strife, it's a total package of suck.

I'm with you for most part. Treliving tried to sell high on a guy like Janko but got shut down. Those chiding him for not getting the deals done with Toronto and Minnesota, have zero idea how many other deals by GMs week over week fall apart like that. So Treliving understands his weaknesses on the team and has tried to change that second line into providing a legit alternative to the top line


However, it won't be like Sutter pulling deals out of nowhere, it's because there is a very tight cap to negotiate, which ties hands a lot further.
And you have a Brodie, Hamonic, and Bennett, all rumored to be on the block at some point over the past year, on ltir and unavailable to properly trade tonight even if you wanted to.

I've made clear the tactical and style play that the Flames aren't employing this year, but those failures and the confidence zapping reaults have sent the roster as a whole into an alarming low, where, no matter the squeezing of the stick, nothing is going the right way and then questioning and over thinking every shift as a result.

The lazy analysis such as "no effort or don't give a ####" is patently false, but the team is meek and humbled and they feel every good thing they scratch and claw shift over shift to do seems so hard to get right and then is simply undone by a half second of bad decision making and a tinge of bad luck, and that builds game over game. It's not a self pity thing, but extremely frustrating and has swelled into 6 games of that helpless feeling.

[dino7c]

You don't get 30 shots on the Blues after 2 periods because you are lazy, don't care, ect.

They just aren't executing...2.5 shooting % is crazy