Calgary Public Transit - Discussion

[Tyler]

Just watched the video concept.. wow. I always thought $5B was pretty pricey, but that is a HUGE amount of distance to build from basically scratch. Will be a transformative project, for sure.

[Bunk]

Such a gratifying day. So much work over the last 5 years has gone into making this happen.

[iggyformayor]

My wife and I moved into Mahogany in October expecting that this would be a long, long, loooong, way down the road. Pretty exciting that the timeline has moved up significantly.

[Bunk]

Here's something kind of fun I've been reflecting on - from my first email June 10, 2010 to Naheed in the early stages of his 2010 election campaign with respect to transportation policy (I helped lead his policy platform creation on Transportation, Transit and Development/Growth stuff).

This led to policy in his platform, which led him to putting forward the creation of RouteAhead www.routeahead.ca which is where the full Green Line concept emerged as the marquee project.

A focused plan to for LRT expansion

Because transportation and transit are very high on the list of issues for people, I think making a coherent and tangible plan for LRT expansion would be a really effective campaign plank. I think a big issue with our "plans" for LRT expansion is the actual lack of a coherent plan. Speaking from my experience watching the goings on in Toronto, watching Mayor David Miller's "Transit City" Plan www.transitcity.ca opened my eyes to this issue. It very clearly identifies LRT lines that are to be built, costing, sequencing and other details. What it really did though was gave politicians at senior levels of government something tangible to grasp on to and support. Soon after the plan was launched provincial and federal dollars flowed. Since, Ontario's bleak financial situation has meant that about $4billion in funding for that project has been delayed unfortunately. Try and find a capital expansion plan for the C-Train that is clear, logical, accessible and easily understood by the public for Calgary. With no plan, there will be no money, and things will be built much more slowly. Calgary needs to create a greater sense of urgency in pushing these big pieces of transit infrastructure forward.

I would suggest coming out with a C-Train expansion plan with a similarly memorable name that can provide the basis for capital investment priorities. Right now, things are done on an ad-hoc basis with SELRT being moved up the priority list through notice of motions and other such shortsighted planning.

And a tidbit about North Central LRT

North Central LRT

The planning for the North-Central LRT is an example of the City where the right hand (transit planning) doesn't know what the left (land use planning) is doing or have competing agendas. While we talk about connecting land use to transit, the proposed routing of the North Central LRT up Nose Creek completely bypasses north central Calgary (110,000 residents) and identified corridors for growth in the MDP, such as the Centre Street Urban Corridor. Centre Street has no chance to develop as a mixed use urban corridor as envisioned without the LRT in place. The line is a least-cost alternative that misses 50% of its potential ridership and only serves suburban and developing communities on the fringe of the city. There is nary a mention of Transit Oriented Development potential in the North Central Calgary Corridor Review. Ridiculous.

http://www.calgarytransit.com/pdf/no...dor_review.pdf

NCLRT is a great example of how Calgary Transit is stuck in a mentality of transit being a necessary evil that should be done at the least cost possible. The routing of the early LRT system was executed with this mentality. I think that this approach did serve its purpose in getting up a relatively extensive system for little money to build initial ridership, but as we become an actual big city we can simply not plan this way anymore. The planning model needs to shift from one of least-cost to that of greatest long term benefit. In the case of North Central LRT a line underneath Centre Street rather than Nose Creek would quite clearly be more expensive (probably a similar $2 billion cost to Vancouver's Canada line - same overall length and similar length for the underground portion) but its benefit in terms of serving far more people, and being a catalyst for reurbanization of the Centre Street corridor is invaluable in the long term. We're talking about a piece of infrastructure that will be around for more than a century.

[northcrunk]

The only thing worse than Calgary Transit is the Calgary Parking Authority.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by northcrunk

The only thing worse than Calgary Transit is the Calgary Parking Authority.

Oh for crying out loud. The need for a select few posters to drop throu and squeeze out a Cleveland steamer all over threads is so annoying.

[Lil Pedro]

This is crazy! What a big day for the city!

[Senator Clay Davis]

So by 2025 or so there could in theory be a road that hits all four quadrants, and train service to all four quadrants as well?

Thanks NDP?

[northcrunk]

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

Oh for crying out loud. The need for a select few posters to drop throu and squeeze out a Cleveland steamer all over threads is so annoying.

[_Q_]

This is awesome.

Now if I were to have my way, I would make sure that we had a subway station on the Green Line in the Beltline somewhere. Maybe under 12th Avenue. I really hope this isn't going to be built as an exercise to move people from the suburbs to 7th Avenue as quickly and cheaply as possible.

[You Need a Thneed]

Originally Posted by _Q_

This is awesome.

Now if I were to have my way, I would make sure that we had a subway station on the Green Line in the Beltline somewhere. Maybe under 12th Avenue. I really hope this isn't going to be built as an exercise to move people from the suburbs to 7th Avenue as quickly and cheaply as possible.

I doubt 12th ave, but almost certainly on 10th ave.

[InglewoodFan]

I am semi-optimistic for this project. As an outsider, it seems to me the city has really gotten it's tendering and project management game together. Seems like there is much better cost and schedule performance in recent years. I can see SNC-Lavalin salivating on this one, wonder who else might be in the mix. Even with starting construction in 2017, it is going to be a busy couple of years of design to get this going.

[pgsieve]

Is it going to the airport? If not.. It's a waste of money

[Looch City]

Originally Posted by pgsieve

Is it going to the airport? If not.. It's a waste of money

Agreed.

Thanks Nenshi.

Thanks NDP.

Thanks Obama.

[Bunk]

Originally Posted by pgsieve

Is it going to the airport? If not.. It's a waste of money

Airport connection will be a spur from NE, North-central (or both).

People vastly overestimate ridership to airports, the North central leg will serve likely 30 times the passengers per day than an airport leg.

[Tyler]

Originally Posted by Bunk

Airport connection will be a spur from NE, North-central (or both).

People vastly overestimate ridership to airports, the North central leg will serve likely 30 times the passengers per day than an airport leg.

But but... Toronto and Vancouver have one and we are basically the same city with the exact same transportation needs!

[Kavvy]

Originally Posted by InglewoodFan

I am semi-optimistic for this project. As an outsider, it seems to me the city has really gotten it's tendering and project management game together. Seems like there is much better cost and schedule performance in recent years. I can see SNC-Lavalin salivating on this one, wonder who else might be in the mix. Even with starting construction in 2017, it is going to be a busy couple of years of design to get this going.

I know we are ages from shovels hitting the ground or even the EPCM firm getting their contract... but maybe, just maybe... the city will get cheap construction rates and design rates if the contracts are signed earlier.

And potentially slightly help our economy.

If only this was approved on the books for when oil dropped, but I imagine that is tough.

[Frequitude]

Originally Posted by Bunk

Here's something kind of fun I've been reflecting on - from my first email June 10, 2010 to Naheed in the early stages of his 2010 election campaign with respect to transportation policy (I helped lead his policy platform creation on Transportation, Transit and Development/Growth stuff).

This led to policy in his platform, which led him to putting forward the creation of RouteAhead www.routeahead.ca which is where the full Green Line concept emerged as the marquee project.



And a tidbit about North Central LRT

I'd have given you the job on the spot. Fantastic letter.

[Fuzz]

Funny how much Mayors are associated with LRT projects. Klein with the original system, Doer with doing absolutely nothing, Bronconnier with the west leg, and Nenshi with the green line...

[Madman]

It seems like those low floor platforms are about 1000x easier to construct, that has to speed things up when you aren't building 25 giant structures.