PGT: President-Elect Donald J Trump

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Originally Posted by Illuminaughty

It could be hyperbole, joking or he could be lying. I judge people by their actions, not by what they say when they are joking around and not knowing they are being recorded. He apologised for it and said he has changed, what else do you want?

I don't want anything. You said there were only allegations. I'm saying there's proof.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by Illuminaughty

Gender wage gap is a persisting myth that won't go away. For example if we were both carpenters making $30 an hour, say I worked 60 hours a week and you worked 40 hours a week, who earns more? Obviously me because I worked more hours and it only seems fair that I should earn more. Learn the difference between wages and earnings. Men work more that's why they earn more, it's pretty simple really. Again, if you could pay a woman less money to do the same job as a man, there would be many civil discrimination suits, and rightfully so. This isn't the case, no economist takes this seriously, it's just a politically motivated myth that won't die.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/karinagn.../#4b9ad7764766

That link should paint a much clearer picture for you, it even deals with the links you posted.

That link doesn't say what you think it says. It references two groups who prove the existence of the gender wage gap, including a White House site which is covered by the non-partisan OMB for accuracy in numbers and information published. In fact, there is nothing in that link that counters or provides support to the claim that the wage gap is fallacious, other than the word of the author. The author, the founder and president of a conservative activist group who is active in an anti-feminist movement, who Forbes magazine just happens to endorse. This link shows how little people will dig into their references to understand their bias and political motivation. What's next? Using a link from RT (Putin's new Pravda)?

So why did the FBI re-open the investigation? I know just to get the masses to vote for Trump, which has already been alleged by some posters here.

The investigation was never closed nor re-opened. These emails were from a source that was not privy to the original investigation, nor available through the original subpoena. This was so much BS, and such a transgression against the law, the role of the FBI and the DOJ, and the spirit of the constitution that is is amazing that anyone on the right thinks this was remotely close to being legal. If this had been any other person but Clinton, there would have been a holy war for this action. If it had been someone like Ryan or Cruz there would have been blood in the street. It is that inconsistency and double standard that makes this who issue so had to stomach. Where was this outrage when the Bush administration deleted 330 million emails on a private server housed at the RNC? It didn't exist because it was a non-issue.

Almost all of Clinton's inner circle - the cast of advisers known as Clintonworld - and many of their family are caught up in an FBI dragnet.
The scale of investigations under way is unprecedented in electoral history.
There are five separate investigations:
The handling of classified information on the Clinton email server
Whether the Foundation was used to peddle influence
Whether illegal Chinese donations were taken by a Clinton intimate
Whether John Podesta's brother acted as a front for illegal lobbying
Anthony Weiner's sexting relationship with a 15-year-old.
Now we have what's being referred to as "PizzaGate".

Pizzagate. Right off of reddit, the rectum of the internet and the center of activity for the alt-right. Get off of Fantasy Island and get into the real world. When you do we can likely have a real discussion on issues. Until then it is very hard to take seriously anyone who used reddit as their primary source of information.

I don't think you get the extent to how deep her corruption and those in her inner circle really goes. This is a little more then just plausible deniability and being careless with emails or trusting the wrong third party officials like you are trying to point out. There is clear intent here, whether or not these people get punished I guess we will see. How many times can she be accused of being a criminal before the apologists will take an actual look at it. Scandal follows her everywhere she goes, and it's pretty obvious why.

So you should be able to post lots of links from reputable sources of information to back up yur claims of corruption. I'm not talking about your asinine reddit, Breitbart, Alex Jones/Infowars/Above Top Secret garbage. I'm talking about sites that do real journalism and can provide actual sources of information. See, someone can claim you're a pedophile and you get your rocks off on six year boys, but that doesn't make it accurate or true. Unless there is some actual evidence to support the claim, it is garbage.

You can just google Hillary Clinton email scandal and go from there. I could post some links but you would just dismiss it because that's not where you get your news from.

Except I don't get my information from news in this regard. I worked in the US government for over a decade in a capacity that deals with this exact scenario. I know how this works, including working with the FBI in nailing people for misuse of privileged government information. You can post all the bull#### links you want from reedit and RW alt-right sites that you want, but the reality is that they are full of flaws, which I will just have to rip apart, just like I did with gozer's garbage. There are laws on the books that identify how this stuff works, and all the humming and hawing on reddit doesn't change those laws, nor how the DOJ or FBI have to prove intent and fault.

I missed that post, to be fair it likely got lost in the shuffle of hurling garbage insults at Trump and Shillary apologetics. Yay I got an actual challenger. Let's dance.

Of course you did.

Yes, it was all lost in Trump insults and Hillary apologetics. The original post was clearly that. No, you ran in the other direction, because that is what you do. You say let's dance, well get out on the dance floor already. Stop your telling everyone you're Fred Astaire, show us your moves tough guy. The ball is clearly in your court.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by KootenayFlamesFan

I don't want anything. You said there were only allegations. I'm saying there's proof.

That proof being self-admission, meaning self-incrimination. But that doesn't count, because he family hasn't confirmed this self-incrimination.

[zamler]

Here's what is genuinely puzzling to me. So many people were 100% certain Trump would crash and burn. 100%. The election was going to be a landslide win for Hillary. Let's back it up, Trump will never run, Trump will never get the nomination, Trump will never ever win in a million years. The so called experts and arm chair pundits were all WRONG. About basically everything.

Yet the same people are now so #### sure that Donald Trump will crash and burn as President. They are certain about how everything will go down. The level of disconnect is staggering especially in the media, then and now.

My take is I don't know how he will do, but as Obama and H. Clinton have stated he was fairly elected and deserves a chance. And the support of American's.

[Illuminaughty]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

That still doesn't change the fact that consumer prices would skyrocket. I think it's pretty simplistic to think that raising the tax to a point that completely negative the foreign advantage would just increase jobs and circulate money money inside the country. Along with consumer prices skyrocketing, sales would plummet, jobs would be lost, and some companies would either close or leave completely. The US is a huge market, but don't expect that to continue as long as costs are astronomical.

Along with all that, the price of their exports would go up which would lead to less exports in general. That reduces the "cash flow" coming into the country significantly.

If you limit imports from China, they're almost guaranteed to start calling in their debt because they only let it ride at its current state due to the benefit they receive from it (calling in their debt would raise their currency against the US). The more they call in their debt, the more it'll crush the US dollar. The US are beholden to the goodwill of China at this point and reducing free trade is a bad solution. Even if you think it's a first step, it's a suicidal first step.

I mean, if you think that just taxing major corporations are going to push them offshore, you're going to in for a surprise when the lower domestic tax rate doesn't make up for the huge increase in cost of doing business by forcing their operations within the border. I always love that thinking: "If we tax corporations, they'll go offshore! We should force them to do all their business in one of the most expensive countries in the world. That'll fix it."

I think prices would go up a bit, but I'm not sure how they would skyrocket. Increasing competition helps keep prices down and affordable, I don't see how having domestic competition for the Chinese imports would be a bad thing. The import sales would go down and the domestic sales have nowhere to go but up. What jobs would be lost? The one's that don't exist in the US anymore? Prices can go up and wages can go up, it's all relative. You go way up North in Canada and yeah prices for goods are higher but their wages are higher to offset that. It's not like China would just stop exporting goods to one of largest markets in the world.

I think the gains the US would make on imports would offset any of the loses they experience on exports.

They call in their debt, don't pay it unless they are willing to renegotiate these deals. Really what can they do? So what solution would you adopt? Continue with these one sided deals and become more indebted to China because they have a "gun to your head"? They have to address the problem or they will continue to bleed economically.

You can't just keep treating business as your cash cow for spending, that's why nothing is being made in the US anymore. You must be referring to the major corporations that have all sorts of tax loop holes, exemptions and powerful lobbyists and make large campaign contributions to both parties. They won't go anywhere, they will just hide more holdings offshore if anything.

I'm open to hearing some of your solutions.

[Illuminaughty]

Originally Posted by KootenayFlamesFan

I don't want anything. You said there were only allegations. I'm saying there's proof.

Yes of him saying something in jest, without the knowledge of being recorded. I really don't think it's that big of a deal.

[PostandIn]

Originally Posted by zamler

Here's what is genuinely puzzling to me. So many people were 100% certain Trump would crash and burn. 100%. The election was going to be a landslide win for Hillary. Let's back it up, Trump will never run, Trump will never get the nomination, Trump will never ever win in a million years. The so called experts and arm chair pundits were all WRONG. About basically everything.

Yet the same people are now so #### sure that Donald Trump will crash and burn as President. They are certain about how everything will go down. The level of disconnect is staggering especially in the media, then and now.

My take is I don't know how he will do, but as Obama and H. Clinton have stated he was fairly elected and deserves a chance. And the support of American's.

Yep, now that a Republican has been elected s/he deserves the support of the American people. So rich.

[Illuminaughty]

Originally Posted by New Era

That proof being self-admission, meaning self-incrimination. But that doesn't count, because he family hasn't confirmed this self-incrimination.

So ignore any context and treat it as an admission because it fits your view of bigotry.

[zamler]

Originally Posted by PostandIn

Yep, now that a Republican has been elected s/he deserves the support of the American people. So rich.

Republicans did everything in their power to sabotage Obama at every turn if you care even the slightest about the United States you'll hope by some miracle the Dems won't attempt the same.

[Illuminaughty]

Originally Posted by New Era

That proof being self-admission, meaning self-incrimination. But that doesn't count, because he family hasn't confirmed this self-incrimination.

Well let's start with the gender wage gap myth, that was such a big part of both Hillary and Obamas platforms.

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/ha...rticle/2580405

Also, tell me what sites specifically you get your news from? So I know where to focus my search because you seem intent on dismissing all the information out there because it doesn't align with some msm tidbit you came across.

FYI I don't use breitbart or reddit as the source of my news. Swing and another miss. Everything has bias to a certain degree. There is a bunch of stuff out there on the net on pizzagate other then those sites. Try not being too biased with mainstream media fluff, you might actually learn something sometime. Maybe there are reasons that the msm doesn't cover certain things, and maybe sometimes those things are legit. You can't possibly believe they don't lie and try to form your world view. The Clintons have a history of sexual misconduct and dealings with people with a similar history.

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Originally Posted by Illuminaughty

Yes of him saying something in jest, without the knowledge of being recorded. I really don't think it's that big of a deal.

Okay, I mean, he said it, there's proof. If you want to dismiss it that's up to you.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Illuminaughty

I think prices would go up a bit, but I'm not sure how they would skyrocket. Increasing competition helps keep prices down and affordable, I don't see how having domestic competition for the Chinese imports would be a bad thing. The import sales would go down and the domestic sales have nowhere to go but up. What jobs would be lost? The one's that don't exist in the US anymore? Prices can go up and wages can go up, it's all relative. You go way up North in Canada and yeah prices for goods are higher but their wages are higher to offset that. It's not like China would just stop exporting goods to one of largest markets in the world.



I think the gains the US would make on imports would offset any of the loses they experience on exports.



They call in their debt, don't pay it unless they are willing to renegotiate these deals. Really what can they do? So what solution would you adopt? Continue with these one sided deals and become more indebted to China because they have a "gun to your head"? They have to address the problem or they will continue to bleed economically.



You can't just keep treating business as your cash cow for spending, that's why nothing is being made in the US anymore. You must be referring to the major corporations that have all sorts of tax loop holes, exemptions and powerful lobbyists and make large campaign contributions to both parties. They won't go anywhere, they will just hide more holdings offshore if anything.



I'm open to hearing some of your solutions.

Your Northern Canada example is flawed, as wages and living are heavily subsidised by the government. Is that the solution to keeping American businesses going? Increasing taxes on everyone to subsidise wages?

As for jobs, they'll go down because you're increasing the cost of doing business. Companies won't be able to afford doing business at the current rate if they can't capitalise on foreign workers, so domestic cuts will occur to balance the amount of domestic jobs they have to add.

I mean, I agree you have to reverse the trend, but the way you (and Trump) are suggesting is short sighted and just frankly wouldn't work. It's basically a left-wing fantasy (that Trump has tricked the right into believing to a dangerous degree).

Not paying the debt is not an option. China is more powerful than the US, and if you think it's bad having a gun held to their head, wait until China pulls the trigger. Regardless of the imaginative and inspiring endpoint - American made! Jobs for everyone! - the reality is that moves against China and free trade are going to make America much, much worse for many many years. If Trump heads down that path, he'll never get close to seeing a better America. Certainly not in this term or the possible next, and unlikely in his lifetime.

Americans, especially the working class, don't seem very happy with the current rotten state of the economy. You think they'll stomach another decade or two? You think that if Trump makes this move and the economy starts to tank (and it will, no question), that he'll get re-elected? I don't. And I don't think anyone would be stupid enough to follow in his footsteps.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by zamler

My take is I don't know how he will do, but as Obama and H. Clinton have stated he was fairly elected and deserves a chance. And the support of American's.

Easy for you to say, you're not an American nor have to deal with the outcomes of his policies.

I do agree that he was elected fairly and deserves a chance prove he is capable of governing. That starts with his decisions in following the traditions of the country, how he insures he is isolating himself from conflicts of interest, selection of his transition team, and then selection of his cabinet. So far, he is not instilling much confidence in any of his actions nor decisions.

[RougeUnderoos]

From what I've read, "Pizzagate" is an elaborate joke/hoax based on the premise that the Clintons and several other bigshots in Washington are involved in a pedophile sex trafficking ring based out of a pizza joint that sits atop secret underground tunnels dug by Satanists (or possibly the Devil himself) and the Illuminati. The Clinton Foundation is a front for this operation. A charity in the neighbourhood of the pizza joint is involved with Haitian orphans, and that's where the victims come from.

So just remember that you are arguing with someone who believes this is true. Photon already mentioned it, but at the time I didn't get what he was referring to. This is it.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

That is an amazing conspiracy theory. Seriously, points for imagination on that one.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by RougeUnderoos

So just remember that you are arguing with someone who believes this is true. Photon already mentioned it, but at the time I didn't get what he was referring to. This is it.

I don't know what's more concerning.

The fact that someone thinks that, or the fact that (during their quest to be taken seriously) they mentioned it publicly

How embarrassing.

[Illuminaughty]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Your Northern Canada example is flawed, as wages and living are heavily subsidised by the government. Is that the solution to keeping American businesses going? Increasing taxes on everyone to subsidise wages?

As for jobs, they'll go down because you're increasing the cost of doing business. Companies won't be able to afford doing business at the current rate if they can't capitalise on foreign workers, so domestic cuts will occur to balance the amount of domestic jobs they have to add.

I mean, I agree you have to reverse the trend, but the way you (and Trump) are suggesting is short sighted and just frankly wouldn't work. It's basically a left-wing fantasy (that Trump has tricked the right into believing to a dangerous degree).

Not paying the debt is not an option. China is more powerful than the US, and if you think it's bad having a gun held to their head, wait until China pulls the trigger. Regardless of the imaginative and inspiring endpoint - American made! Jobs for everyone! - the reality is that moves against China and free trade are going to make America much, much worse for many many years. If Trump heads down that path, he'll never get close to seeing a better America. Certainly not in this term or the possible next, and unlikely in his lifetime.

Americans, especially the working class, don't seem very happy with the current rotten state of the economy. You think they'll stomach another decade or two? You think that if Trump makes this move and the economy starts to tank (and it will, no question), that he'll get re-elected? I don't. And I don't think anyone would be stupid enough to follow in his footsteps.

The point I was making is it's relative, you make a bit more and things cost a bit more, that's not because of government subsidy, though they do that. No I'm not for government subsidy of anything really, and I'm saying tax cuts actually help revenue, Reagan and Kennedy both proved that.

The cost of doing business is already high in the US, that's why all the businesses left to foreign countries. Lowering taxes might bring them back and at least would offset more leaving, that's lowering the cost of doing business. It's a step in the right direction, I'm not sure how you can say it won't work and maintaining the current direction will.

It's a bad situation with China, but at some point something has to be done or it's only going to get worse. You are right, if they do pull the trigger because of one of his dealings, he won't be re-elected, that's the problem with politics, everybody seems afraid to do something that needs to be done, because they won't see another term.

[getbak]

Originally Posted by RougeUnderoos

From what I've read, "Pizzagate" is an elaborate joke/hoax based on the premise that the Clintons and several other bigshots in Washington are involved in a pedophile sex trafficking ring based out of a pizza joint that sits atop secret underground tunnels dug by Satanists (or possibly the Devil himself) and the Illuminati. The Clinton Foundation is a front for this operation. A charity in the neighbourhood of the pizza joint is involved with Haitian orphans, and that's where the victims come from.

So just remember that you are arguing with someone who believes this is true. Photon already mentioned it, but at the time I didn't get what he was referring to. This is it.

Wow, that's crazy.

Everyone knows you build secret sex dungeons in the basement of take-out chicken shops, not pizza places.

[Nage Waza]

Originally Posted by calgaryblood

Jimmy Carter is an amazing person. Just because he stood up against Israel's war crimes and apartheid doesn't mean he's a bad person.

Your willfully spreading lies again, but you don't need me to tell you that.

Why don't you remind us what those war crimes were? Since you are being balanced, let us know how many terrorist attacks there were by year since 2000.

And while you are at it, why don't you tell us how many people in total have died in the Palestinian/Israeli conflict? Why don't you explain how so few have died if Israel was so evil? With that said, I don't find any of the violence to be good, but a country has a right to defend itself from terrorism.

Please let me know what the countries that border Israel are doing for Palestinians.

And since you are doing the research, please let us know the death totals in the other countries in the region. How is Libya doing? Or Syria? Or Hamas on it's own people?

1/5th of Israeli citizens are Arab, with the same rights as anyone else, so yah, apartheid doesn't stick either. Are there problems though, you bet there are. But nothing compared to Israel's neighbors.

Regardless of anything you look up, you are going to move ahead blaming Israel for anything you can, which actually makes the matter worse for Palestinians. As long as groups like Hamas are making life worse for everyone, there will be a heavy Israeli army presence. If they only dropped their guns and offered peace? Instead, fools around the world are empowering the terrorists.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by nik-

The people who found him were working on it during the Bush administration too. It's not like Obama made this a priority, it's just that the group eventually was successful.

Taking Bin Laden out in Pakistan by Seal Team on the ground without informing the Pakistanis was all on Obama and his team, it was a gutsy move that Bush's cosy relationship with Pakistan (for reasons I don't understand, they were always more enemy than friend) would have made impossible, had Bush been in power Pakistan would have been asked, Osama would have bugged out twenty minutes later, and then a joint US Pakistani strike force a week later would have found an empty house.