[Rumour] Chris Johnston: Lindholm is interested in staying

[Toonage]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

^^ Can we still count on sports betting?

Ontario made some laws not sure how much of an impact it will have but current and former players can no longer take part in ads.

With the large disdain for it will continue?

Sports betting isn't going anywhere. Genie is out of that bottle. How its advertised may change, but gambling on sports in Canada is here to stay.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Huberdeau is 2x all-star himself and 3rd overall pick.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by Toonage

Sports betting isn't going anywhere. Genie is out of that bottle. How its advertised may change, but gambling on sports in Canada is here to stay.

Wanna bet?

[Monahammer]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

Huberdeau is 2x all-star himself and 3rd overall pick.

difference being that he wasn't selected by us as Doughty was by LA, and was never an All-Star with our team as Doughty has been many times for LA. Also, the whole multiple cup runs thing.

We don't have comparable to Doughty, Kopitar or quick on our roster. We can hope wolf becomes comparable to quick.

[Toonage]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

Wanna bet?

Ironically, I'm not a gambling man.

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by Toonage

Sports betting isn't going anywhere. Genie is out of that bottle. How its advertised may change, but gambling on sports in Canada is here to stay.

Perhaps sports betting is going to stay but I think it'll eventually revert back to the days before bet365 and Online casinos. From what I've been reading a lot of country's have put the cork back in the bottle. The UK is making some big changes, or has. I suspect there's going to be some real changes to advertising law in the coming years. And should be, if there's restrictions on tobacco and alcohol advertising or any other addiction , gambling restrictions will soon become a prominent political debate.

It ain't no genie.

[Monahammer]

The more I look at it, the more Dallas is a perfect example why we MUST consider tanking for at least one season.

Dallas did the flames strategy (TM) of trying to scrape in for the early 2010s.

Look at who they drafted in this time frame and where:
2010: Jack Campbell 10
2011: Jamie Oleksiak 14
2012: Radek Faksa 13
2013: Nichuskin 10
2014: Honka 14
2015: Gurianov 12
Then they did sneak in and make a run but fell short
2016: Riley Tufte 25
Then 2017 they stunk, and this was the draft that changed their team:
3 Heiskanen
26 Oettinger
39 Robertson

Most of their core drafted in their worst finish in more than a decade, allowing them to draft better players.
Add in some real luck on the Hintz pick... and there's the team.

IMO Dallas shows exactly why you have to suck bad for at least a season to build a competitor.

[Monahammer]

Also whoever Dallas has scouting in Finland is very, very good at their job.

[HighLifeMan]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

The more I look at it, the more Dallas is a perfect example why we MUST consider tanking for at least one season.

Dallas did the flames strategy (TM) of trying to scrape in for the early 2010s.

Look at who they drafted in this time frame and where:
2010: Jack Campbell 10
2011: Jamie Oleksiak 14
2012: Radek Faksa 13
2013: Nichuskin 10
2014: Honka 14
2015: Gurianov 12
Then they did sneak in and make a run but fell short
2016: Riley Tufte 25
Then 2017 they stunk, and this was the draft that changed their team:
3 Heiskanen
26 Oettinger
39 Robertson

Most of their core drafted in their worst finish in more than a decade, allowing them to draft better players.
Add in some real luck on the Hintz pick... and there's the team.

IMO Dallas shows exactly why you have to suck bad for at least a season to build a competitor.

Dallas moved up from 8th to 3rd in the draft lottery - they never really "bottomed out". Complete luck (which we haven't had) and great drafting changed the direction of that franchise.

[Paulie Walnuts]

WE also did suck for a season and ended up with Sam Bennett its not that simple.

[FanIn80]

Originally Posted by traptor

Man, some of you guys are unbearable conversationalist. So condensing and confrontational of differing opinions.

I guess that's what appens when you spend 16 hrs a day on a hockey forum..

"It's reality". No it's a quote. There's nothing factual about it, it's open to interpretation.

Anyways, my last post here. Best of luck.

I wish more posters here (including myself) were more condensing.

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

With all due respect, neither the Dallas situation nor the LA situation are analogous.

For LA, Huberdeau/Kadri/Weegar are good enough players, but the three you mentioned for LA that they kept were literally all-stars. Kopitar and quick were absolutely vital to cup winning squads, and Doughty is also a former top 2 pick and is still only young 30s (more akin to keeping and signing Hanifin for e.g.) Further, you mention significant prospects that LA had to fail really hard to get- given the instance of several posters claiming to have inside knowledge that the flames won't let this occur, I fail to see how we could build as exciting a prospect base (where's our Byfield or Clarke? no offense to our guys but they're not there.)

For Dallas, they got obtusely lucky (or their scouting is way above average, take your pick.) Our scouting has proven to be very, very good at finding strong middle roster talent in later rounds, this is indisputeable. But outside of Gaudreau we have never really snagged a top performer from round 3+. Kylington and Andersson are good rd 2 snags, but again not on the level of a hintz, or a Robertson. In addition to getting obtusely lucky on offensive performers, they also failed really hard a few years, and landed Heskainen.
Dallas is a closer comp than LA, but I don't see a heskainen in our future.

Doughty is 10 months OLDER than Kadri, and has played an additional ~330 NHL games. He'll turn 37 in December of the last year of his 11M AAV contract.

Kopitar just turned 36 before the last year of his long deal expires, and he's still good enough that they already extended him.

Kadri will turn 38 at the start of his last season. Huberdeau will turn 37 just before the start of his last season. Weegar will turn 37 halfway through his final season. Lindholm would turn 37 halfway through his final season on an 8 yr deal.

[topfiverecords]

Originally Posted by FanIn80

I wish more posters here (including myself) were more condensing.

When the glass is half empty and the days are warm they are.

[kukkudo]

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

Doughty is 10 months OLDER than Kadri, and has played an additional ~330 NHL games. He'll turn 37 in December of the last year of his 11M AAV contract.

Kopitar just turned 36 before the last year of his long deal expires, and he's still good enough that they already extended him.

Kadri will turn 38 at the start of his last season. Huberdeau will turn 37 just before the start of his last season. Weegar will turn 37 halfway through his final season. Lindholm would turn 37 halfway through his final season on an 8 yr deal.

I dont think we can compare Kopitar and Doughty in the same calibar to Kadri, Huberdeau, Lindholm, or Weegar.

Those guys got those contracts after winning multiple cups and being elite game changing players.

[TheIronMaiden]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

WE also did suck for a season and ended up with Sam Bennett its not that simple.

We sucked bad and drafted a handful of good players, but that was a while ago. Those good players left.

We drafted inside the top 6 three out of four years but It's been 7 drafts since we drafted Tkachuk at 6.

I did a big break down a few weeks ago. In the last 20 years only two teams have won without drafting multiple players in the top 5 picks a few years before winning the cup. Detroit and Vegas.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

The more I look at it, the more Dallas is a perfect example why we MUST consider tanking for at least one season.

Dallas did the flames strategy (TM) of trying to scrape in for the early 2010s.

Look at who they drafted in this time frame and where:
2010: Jack Campbell 10
2011: Jamie Oleksiak 14
2012: Radek Faksa 13
2013: Nichuskin 10
2014: Honka 14
2015: Gurianov 12
Then they did sneak in and make a run but fell short
2016: Riley Tufte 25
Then 2017 they stunk, and this was the draft that changed their team:
3 Heiskanen
26 Oettinger
39 Robertson

Most of their core drafted in their worst finish in more than a decade, allowing them to draft better players.
Add in some real luck on the Hintz pick... and there's the team.

IMO Dallas shows exactly why you have to suck bad for at least a season to build a competitor.

IMO tanking had little to do with getting Robertson or Oettinger.
They traded Eaves (a great move selling high - a weird career season - on an expiring contract) to get a pick (which was slightly later actually and they traded that pick and a third to move up three spots for Robertson. They just made good picks. And as good as Heiskenan is, they missed out on Makar.

[sketchyt]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

Wanna bet?

<Evander Kane has entered the chat>

[TheIronMaiden]

I don't think it's up for debate, if the Flames do wind up being a team competing for a championship next season it will be a huge exception to what is normal. The best teams load up of high draft picks and turn them into star players.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden

We sucked bad and drafted a handful of good players, but that was a while ago. Those good players left.

We drafted inside the top 6 three out of four years but It's been 7 drafts since we drafted Tkachuk at 6.

I did a big break down a few weeks ago. In the last 20 years only two teams have won without drafting multiple players in the top 5 picks a few years before winning the cup. Detroit and Vegas.

TB did it 3 times but it was a decade after picking Stamkos and Hedman before they won the cup. The other top 5 pick was Drouin (LOL). Their success was getting good players like Point, Kucherov, Vasilevsky, Cirelli, etc in later picks.

Hell, the year they picked their best forward, they finished with 103 points and lost in the third round.

[TheIronMaiden]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

TB did it 3 times but it was a decade after picking Stamkos and Hedman before they won the cup. The other top 5 pick was Drouin (LOL). Their success was getting good players like Point, Kucherov, Vasilevsky, Cirelli, etc in later picks.

Hell, the year they picked their best forward, they finished with 103 points and lost in the third round.

They drafted Stamkos and Hedman 2008-2009 and 5-6 years later they were in the cup finals.

since they drafted those two they've made the playoffs 10 of 14 years. They made 4 trips to the finals, won two cups.

No one is suggesting you draft 1stOA and then go on to win a cup in two years, what we are saying is good teams, that are consistently in the championship picture have drafted well. A part of drafting well is picking consistently in the top 10 for a few years. Hell that's how the Flames were good for the bit that they were. Monahan and Tkachuk were a huge part of this teams success, but that era is over.