Mike Fisher stands with Aaron Rodgers

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by opendoor

What problem would that solve?

You need to understand, most people are reasonable and not ideological. You're coming at this from an ideological angle (if x is OK then why isn't y?). But most people don't think that way and look at things on a case-by-case basis. If a rule has obvious utility, people generally support it. So people are OK with requiring vaccination in certain situations during a pandemic, but they're not OK with tattooing things on peoples' foreheads (which has no public utility) or (somehow) forcing women to get vaccinated against a non-contagious disease before engaging in sexual activity. If you think these are equivalent scenarios, then that's your problem, because almost everyone else understands the clear differences.

Everyone else is working too hard with their equivalencies, examples and responses towards Kipper3434. That's exactly what these people thrive on, it's what they want because they can rapid fire their social media bubble "research" at the sheeple, hence the back and forth going for pages.

Opendoor came in and just nailed it. Perfect.

[Cappy]

Originally Posted by burn_this_city

On Remembrance Day its particularly galling to see this garbage. You aren't a freedom fighter, just another coward who won't take a minor risk for the betterment of society. Draft dodger from a different era.

I like to think of them as Lindberghers.

Going to war is serious. These people aren’t willing to do even the slightest stuff to assist the effort.

I read recently that carpooling was a WW2 invention to save gas for the war effort. These people wouldn’t even do such a thing cuz of ma free dumbs

[Samonadreau]

I love that argument, "If the vaccine is so great, why are people still getting covid". So that same statement would apply even if it greatly reduced the chances and you were 20x less likely to be hospitalized.

Its like if 1 person who gets vaccinated is hospitalized and the antivaxxers say "see that vaccine is a hoax".... No, it just prevented 19 other people from being hospitalized.

Life is hard for some people.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Kipper_3434

Driving is a privilege. Existing and living a normal life are privileges too? Don't get into politics. Again you don't need photo I.d. to participate in life, except for in a few exceptions ( driving, going to a bar, boarding an international flight, showing that you are vaccinated, thus having taken the necessary steps to help minimize the spread of a raging virus.) What kind of totalian monster equates participating with society as a privilege? You do realize driving for the purposes of work is protected as a right? The court works with people who have their license suspended do to intoxication as long as they need to drive for work.

The only similarity between drivers licenses and vaxports is the photo I.d. aspect. Everything else is a stretch.

FYP (bold)

Also, yes, those who need to drive for work are supported in that endeavor, because helping them is good for society. Society deems it good and beneficial for all, to support individuals being able to work. That is something society chooses to do, for the overall benefit of the individual and of society. Society grants that privilege in this case, even though the person hasn't earned it. That does not mean that driving is a right.

Every minute of every day, you are conforming to the rules and norms of society. That is the price you pay in order to participate. If you are unable to recognize those conformations, and you are unaware that this is happening every moment of your life that you are outside your own home, well, that's on you.

Do you put pants on in the morning before you head out of the house? Do you do that because you think pants are nifty? Or do you do that because playing within the (very mild and flexible) rules of society demands that you do?

Is it a right to wear pants (or insert a million other tiny rules or norms)? Or is it an obligation to be met in order to participate in a functioning society?

This is not rocket surgery. Every 3 year old learns that they either follow the rules, or they spend time in their room. "Yes, Johnny, there are consequences to your actions and choices".

Originally Posted by Kipper_3434

You didn't answer the question . Its almost like equating 2 vaguely similar ideas is ridiculous. Eg: drivers license = vaxport.

Thanks for playing.

What's cute about this post is that you actually appear to believe that you are 'winning'.

[PegCityFlamesFan]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

FYP (bold)

Also, yes, those who need to drive for work are supported in that endeavor, because helping them is good for society. Society deems it good and beneficial for all, to support individuals being able to work. That is something society chooses to do, for the overall benefit of the individual and of society. Society grants that privilege in this case, even though the person hasn't earned it. That does not mean that driving is a right.

Every minute of every day, you are conforming to the rules and norms of society. That is the price you pay in order to participate. If you are unable to recognize those conformations, and you are unaware that this is happening every moment of your life that you are outside your own home, well, that's on you.

Do you put pants on in the morning before you head out of the house? Do you do that because you think pants are nifty? Or do you do that because playing within the (very mild and flexible) rules of society demands that you do?

Is it a right to wear pants (or insert a million other tiny rules or norms)? Or is it an obligation to be met in order to participate in a functioning society?

This is not rocket surgery. Every 3 year old learns that they either follow the rules, or they spend time in their room. "Yes, Johnny, there are consequences to your actions and choices".




What's cute about this post is that you actually appear to believe that you are 'winning'.

Amazing. Had me laugh out loud. Well done sir.

[Cappy]

Originally Posted by Kipper_3434

Driving is a privilege. Existing and living a normal life are privileges too? Don't get into politics. Again you don't need photo I.d. to participate in life, except for in a few exceptions ( driving, going to a bar, boarding an international flight.) What kind of totalian monster equates participating with society as a privilege? You do realize driving for the purposes of work is protected as a right? The court works with people who have their license suspended do to intoxication as long as they need to drive for work.

The only similarity between drivers licenses and vaxports is the photo I.d. aspect. Everything else is a stretch.

This is utterly false. Driving for any purpose is not a right. A court allowing a dui driver to continue to drive to and from work is not due to a rights violation.

[GreenLantern2814]

Here are some real numbers, for the people I’ll politely call “skeptics”:

87.6% of the Alberta population over 12 has received at least a first dose of a vaccine.

81.5% of the Alberta population over 12 has received 2 doses.

The date is November 11.

The time is 12:01.

The war is over.

You can accept the terms of the surrender or you can hang out in the woods like some renegade Japanese infantryman for the next 30 years who won’t believe the newspapers, their commanding officers, their family members, or the emperor himself that the war is over.

The choice is yours, but the surest way to move past these restrictions is to find your courage and do something 87.6% of the population of this province has already done.

The less of a fuss you make, the less likely people will be to hold this against you for the rest of your lives.

That’s what you’re playing for now. I hope you realize that.

The rest of us are as sick as you are of COVID being the dominant topic of every conversation and interaction. I promise, we’re done with it.

You’re not special.

You are making it take longer.

The longer you resist, the greater the scorn that will be heaped upon you as the numbers of unvaccinated continue to tick down.

And that’s all it will be - scorn. Righteous, deserved scorn.

Nobody is going to kick down your door.

Nobody is going to hold you down and jab you on the floor of your living room.

No, the only thing nobody is going to do is play with you.

They won’t invite you to anything.

They’ll stop answering your texts or reacting to funny videos you send.

They’ll just be done with you.

And you may wonder why, but deep down, you’ll know why.

And you’ll know you were wrong.

So, pretty please, with sugar on top, come back to the light and get ####ing vaccinated.

[timun]

Originally Posted by Kipper_3434

Let's protect the Healthcare system by firing everyone who refuses to get jabbed.

Yes, let's. They're a hazard to themselves, their patients, and society at large.

These are trained medical professionals losing their jobs because they don't trust that the medical science has been thoroughly proven .

Obviously the training didn't sink in, because a health care professional would have to forget everything they ever learned about epidemiology to choose to not get vaccinated. That they "don't trust the medical science" is demonstrable proof of gross incompetence.

Frankly, they deserve to be fired.

[Salt Water Cowboy #10]

Originally Posted by timun

Yes, let's. They're a hazard to themselves, their patients, and society at large.



Obviously the training didn't sink in, because a health care professional would have to forget everything they ever learned about epidemiology to choose to not get vaccinated. That they "don't trust the medical science" is demonstrable proof of gross incompetence.

Frankly, they deserve to be fired.

I kind of get where you’re coming from. But If the medical professionals refuse to be vax’d, what happens to them after they are fired? By your logic they will inevitably catch Covid outside the hospital or wherever they previously worked. Then, they may end up back in there as a patient with Covid. Why not just keep them in the hospital working like they’ve been trained to do? We need more healthcare workers, not less. They’ve been working through this the whole time.

However, anyone not in healthcare should have to be immunized if their employers deem it necessary.

[Macindoc]

Originally Posted by timun

Yes, let's. They're a hazard to themselves, their patients, and society at large.



Obviously the training didn't sink in, because a health care professional would have to forget everything they ever learned about epidemiology to choose to not get vaccinated. That they "don't trust the medical science" is demonstrable proof of gross incompetence.

Frankly, they deserve to be fired.

Thank you!

It never ceases to amaze me how some health care professionals choose be willfully ignorant about COVID-19 and the MRNA vaccines. All you have to do is look what's in the vaccine to understand its safety.

The vaccine contains, in order of % content, water, salt, PEG3350 (the laxative most commonly recommended by doctors), and the MRNA that codes for the production of the COVID-19 spike protein. Certain cells in your immune system take up that mRNA, and it is transported to those cells' ribosomes (the organelle that produces proteins), and they begin to produce the spike protein and express it on their surface for the rest of the immune system to see, resulting in the production of long-lasting antibodies and the production of immune cells that "remember" the spike protein so that they can respond to it more quickly if they see it again. That's it. If you have an adverse reaction to a dose of the vaccine, it's either from a rare anaphylactic reaction to PEG3350, from the breaking of the skin with a needle and the injection of something into your muscle (causing limited local trauma and rare infections), or from a reaction to the spike protein. Because the only "active ingredient" in the vaccine is the spike protein nMRA, there literally isn't anything else that the vaccine can do to you.

COVID-19 is everywhere. You literally can't go anywhere without potentially being exposed to it. It is my firm belief that anyone who has any direct physical contact with the outside world will be exposed to it. And it is highly infectious, so everyone who is exposed to it will get it, unless they are immune due to previous infection or the vaccine, and even some of the latter will still get it (though less severely due to at least partial immunity).

You know what happens when you get COVID-19? It injects its mRNA into your cells and forces them to produce all of the proteins and mRNA strands that are needed to assemble more viral particles, including the spike protein. And then those viral proteins and mRNA strands are assembled into more COVID-19 particles, which then infect more cells, causing an ongoing production of more and more of the spike protein. And because the body is producing much more spike protein with a COVID-19 infection than from a vaccination, all of the adverse reactions that can happen with the vaccine also happen to people who get COVID-19, except with a much higher incidence and severity in those who get the infection.

If people can accept the inevitability of being exposed to and being vulnerable to infection from COVID-19, then they need to also accept the inevitability that their bodies will produce the spike protein. It's not a question of if, but when, how much, and under what circumstances.

As I have opined above, aside from very rare cases of PEG3350 anaphylaxis, all of the possible severe (but rare) outcomes from immunization with an mRNA vaccine result from the body producing the spike protein (presumably because it causes an inflammatory reaction, and may have some cross-reactivity with proteins in and around the heart and lungs, in particular). But if there is no way to avoid COVID-19, all we can truly decide is the manner in which our bodies are producing the protein. In the case of the vaccine, a fixed amount of the spike protein mRNA is administered. The mRNA coding for the rest of the virus is absent, so no virus particles can be assembled, and no more mRNA can be produced. Once the spike protein mRNA is broken down, there is no more viral mRNA, so there is nothing to tell your cells to produce more spike protein. But if you get infected, the cycle of spike protein and mRNA production goes on and on and on, for days and sometimes weeks. So the only choice we truly have is between having our bodies produce the spike protein in a limited way that we control, or surrendering our bodies to produce it in a way that is controlled by the virus. Unless you're a hermit who is completely self-sufficient and self-contained, with no contact with the outside world, there is no third option.

People should think of it like this: if they had a malignant melanoma that would kill them if not removed, and they had to choose someone to remove it, would they choose a plastic surgeon, or a serial killer? Yes, there is a small chance that something bad could happen if they chose the surgeon to remove it. But the risk is mitigated by the training and the motivation of the surgeon. Would anyone prefer to take their chances with the serial killer instead?

Because that's what COVID-19 is. A serial killer.

[timun]

Originally Posted by Salt Water Cowboy #10

I kind of get where you’re coming from. But If the medical professionals refuse to be vax’d, what happens to them after they are fired?

I don't give a damn what happens to them.

By your logic they will inevitably catch Covid outside the hospital or wherever they previously worked.

I never suggested that, you're putting words in my mouth. They are, however, at a demonstrably higher risk of catching it.

Then, they may end up back in there as a patient with Covid.

And I'd feel a whole lot of schadenfreude for their self-inflicted predicament.

Why not just keep them in the hospital working like they’ve been trained to do?

Because by their action they are incompetent, and putting patients and every other health care worker there at risk by continuing to do their job without being vaccinated. Refusing to get vaccinated means they're too stupid to trust with continuing to be employed as a health care worker.

[Kipper_3434]

Originally Posted by timun

I don't give a damn what happens to them.



I never suggested that, you're putting words in my mouth. They are, however, at a demonstrably higher risk of catching it.



And I'd feel a whole lot of schadenfreude for their self-inflicted predicament.



Because by their action they are incompetent, and putting patients and every other health care worker there at risk by continuing to do their job without being vaccinated. Refusing to get vaccinated means they're too stupid to trust with continuing to be employed as a health care worker.

They weren't incompetent for the first 16 months of the pandemic. Shame on you and shame on the government weebs firing useful people for religious and personal belief. These ppl were heroes. Now you don't give a damn about them. At least now we know it has nothing to do with caring about the public in your case.

Also Shadenfraud ? Really? Might wanna look up that definition.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Kipper_3434

They weren't incompetent for the first 16 months of the pandemic. Shame on you and shame on the government weebs firing useful people for religious and personal belief. These ppl were heroes. Now you don't give a damn about them. At least now we know it has nothing to do with caring about the public in your case.

Also Shadenfraud ? Really? Might wanna look up that definition.

Maybe they were. Or maybe they were griping about “just the flu” or protesting masking. What we know now is that they are endangering their patients.

What religious belief? I’ve not seen any such position from any religion (including CS and JW, who do not forbid vaccines).

This is such an overblown tale. Way back in June 96% of MDs in the US were vaccinated. I’d expect the number here is similar if not greater. In BC we’re talking 2.6% unvaccinated, and that’s all health care workers, not just “front-line workers”.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by Kipper_3434

They weren't incompetent for the first 16 months of the pandemic. Shame on you and shame on the government weebs firing useful people for religious and personal belief. These ppl were heroes. Now you don't give a damn about them. At least now we know it has nothing to do with caring about the public in your case.

Also Shadenfraud ? Really? Might wanna look up that definition.

The first 16 months, they didn’t have vaccines.

It’s akin to soldiers not having helmets - at the beginning of World War 1, they straight up didn’t have any.

When they did, you didn’t have people declining helmets due to their own personal research on the efficacy of helmets.

You wear a helmet into war.

You get vaccinated against the contagious airborne virus if you want to work among the contagious airborne virus.

If you’re that unsure of the vaccines, maybe medicine isn’t the right field for you.

[Macindoc]

Originally Posted by Kipper_3434

They weren't incompetent for the first 16 months of the pandemic. Shame on you and shame on the government weebs firing useful people for religious and personal belief. These ppl were heroes. Now you don't give a damn about them. At least now we know it has nothing to do with caring about the public in your case.

Also Shadenfraud ? Really? Might wanna look up that definition.

Doctors weren't incompetent 50 years ago for not using tPA for the treatment of acute heart attacks and strokes. Now that it's available, they're incompetent if they don't, and most people who get help soon enough survive as a result.

Competence requires that you have a good understanding of and willingness to use the best currently available treatment and prevention strategies. Which, in the current discussion, is any of the mRNA vaccines. Any health care worker who does not advocate the universal use of mRNA COVID-19 vaccines for all who are eligible doesn't understand how they work, and is therefore not competent to provide patients with advice regarding the vaccines.

[djsFlames]

Yeah, imagine conscription in this day and age with these snowflakes.

[Samonadreau]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

Yeah, imagine conscription in this day and age with these snowflakes.

They'd probably be ok with that though because it's not just about you, its about Protecting your Family and fellow Canadians from harm...... oh, wait

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

Yeah, imagine conscription in this day and age with these snowflakes.

“Whaddaya mean ‘Skip the Dishes’ only delivers as far as the artillery trench???’”

[timun]

Originally Posted by Kipper_3434

They weren't incompetent for the first 16 months of the pandemic.

They've been demonstrably incompetent by refusing vaccination for the last 10 months. They were some of the first in line, have had all the opportunity in the world to take it, and have refused. For that, absolutely they're incompetent. Willfully and shamefully.

Shame on you and shame on the government weebs firing useful people for religious and personal belief.

Nah, shame on you. Your BS in this thread, including this post, is absolutely absurd. #### your "religious and personal belief".

These ppl were heroes. Now you don't give a damn about them.

Whatever they were before it's irrelevant: they're villains now. They're selfish fools putting everyone else around them at risk. They absolutely deserve derision and scorn at this point.

At least now we know it has nothing to do with caring about the public in your case.

Nah man, it's all about public health. If these unvaccinated dopes cared about the public, about anyone but themselves, they'd have been vaccinated months and months ago.

Also Shadenfraud ? Really? Might wanna look up that definition.

Lol, if anyone needs the dictionary it's you, bud. You might want to bust it out and learn how to spell in the first place.

[undercoverbrother]