[PGT] The curse continues. Flames lose 5-3. Score flatters Flames.

[combustiblefuel]

Originally Posted by KootenayFlamesFan

I think there are issues everywhere. Not like the sky is falling, but they can indeed improve pretty much everywhere.

One of those areas is goaltending. This franchise needs to figure out who will be the go-to guy for the next 5 years. Not throw a bunch of 'maybes' out there and see what sticks. They need someone to rely on. We don't have that yet.

Also known as the "Edmonton Solution to goaltending"

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by KootenayFlamesFan

I think there are issues everywhere. Not like the sky is falling, but they can indeed improve pretty much everywhere.

One of those areas is goaltending. This franchise needs to figure out who will be the go-to guy for the next 5 years. Not throw a bunch of 'maybes' out there and see what sticks. They need someone to rely on. We don't have that yet.

Respectfully disagree. (I mean a Kipper would be great but the timing of this remark is in a night where Ramo was not bad in any way)

Ramo is fine. Team in front of him is awful. Especially high paid D not named Brodie.

Statistically you have many good teams like Chicago playing Crawford and Detroit playing Howard.

The era of riding goalies to the Cup is in the past.

Team D makes many average goalies look better than they are. It has been that way for some time. When Jacques Lemaire had Roloson and Fernandez putting up .930+ it should have been noticed.

Goaltending here may not be Price/Lundquist but it is not that bad. Team defense is ridiculously poor.

Ramo got roasted for a bar down goal after Hamilton let Rakell walk around, there was a bang-bang play from behind the net in front that no goalie could be expected to stop (and which he read well and reacted to but time was not on his side) and 50 goal Perry beat him on a clear breakaway. And the other goal he let in, he had to cheat towards the many options left by the Keystone cop D positioning leaving too many options.

Rough night to play behind that crap.

And that blocker save he made was trending towards scorpion worthy

[Resolute 14]

Got up 2-0 and called it a night.

Pathetic effort last night and they got what they deserved.

[Erick Estrada]

Observations;

• Goaltending still stinks. Ramo fans can write a 10 page essay on how the defense doesn't help him out and it wouldn't matter because you can't hide from soft goals. The evidence doesn't lie. Even below average NHL goaltenders don't let in soft goals as much as Ramo does.
• Giordano having his worst season of his career. Good thing it's on the final year of his contract as it will me much easier to bargain for a lower salary and term. What's that? You signed him to a long term deal with a year left on his deal after a career season? Doh!
• Team defense is a train wreck. The last time it looked this bad was Hartley's first season as Flames coach. It's a disturbing pattern as even under Keenan they never played this poor in their own zone.
• Not to be outdone by the poor defensive coverage special teams are a total disaster. The powerplay looks like it may never score again and the penalty kill is killing the teams chances of winning games.
• Josh Jooris is not an NHL player. Last season was nice and all but time to send this guy down to the AHL and move on.
• Offensive depth is poor. The team solely relies on Bennett, Gaudreau, and Monahan for offense and what successful team relies this much on such young players to create all their offense?

Easily the most frustrating Flames team in a long time because we know what they did last year and this year there's that helpless feeling of a disaster unfolding right in front of your eyes and there's seemingly nothing that can be done about it.

Positive is that this is the best time to truly evaluate what you have as opposed to last season where everyone had career years. Guys like Backlund, Wideman and Russell are not part of the future. Giordano isn't an elite defenseman. Ramo and Hiller can start planning for their careers outside the NHL because they will both be history after game 82. Hartley's coaching methods and systems simply look outdated in today's NHL. Effort isn't enough as there needs to be structure. This is simply a bad team that's being poorly coached. I'm looking forward to the end of the season so we can move on without some of these players and maybe Hartley.

[heep223]

Same old story. Can't keep the puck out of our net. The difference last night was another soft goal, Hamilton getting danced and a brain fart on the PK. It's pretty embarrassing.

Offence not really an issue, secondary scoring has been there, Frolik had 2 last night and Jones has been producing. Top line had a couple grade A chances last night that could have easily gone in.

The problem is still defence and goaltending. And coaching (special teams). I'm starting to lose faith in our coaching staff, they're not making adjustments to our special teams and horrible breakout.

[burn_this_city]

Wideman needs to sit or be sent down for a bit, he's a blackhole both offensively and defensively. So many promising offensive opportunities end up on his stick and out of the zone or turned over.

[-TC-]

Ferland, Jooris, Bollig - send them all down to the farm and bring up... I don't know. I'm looking at the farm and shrugging.

I'm at a complete loss. I don't know how the team we saw last year became this team.

[troutman]

I'm worried about Johnny on the road. Pointless in his last 5 road games? Can he be neutralized away from the Dome?

[sparky69]

bad news flames lose. Got news I put $5 for them to lose and won $15.

[CroFlames]

Originally Posted by troutman

I'm worried about Johnny on the road. Pointless in his last 5 road games? Can he be neutralized away from the Dome?

I'm definitely not "worried" about Johnny or that the league has figured him out. He has a special skill set and is exceptional at creating space.

He had a bad night last night (by his standards) and was fighting the puck a lot I found.

His scoring slumps I think are due to overall bad teamplay and not a function of Johnny losing his drive/touch or the league figuring him out.

Gio on the other hand... How can a guy go from a top tier (dare I say elite?) d-man the past 2 seasons to someone who's play is comparable to a middling bottom pairing defender? I legit thought he would have shaken it off by now, it's beginning to become a concern. Is he trying too much because of the big payday? Is he trying too much because the team is playing poorly all round?

I'm really not sure what Gio's problem is, and I hate to put so much pressure on him, but the fabled turnaround has to start from him again. That's what being a Captain is about. I think he's one of the biggest reasons the team made a turnaround in the 2nd half of 13/14 and why they were a playoff team in 14/15. If they are to be relevant this year, it NEEDS to start with Mr Mark Giordano.

[tvp2003]

Pretty demoralizing loss considering we managed to have the lead going into the third, and how well they've played recently (including the last game against Chicago). The resiliency just isn't there, I think that starts with the Captain's struggles and goes down the line. The silver lining is that there are two more games left on this road trip -- both against divisional opponents -- so two opportunities to salvage the trip and stay in the hunt.

The blueline was the reason why this team had success last year, and it is the reason why they are struggling this year. Little offence generated and too many defensive lapses that aren't being masked because of average goaltending.

But last night was horrid to watch. Unable to connect on passes, turnovers all over the place, no jam or hustle. And we let their best players dictate the play -- similar to the 4-1 loss against Chicago on Nov 15. Hopefully they can bounce back in a similar manner because I'm not convinced they are nearly as bad as they looked last night.

[codynw]

Originally Posted by -TC-

Ferland, Jooris, Bollig - send them all down to the farm and bring up... I don't know. I'm looking at the farm and shrugging.

I'm at a complete loss. I don't know how the team we saw last year became this team.

I thought Ferland had a decent game last night. Am I the only one?

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

Respectfully disagree. (I mean a Kipper would be great but the timing of this remark is in a night where Ramo was not bad in any way)

Ramo is fine. Team in front of him is awful. Especially high paid D not named Brodie.

Statistically you have many good teams like Chicago playing Crawford and Detroit playing Howard.

The era of riding goalies to the Cup is in the past.

Team D makes many average goalies look better than they are. It has been that way for some time. When Jacques Lemaire had Roloson and Fernandez putting up .930+ it should have been noticed.

Goaltending here may not be Price/Lundquist but it is not that bad. Team defense is ridiculously poor.

Ramo got roasted for a bar down goal after Hamilton let Rakell walk around, there was a bang-bang play from behind the net in front that no goalie could be expected to stop (and which he read well and reacted to but time was not on his side) and 50 goal Perry beat him on a clear breakaway. And the other goal he let in, he had to cheat towards the many options left by the Keystone cop D positioning leaving too many options.

Rough night to play behind that crap.

And that blocker save he made was trending towards scorpion worthy

The first goal Ramo let in last night was terrible. Other than he was ok. Made a few very nice saves. My comment wasn't a result of last night's game, or intended to bash Ramo.

When I look at this team at the present and future there is no doubt goaltending is a massive question mark. Ramo is just ok. Hiller is just ok. Ortio is a huge question mark. Ditto for the guys on the farm and prospects like McDonald. The fact we have no idea what is going to happen to any of the goalies on the big team when they are all healthy or who will get the starts speaks volumes.

I'm not looking for a hall of famer, or Price or Lundqvist. I would just like to see someone on the team that can carry the load for a few years and not be detriment or a massive question mark.

[polak]

Giordano and Wideman are the worst players on this team.

But back to my fire Hartley routine.... WHY IN ALL THAT IS ####ING HOLY WAS THE RAYMOND LINE ON THE ICE WITH THE GOALIE PULLED?!?!?!

[Hells Bells]

Jooris came out of nowhere. Can they send him back there now?

[GioforPM]

1 softy (yes, the shooter was open, but in tight and the puck "slips under" Ramo). And yes, he made other good saves.
1 bad D play by Hamilton. And yes, he looked better at other times.
1 bad PK play by Jooris and Gio - trying to make a fancy play on the PK when the game is tied. Someone blamed Stajan, but I can't see how he was at fault.

That said, the Ducks played the top line very well - Kesler [spits] was good against Monahan, and the top line of the Ducks owned the Flames like in the POs.

Flames had chances but needed more shots on Gibson, because he was giving up rebounds (just like the starter).

[CroFlames]

Originally Posted by codynw

I thought Ferland had a decent game last night. Am I the only one?

He played decent, considering. I think he was fighting the puck a little, but it seemed like everyone was. Even Mr Soft hands Johnny.

At least he was skating hard.

[Huntingwhale]

Originally Posted by codynw

I thought Ferland had a decent game last night. Am I the only one?

Ferland looked great I thought. Too bad he's playing with bummy Bollig.

[Flash Walken]

That's a really ugly game if Khubodin doesn't spot the Flames an early 2 goal lead with his best Ramo impression.

I don't blame Hamilton too much on that Rakell goal. He got walked around because the entire team was in poor position. That's supposed to be the centre's man, and David Jones did a poor job covering the centre ice position. Also worth noting on that goal that it was a 2-0 below the faceoff dot as Russell also found himself out of position.

Ugly defending.

I honestly think the biggest difference between this year's team and last year's team is the play of Kris Russell. He's throwing off every pairing he's on and juggling the lines to try to get him going/keep him sheltered isn't doing anyone a favour.

[Travis Munroe]

Ferland looked very good on the top line with Mony and Johny. As I already posted, he has the capability to power the puck into the zone where as Mony and Johny need to get fancy with it. Ferland is also a very good skater.
I hope he gets another crack next game with them and Hudler goes to the 2nd/3rd line.