QOTD: Would you deal Curtis Glencross?

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Hackey

Wow were comparing Glencross to Crosby now lol.

Seriously, is that the best you've got? If you think that's an intelligent reply to my post, well... cheers, dude.

[Burner]

I want a top rated defenceman prospect for him. We have only one young defenceman - Wotherspoon - who is ready to step up and show what he can do. Some younger talent still learning the trade at the pro level but not ready for the big show yet

I think we have lots of forward depth that is ready to try and take the step up.

[Lanny_McDonald]

The reason you trade Glencross is so you don't become the Oilers. Organizational depth is built through later picks. The more picks you have the better chance at finding that depth you have. I'd rather have a shot at selecting a Brodie or Gaudreau's than not. Glencross looks to be done with the Flames. Take what you can and build for the future.

[Hackey]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Seriously, is that the best you've got? If you think that's an intelligent reply to my post, well... cheers, dude.

Well it doesn't really make sense. Obviously they welcome Crosby back because he is the best player on the planet. He is going to significantly help that team and is irreplaceable. The difference between Glencross and one of the many players we can replace him with is marginal. Meaning his "loss" isn't that significant.

[Vulcan]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

So rebuild over. Got it.

No you don't "Got it", I said the circumstances have changed.

[Moneyhands23]

Dudes gotta go

[Dajazz]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

Then again, why pick anyone, ever?

Why not just trade all your picks for a 1st rounder or roster players?

Because at some point, you have to have players play for your team. Glencross won't be a flame in a matter of weeks. Trading him provides something to the team long after he's gone.

You've got a jug of milk that is about to expire. You can try to sell it at the same price as milk that isn't going to expire, you can cut the price to encourage someone to buy your about-to-expire milk or you can hold onto it and hope it turns into sour cream.

Personally, I would sell the milk, even for a reduced cost, in order to create a spot on my retail shelf for another milk product. I'd use the money I made from the soon-to-be-expired milk to buy more milk that wasn't as close to expiring.

Maybe I originally bought the milk for more than I'll end up selling it for, but at least I got something for it and I'm not having to go out and buy replacement milk for an even greater cost.

Or do the obvious and drink it. Or make a cookie.

[Itse]

Needed a couple days to let this one stew and read the arguments, but decided to vote #3. If I look at it as a binary question, rebuilding is more important than what Glencross brings.

Obviously you don't trade him for nothing, but I'm confident he'll bring in a low 2nd rounder at worst.

(But again, if he doesn't want to waive, you don't pressure him.)

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

LA, Montreal, TB and Nashville seem to be ignored here, as they don't fit the narrative

LA amassed picks and had high picks.

2005: #11 overall and two 2nd round picks
2006: #11 overall, #17 overall and a 2nd round pick
2007: #4 overall and two 2nd round picks
2008: #2 overall, #11 overall, and three 3rd round picks
2009: #5 overall and a 2nd round pick

So did TB:

2008: #1 overall
2009: #2 overall, #29 overall and a 2nd round pick
2010: #6 overall and three 3rd round picks
2012: #10 overall, #19 overall, and two 2nd round picks
2013: #3 overall

Nashville and Montreal are riding uber-elite goalies.

[Itse]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Nashville and Montreal are riding uber-elite goalies.

Nashville also stole a great prospect in Forsberg from Washington. What a ridiculous trade that was then, and looking absolutely terrible now.

[Heavy Jack]

He looks like a shell of his former self. Bouma is playing his role now and executing it at a more consistent pace the last 10 games. Is that sustainable?? I think Bouma will level out but his determination and the way he plays the game will stay consistent which to me is yet another reason we should ship Glencross out. I'd rather see a skilled winger like Poirier or Baertschi come up from Addy to fill a winger spot then have Glencross taking up deminished minutes as he continues to fall from his peak.

[Dajazz]

So we bring up a guy from the AHL to play the toughest minutes on the team while clinging on to a play off spot? Awesome, Sven Baertschi on the PK lining up against Perry.

Also, if he sucks so bad as many think, why would another GM even touch him with a pole?

Lastly, I'd trade him for the right return. But a 2nd or 3rd pick, no, its not worth it. 1st yes, or young roster player with good potential.

I get the while rebuild thing, we are not winning the cup this year. But I'd rather see this core battle it out in the playoffs this year. Never go full Oiler.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by Dajazz

So we bring up a guy from the AHL to play the toughest minutes on the team while clinging on to a play off spot? Awesome, Sven Baertschi on the PK lining up against Perry.

Also, if he sucks so bad as many think, why would another GM even touch him with a pole?

Lastly, I'd trade him for the right return. But a 2nd or 3rd pick, no, its not worth it. 1st yes, or young roster player with good potential.

I get the while rebuild thing, we are not winning the cup this year. But I'd rather see this core battle it out in the playoffs this year. Never go full Oiler.

I think he needs a change of address and I suspect the GM's calling about Glencross feel the same. On a different team I think he can still be a valuable hockey player - just not here.

I agree about the right return and I think he stays if Treliving doesn't get a fair offer.

Finally there's a part of me that thinks the looming trade deadline has been a bad distraction for Glencross. His play since the AS break has not been good. We need his goal production and we're not getting it.

[Heavy Jack]

Originally Posted by Dajazz

So we bring up a guy from the AHL to play the toughest minutes on the team while clinging on to a play off spot? Awesome, Sven Baertschi on the PK lining up against Perry.

Also, if he sucks so bad as many think, why would another GM even touch him with a pole?

Lastly, I'd trade him for the right return. But a 2nd or 3rd pick, no, its not worth it. 1st yes, or young roster player with good potential.

I get the while rebuild thing, we are not winning the cup this year. But I'd rather see this core battle it out in the playoffs this year. Never go full Oiler.

Glencross is not playing the toughest minutes the last 20 games. His minutes have decreased and he isn't shutting down top lines anymore thats the Bouma-Backlund-Jones line. I think that point got lost in my post, I feel Bouma is doing for us what Glencross was doing and I'd perfer to see Glenny traded so a guy like Sven, or Granny, or wolf can slot in on the 3rd line with Jooris and Raymond.

[The Original FFIV]

Originally Posted by Dajazz

So we bring up a guy from the AHL to play the toughest minutes on the team while clinging on to a play off spot? Awesome, Sven Baertschi on the PK lining up against Perry.

Also, if he sucks so bad as many think, why would another GM even touch him with a pole?

Lastly, I'd trade him for the right return. But a 2nd or 3rd pick, no, its not worth it. 1st yes, or young roster player with good potential.

I get the while rebuild thing, we are not winning the cup this year. But I'd rather see this core battle it out in the playoffs this year. Never go full Oiler.

No offense but this argument is a load of crap. Trading a ufa at the deadline is not going full oiler. If we were trading Hudler who has been a big part of the success this year, yes, that would be oileresque. But Glencross has been a support player this gear who may have value to a contender looking for depth on a playoff run. To not capitialize on acquiring a high draft pick would be daft. Treliving is a big picture guy and if he can get a high pick (2nd or higher) for someone who doesn't fit long term, I trust he will do the right thing and keep building a contender that will compete and be positioned to go deep in the playoffs.

[Calgary4LIfe]

I don't quite understand the argument: "He hasn't produced in x amount of games" argument. He has ALWAYS been a streaky player. He goes through periods of time where he scores in bunches, and bouts where he doesn't at all. Simply saying he hasn't scored lately, so the Flames won't miss him, doesn't make sense to me. He is having a decent year by practically every measure. His goal scoring is down a bit, but his points aren't.

On top of this, he is a guy that does play against the very toughest of opponents night in and night out. He is one of the few gritty players this team has at the moment as well. He most certainly makes Hartley's job a bit easier given his versatility, making it easier to match lines. Plus - and this is one part of him that I have always questioned - he apparently does deserve that 'A'. I remember reading not too long ago that he has been a huge help with the rookies and helping them get acclimated to life in the NHL.

Also, the team trading for him will reap some benefit. That should come at a cost. Flames are not a 'feeder' team to help any other team's playoff drive for a bargain.

Now, what is it worth? Again, I don't know how to make an approximate valuation. Flash Walken quoted me in one of his replies earlier (don't feel like searching for it) to Mastadon in part of the fan's wish to retain him foolishly. I think very, very few fans are wishing to actually retain Glencross here. What fans are trying to decide is what the above is worth.

Depth Scoring (.54 PPG) + Leadership + Grit + Versatility + QofComp
=
? (pick and/or prospects) + Possible 'deflating' of the locker room if moved

The real big argument is centered on what the Flames should receive in return for letting this asset go now and go without until the end of the season/possibly playoffs.

In my opinion, it isn't 'anything you can get', or 'anything is better than nothing'. You aren't getting 'nothing', you are getting the remaining games in the season + possibly some playoff games' worth of what he is providing. There has to be a certain price that is fair for the Flames to do without.

Is he irreplaceable? No. I don't think anyone is saying this. He is who he has always been - a streaky depth scorer that can be moved up and down the lineup and who provides loads of versatility. Personally, I would be ok with a '2nd' or a 'decent' (not blue chip of course) prospect. Any more than that would make me happy. Any less would make me feel the Flames were not compensated enough. Of course, this is my own personal valuation - maybe some of the people who are willing to trade Glencross away for 'anything at all' are the same people who dislike him on the team and feel he is addition by subtraction, or has become totally irrelevant and redundant with the depth of the prospect pool. Maybe this is why there is so much arguments back and forth.

[Heavy Jack]

^^^ I hate to think this group is so fragile that it would deflate if Glencross were to be traded (which I don't believe is the case) on top of that, as stated before Glencross has not been playing against the top lines, has not been playing the tough minutes since his injury and since coming back from said injury - basically since just before the all-star game. His point totals are down with the reduced role/minutes and there are a ton of hungrier players through out the line-up and down in Addy. I like Curtis, I like what he has done for this team, but he is not re-signing here and the smart move is to deal him now as it would seem the Flmaes are parting ways regardless.

[Tinordi]

Originally Posted by Heavy Jack

^^^ I hate to think this group is so fragile that it would deflate if Glencross were to be traded (which I don't believe is the case) on top of that, as stated before Glencross has not been playing against the top lines, has not been playing the tough minutes since his injury and since coming back from said injury - basically since just before the all-star game. His point totals are down with the reduced role/minutes and there are a ton of hungrier players through out the line-up and down in Addy. I like Curtis, I like what he has done for this team, but he is not re-signing here and the smart move is to deal him now as it would seem the Flmaes are parting ways regardless.

It's just more of the same non-sensical rationalizations to avoid making prudent asset driven decisions. For many it's what it means to be a fan. But I would concede that among the many rationalizations, the "morale will be hurt" is approaching bottom of the barrel.

[Tinordi]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

The same (empty) criticism could be made about the 'average Flames Fan' mentality on this board that believes that a 3rd round pick is somehow the yellow brick path to the cup while any NHL player over the age of 25 is a flying monkey, determined to undermine said path.

(the truth is usually in the middle somewhere)

One guy backed up that point quoting 15 posts. Another guy built a straw man that no one has actually said to criticize it.

[stone hands]

glencross of 2 years ago was my favorite flame

glencross of the last 2 years reminds me of the lazy entitled vet core we just shipped out

we now have a younger, faster no-look-backhand-giveaway machine in mason Raymond, playing on the same line no less

where do I sign?