Ken King Interveiw w/bob McCown

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by CSharp

This city has more money than brains. When you got 80% of the idiots (sorry if you're one of them) wanting Iggy out and start a team rebuild without thinking what the rebuild should look like and that all these ppl want is just to rebuild because the young and the restless is more exciting than watching a bunch of 30+ year-olds play, well, this is what it looks like. You don't trade a franchise player to start a rebuild when you're not gonna get back an equal or greater value than what he was when he was in his prime. If you know the value is gonna be crappy or unknown, why even bother making a trade and just let the guy retire with honour? There are other players that could and can fetch way more, but the Flames consistently get fleeced due to poor management.

If money keeps flowing out of fat cows like the Bow River, frick, management will try to milk the cows until they're run out of town. Why fix anything when there's endless money coming in? This is gonna be one long painful rebuilding process, probably longer that the one caused by Doug Riseborough.

Why would anyone trade a young 'in his prime' Iginla for an old broken down Iginla?

[Ped]

Honestly I think the trade sucks but I don't have an issue with the way Jarome handled it - I suspect they asked him for a list of teams he would consider a trade to, then tried to get a deal with one of those teams, and then Iginla had to decide to waive or not.

After all we saw with Morrow that they agreed to the trade and then asked him to waive - not the exact same situation I know but obviously Dallas was aware of the teams Morrow would most likely waive to go - and it wouldn't have been Florida or Colorado, for example.

And Iginla had the right based on a contract the Flames gave him.

To me the issue that makes it look as if this organization is rapidly losing credibility is that Boston was told they had a deal BEFORE Iginla was approached and asked to waive - Chiarelli should have been told that yes, the deal was in place but now Iginlas has to agree to it, not "Iginla is yours".

That's bush league and there's no way the apologists can escape that imo

[Eubee]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Pretty clear that in the end Iggy wouldnt waive for Boston even though they were on his list.

Shero said that at noon on Wednesday they thought they were out, while Chiarelli said they were informed they had Iginla around the same time.

We dont have full information on what happened after that but IMO it is pretty damn clear that the Flames ended up having to go back to Pittsburgh for some reason and I doubt it was their own accord since they have pretty much stated they preferred the Boston offer.

Not true, he would have waived for Boston if the Pitt deal was never there. Feaster failed to understand that the list of four was a short list only. Not sure how you don't get that clarification first.

[dino7c]

Iginla wouldn't re-sign at a reasonable number and would only waive to go to one team at the last minute. Anyone mad about the return can look to him for the reason it wasn't what many hoped for.

To me he could have not waived at all and left for nothing so I will take the first

[browna]

Originally Posted by IamNotKenKing

Thanks for adding this last part, but the "meddling" comment is simply not true. End of story. Ownership (King and higher) does have to sign off on economic decisions of a certain level, but that is it.

So you're saying Feaster has as much power and leeway as Sutter did 5 years ago when the Flames were riding high and were one of the most respected and desirable franchises in league?

I find that hard to believe.

Sutter lost some of that power in the last couple years and Feaster didn't seem to regain any of it (or is even that much worse of a GM). So who is the one that took that additional decision making and power on?

The whole structure seems dysfunctional from the time Feaster became AGM and Mr. Hotchkiss passed on. The results on the ice prove it, the additional drama off ice proves it, and the strong reputation that this franchise built up 2004-2008 is bring torn down rather quickly and dramatically as the ROR situation and KK throwing Iginla of all people, under the bus publically, also proves it.

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Iginla wouldn't re-sign at a reasonable number and would only waive to go to one team at the last minute. Anyone mad about the return can look to him for the reason it wasn't what many hoped for.

To me he could have not waived at all and left for nothing so I will take the first

You notice how every time this team makes a bad move (every move seems to be a bad move these days), they either try to ignore it or place the blame elsewhere?

Never do they acknowledge that they are a bunch of fools.

There is one consistency here. It's our management. They just aren't very smart.

[foshizzle11]

it is like people forget we got a 1st round draft pick, yes it might be late but this is a deep draft. We got something for Jarome, a 3rd, 5th and 1st round pick. We don't know how any of them will develop. It could have been nothing.

[VladtheImpaler]

Originally Posted by IamNotKenKing

Thanks for adding this last part, but the "meddling" comment is simply not true. End of story. Ownership (King and higher) does have to sign off on economic decisions of a certain level, but that is it.

So, to what do you ascribe the fact that the buffoonery level of the Flames organization has reached/exceeded that of the Oilers and the Islanders?

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by foshizzle11

it is like people forget we got a 1st round draft pick, yes it might be late but this is a deep draft. We got something for Jarome, a 3rd, 5th and 1st round pick. We don't know how any of them will develop. It could have been nothing, or we could have moved him 1 or 2 seasons ago and got a first, a blue chip and maybe a second.

fyp, which is why the trade is bull****, its like saying 'I know I didn't put oil in the car and the engine blew, but hey I got 150 bucks from the scrapyard!'

[liamenator]

This is such a mess. Even assuming the best case scenario--that after the ROR and Iginla debacles Edwards & co. are being 'intellectually honest' about the need for a complete organizational overhaul--they're stuck in the position of having to grant authority to an executive they no longer trust and are intending to let go to make a series of moves that are essential to the future of the franchise, and are time-sensitive to the extent that the time to maximize assets like Bouwmeester is now.

So what do you do? Cleaning house at this point, 5 days before deadline, is an impossibility. Is it enough to keep a watchful eye over the proceedings? Do you go into lockdown under the rationale that these guys are so inept it would be better to stand pat than allow them to continue pouring gasoline over the product, the brand, and its relations to the broader NHL community?

A total mess.

The only worse situation I can think of is that Edwards and co. aren't in such a pickle, because that would mean they still have faith in King, Feaster, et al.

[atb]

Originally Posted by Eubee

Not true, he would have waived for Boston if the Pitt deal was never there. Feaster failed to understand that the list of four was a short list only. Not sure how you don't get that clarification first.

I think Iggy would have been traded to Boston if his list was formalized in writing and submitted to the NHLPA.

What I think happened is Iggy changed his from when he was first asked to provide a list, basically narrowing it down to Pittsburgh (probably due to the run their on plus the pieces they added in Morrow and Murray). So Feaster went to Iginla at noon with the Boston trade, and since there was no written agreement, Iginla said he'd only waive for Pittsburgh. This put Feaster in a bind, forcing him to get the best deal possibly from Shero, without indicating that it was the only place Iggy wanted to go.

This is why there's a formal process when getting a list of teams. Can't blame Iggy for giving himself the best chance to win a cup.

[tfi racing]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

You notice how every time this team makes a bad move (every move seems to be a bad move these days), they either try to ignore it or place the blame elsewhere?

Never do they acknowledge that they are a bunch of fools.

There is one consistency here. It's our management. They just aren't very smart.

This fish stinks from the head on down.Until ownership wakes up to the fact that they are being duped by morons,nothing will improve.Responsibility for this mess is on the owners,plain and simple,
it doesn't matter if its apathy,ignorance or stupidity on their part,they still allowed this team to deteriorate to its current state.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

You notice how every time this team makes a bad move (every move seems to be a bad move these days), they either try to ignore it or place the blame elsewhere?

Never do they acknowledge that they are a bunch of fools.

There is one consistency here. It's our management. They just aren't very smart.

We sure are portraying ourselves as the victim a lot.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Eubee

Not true, he would have waived for Boston if the Pitt deal was never there. Feaster failed to understand that the list of four was a short list only. Not sure how you don't get that clarification first.

You're assuming that Iginla/Meehan conveyed that it was only a short-list. The Flames were under the impression that it wasn't, and given Meehan's reputation for always keeping his cards close to his chest, I tend to believe that there was an intention on Meehan's and Iginla's part to not offer too much information.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by IamNotKenKing

Thanks for adding this last part, but the "meddling" comment is simply not true. End of story. Ownership (King and higher) does have to sign off on economic decisions of a certain level, but that is it.

Lets presume you are right and KK and ownership do not "meddle". Does that mean Feaster on his own has done all these blunders? KK and Edwards must be the most tolerant owners and president in the league.

I just can't see how by now if Feaster had all the power that they would not have let him go?

Feaster since he came on has said we will not rebuild.... Its been less than 2 years and it looks like they are rebuilding

Feaster said when he first took the job that clauses were not going to be handed out like candy..... he gives them out to press box players

Feaster said that he wanted a flames team big and strong.... Feaster assembles the the softest team in the NHL

I won't even go into the ROR situation, considering you say that KK and ownership only sign off on things. There would be 4-5 grounds for dismisal in that one case alone to fire him.

[TKB]

I think it has become clear that Feaster and Lowe pound back beers together every weekend and "share in there management skills" with one another.....

[Zulu29]

Originally Posted by TKB

I think it has become clear that Feaster and Lowe pound back beers together every weekend and "share in there management skills" with one another.....

And what makes matters worse is Jay picks up the tab.

[monkeyman]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

Lets presume you are right and KK and ownership do not "meddle". Does that mean Feaster on his own has done all these blunders? KK and Edwards must be the most tolerant owners and president in the league.

Didn't want to quote the whole thing.
To pile on top, adding to what you said, these supposed acts of GM incompetency started with Button(Savard), then Sutter(Phaneuf), now Feaster(ROR/Iggy)? These problems are either systemic or much higher up than the GM, either way, it's time to clean house up top.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Just listened to the whole interview. Wasn't as bad as some made it out to be.

King didn't come out and say they should have gotten it in writing. McCown suggested he do it in the future and King agreed.

A few notable points.

Sounds like the Flames thought the deals were fairly close (or at least spinning it that way.)

King didn't seem to have regret that the Boston trade didn't work out which is contrary to the sentiment some have expressed in this thread.

I dunno I didn't think the interview made the organization look that bad. In fact its pretty clear we didn't try to strongarm Iginla just to make the best deal and did good by Iginla.

I'm fine with us accepting a slightly worse deal to give Iginla his choice.

Hopefully we get back another 1st rounder and some significant assets by next Wed afternoon.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

Just listened to the whole interview. Wasn't as bad as some made it out to be.

King didn't come out and say they should have gotten it in writing. McCown suggested he do it in the future and King agreed.

A few notable points.

Sounds like the Flames thought the deals were fairly close (or at least spinning it that way.)

King didn't seem to have regret that the Boston trade didn't work out which is contrary to the sentiment some have expressed in this thread.

I dunno I didn't think the interview made the organization look that bad. In fact its pretty clear we didn't try to strongarm Iginla just to make the best deal and did good by Iginla.

I'm fine with us accepting a slightly worse deal to give Iginla his choice.

Hopefully we get back another 1st rounder and some significant assets by next Wed afternoon.

I agree, but this is a double-edged sword. The organization did good by Iginla and they have a first round pick and some goodwill to show for that.

But that first round pick is going to suck.

Now, assume they want to trade Kipper, but he only wants to move if he has a chance to win, so he'll want to be traded to a good team and maybe you get a first for him as well. Well, now the organization will have done well by Kipper and gotten a first and some goodwill out of the deal.

That first round pick is also going to suck.

Then assume they want to trade Bouwmeester. I imagine hes only going to agree to move if he's traded to a team that he likes, presumably a good team. So the organization does right by Bouwmeester and trades him to a contending team and maybe gets a first round pick and some goodwill out of the deal.

Once again, that first round pick is going to suck.

We have to start trading people to Columbus, Colorado and Florida and getting good picks.

The Flames' drafting record is abysmal, they need the help that a 'sure-thing' draft pick can provide.

Because, at the end of the day, you can hold your goodwill in one hand and start crapping in the other and see which one fills up first.