2009 NFL Regular Season Thread - Page 105 - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

corporatejay · 11-13-2009, 01:40 PM

Well Bradford, McCoy, Clausen and Locker are in this draft and Tebow if you actually think he'll play QB. You've got to think Denver should have a decent shot at one of those guys

rubecube · 11-13-2009, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pastiche

Why is it seemingly so hard to draft and develop QBs? It seems like there is a sincere lack of competent QBs in the league now than even before. Am I out to lunch? Is this a reason for the real bi-polar nature of the league right now with very good teams versus very bad teams and not alot in the middle?

How far back are we talking? I really don't think there's a huge difference. I went back ten years, and here are the starting QBs on Nov. 14, 1999 and their present day counterparts:

Arizona - Jake Plummer/Kurt Warner
Atlanta - Chris Chandler/Matt Ryan
Baltimore - Tony Banks/Joe Flacco
Buffalo - Doug Flutie/Trent Edwards
Carolina - Steve Beurlein/Jake Delhomme
Chicago - Shane Matthews/Jay Cutler
Cincinnati - Jeff Blake/Carson Palmer
Cleveland - Tim Couch/Brady Quinn - Push
Dallas - Troy Aikman/Tony Romo
Denver - Brian Griese/Kyle Orton - Push
Detroit - Charlie Batch/Matthew Stafford - Push
Green Bay - Brett Favre/Aaron Rodgers
Indianapolis - Peyton Manning
Jacksonville - Mark Brunell/David Garrard
Kansas City - Elvis Grbac/Matt Cassell
Miami - Dan Marino/Chad Henne
Minnesota - Jeff George/Brett Favre
New England - Drew Bledsoe/Tom Brady
New Orleans - Billy Joe Tolliver/Drew Brees
New York Giants - Kerry Collins/Eli Manning
New York Jets - Ray Lucas/Mark Sanchez
Oakland - Rich Gannon/JaMarcus Russell
Philadelphia - Donovan McNabb
Pittsburgh - Kordell Stewart/Ben Roethlisberger
San Diego - Jim Harbaugh/Philip Rivers
San Francisco - Jeff Garcia/Alex Smith
Seattle - Jon Kitna/Matt Hasselbeck
St. Louis - Kurt Warner/Marc Bulger
Tampa Bay - Trent Dilfer/Josh Freeman
Tennessee - Steve McNair/Vince Young
Washington - Brad Johnson/Jason Campbell

Some really terrible QBs on both sides there. There are certainly more HOFers in the 1999 class, but I would take the 2009 class for overall quality.

EDIT: Bolded the guys who I thought were better.

Sylvanfan · 11-13-2009, 02:14 PM

I think the QB's themselves are fine, but there are a lot of teams who have some issues with their protection. Which in all likelyhood has always been the case. Although teams are throwing very frequently now and that will also expose QB's to make more mistakes.

For example, I think Matt Cassel has not played badly, but every snap he seems to be running for his life. He may not be an elite level QB or worth what he's paid. But to be fair to him, the Chiefs have claimed or signed 3 receivers that other teams have cut in the past couple years. They haven't had a running touch down all year. There is a serious lack of talent around him and he shouldn't get blamed for not being Peyton Manning. Only 1 or 2 teams in the entire league gets that level of play form their QB.

rubecube · 11-13-2009, 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

I think the QB's themselves are fine, but there are a lot of teams who have some issues with their protection. Which in all likelyhood has always been the case. Although teams are throwing very frequently now and that will also expose QB's to make more mistakes.

Uh, Derek Anderson and your boy Jamarcus beg to differ.

Sylvanfan · 11-13-2009, 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rubecube

Uh, Derek Anderson and your boy Jamarcus beg to differ.

LOL, true enough, but there are is always a team or two with QB issues...those situations are a case of owners or coaches intentionally hanging themselves. Even Anderson looked adequate the one year when he had Edwards, and Kellen Winslow to toss the ball to, and Jamal Lewis not hating his coach.

Although as JaMarcus says... I really dont' think it's me, I really don't. So I don't think he'd be begging to differ at all!

It's not his fault they drafted Darius Heyward-Bay when no one else in the league knew who he was.

rubecube · 11-13-2009, 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

LOL, true enough, but there are is always a team or two with QB issues...those situations are a case of owners or coaches intentionally hanging themselves. Even Anderson looked adequate the one year when he had Edwards, and Kellen Winslow to toss the ball to, and Jamal Lewis not hating his coach.

Although as JaMarcus says... I really dont' think it's me, I really don't. So I don't think he'd be begging to differ at all!

It's not his fault they drafted Darius Heyward-Bay when no one else in the league knew who he was.

The funniest thing about Anderson was that everyone in the league knew, or at least I think knew, that he was a one-year wonder before the Browns re-signed him. He put up great numbers against a soft schedule, when there wasn't much film on him. As he got into December, his numbers dropped like a rock and they finished 10-6 but out of the playoffs.

I have good friend who's a Browns fan, and he was so happy when they re-signed Anderson. I told him it was a terrible contract, but he was sort of like an Oilers fan after they signed Horcoff to his awful contract.

He's been great to watch football with over the last two years, but he's really getting depressed about it now.

rubecube · 11-13-2009, 02:56 PM

And after last night's performance, Jay Cutler is on pace to throw 30 interceptions this year. Way to help your team, Jay.

Pagal4321 · 11-13-2009, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

It's not his fault they drafted Darius Heyward-Bay when no one else in the league knew who he was.

UNTRUE! Mike Tice knew about Troy Williamson version 2.0.

Sainters7 · 11-13-2009, 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rubecube

New Orleans - Billy Joe Tolliver/Drew Brees

Saints actually had TWO QB's at the same time back then who's names were Billy Joe(Tolliver and Hobert). Those were some dark days...

Displaced Flames fan · 11-13-2009, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pagal4321

Having two first round picks will help in that won't it?

You'd have to assume that th Chicago pick will be relatively high, unless they somehow turn it around and have a good end to the season.

I'm thinking that both teams with 2 first rounders will be looking for that "Franchise QB" (SF and Den). And aparently there are QB a plenty in this years draft.

Yeah, except they already traded one away. They traded Denver's 1st to Seattle for the pick that drafted Alphonso Smith, who I like a lot.

Now, most people thought McDaniels was an idiot for trading their own pick instead of the Chicago pick, but that move is starting to look very, very smart.

I've made no secret that I think Jake Locker is the best pro QB prospect in this draft. Would love to see him in Denver.

Displaced Flames fan · 11-13-2009, 04:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sainters7

Saints actually had TWO QB's at the same time back then who's names were Billy Joe(Tolliver and Hobert). Those were some dark days...

Remember Bobby Hebert? Of course you do. I liked him. And you know, Aaron Brooks had his moments in New Orleans. Good guy too.

Sainters7 · 11-13-2009, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Displaced Flames fan

Remember Bobby Hebert? Of course you do. I liked him. And you know, Aaron Brooks had his moments in New Orleans. Good guy too.

I was always drivin the Aaron Brooks bandwagon. The guy was so confusing, he kinda reminds me of Hankey Burris. Would just absolutely light up a contender one night, and then play horsecrap against a nobody the next week.

I still remember when he shredded the Bucs D in '02 on that Monday Nighter, the year the Bucs won the Super Bowl. That was the only guy I saw carve up the Bucs through the air that whole season. I lost alot of sleep cause of that guy.

Montana Moe · 11-14-2009, 12:10 AM

Adam Schefter tweeted that according to his agent, the Eskimos may be interested in Larry Johnson.

Is it even possible for players to be added for the playoffs in the CFL or is he talking about next season?

transplant99 · 11-14-2009, 01:32 AM

Talking about the Qb's league wide on ESPN today...and the numbers back this up...there has never been as many really good QB's (passing wise) as there is in the NFL right now.

Something like 20/30 are over 60% completion for the season...and though i never did hear the final #, they figured it was by far the highest total ever.

As for the game last night...it was best described by Cowherd this afternoon when he said, "it was like watching two really ugly people making out in public". Awful game...terrible QB'ing by Cutler.

cross16 · 11-14-2009, 12:45 PM

^^

I think thats more a byproduct of offensive schemes than actualy talent at the QB position. The trend in most offenses' is the high percentage throw/no turnover style. I dont' think that number is an accurate dipiction of the talent at QB.

Bobblehead · 11-14-2009, 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cross16

^^

I think thats more a byproduct of offensive schemes than actualy talent at the QB position. The trend in most offenses' is the high percentage throw/no turnover style. I dont' think that number is an accurate dipiction of the talent at QB.

Do.Z has been saying that for years. He isn't disparaging the current QBs, just that comparing completion percentage is difficult when one scheme throws lots of 5 yard completions vs a scheme that looks for not as many passes but more 10+ yard routes.

On 2 plays a QB in one scheme can throw 2 complete 5 yard passes for a 1st down. In the other the QB may be 1 for 2 but also get the first down. 2 plays, but first down, but one QB is 100% and the other is 50%. Tough to say one of those guys is "better" than the other based on that stat.

Sylvanfan · 11-14-2009, 01:09 PM

Pat Kirwan was saying the other day that there are only 3 teams in the NFL who now run more than they throw, and that 2 of those teams were close to 50-50 so that it was a strong possibility that it will only be one team running more than they throw. There are a lot of teams who use the short passing game to their backs as an extension of their run game, as Houston, Indianapolis, Arizona, Chicago, Philadelphia come to mind as weaker running teams who use short passing games to their backs as an extension of their run games. Another thing he mentioned is that teams who are using their backs a lot in their passing games collectively had a really good record and that the Bears where the only team who have a sub 500 record.

KidCanada · 11-15-2009, 07:37 AM

Does anyone know if those outside North America are able to stream the Sunday night Football game (colts/pats) through NFL.com? They have a "watch game" option, so Im wondering if this is a) free and b) will work for me in europe.

Thanks!

rubecube · 11-15-2009, 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KidCanada

Does anyone know if those outside North America are able to stream the Sunday night Football game (colts/pats) through NFL.com? They have a "watch game" option, so Im wondering if this is a) free and b) will work for me in europe.

Thanks!

I don't know but I thought you could do it through NBC.com.

Displaced Flames fan · 11-15-2009, 11:33 AM

Brandon Marshall is absolutely shredding the Redskins secondary so far today. Two long TD's with nobody even close to him.