Breaking Bad

[Daradon]

A bit long winded, but those who take the time to read it will probably like it and agree...



A thought/response to all those that say the last few episodes are filler or not as great as the rest, etc. Technically I guess you are right, it is 'filler'. However that's the whole point of having an end, and knowing the end is coming, there is really no way around it.

There is actually a literary term for reading, or watching a show/movie/story, and knowing the ending is coming. Tried to do a quick google search for it, but it's a long winded idea to search around and have come up empty after a few tries, but I studied it a bit years ago. Anyway, we've all been through the experience. Imagine you are reading a book and you get to the last chapter, or even the last ten pages. You know the ending is right around the corner. So your brain, especially if it's engaged, (and obviously we are watching and critiquing this show a lot so they are very engaged) is already figuring out what can and can happen in that last bit of time left. Your actively thinking, ok, there HAS to be a resolution for 'this, this, this' coming up and since it is so soon, we know it can't be 'this, this, or that'. It narrows the possibilities down, and makes the answers or plot easier to see. So in our mind, since we can see it coming and/or reasonably predict what is going to happen next, it's filler to us.

As well, there is next to no time left to add anything new, or have new plot twists. To have a satisfying conclusion you need to fill in the holes and so sometimes it seems like filler. However, there is really no way around it and the alternative is much worse. And we all know about bad or unsatisfying endings.

It's a problem that writers, and storytellers of both the page and screen have dealt with since the beginning of time, since people actually studied what makes good writing. People know 99% of the time when the ending is coming. All shows have screen time, every book has a back cover, and our brains know that and plug it into how we read or view the show. And with modern marketing, especially with TV, we know exactly how long things will last. Takes a bit of the fun out of it. But can you imagine going into a movie that you didn't know how long it would last (sometimes we don't know exactly, but we always have a reasonable idea) or holding a book that looks like 1200 pages but is only 600? No, these things don't exist. Stories can never mimic life exactly because we can see the end approaching. There is a finite amount of time and place to the story and in most cases it needs a conclusion. Life is not like that. (We die I know, and sometimes we see it coming, I know, but you see what I'm getting at)

That's part of the reason why people love twist endings so much. Cause it's flips that around to an extent.

However since we have not seen the last episode of Breaking Bad yet, we still cannot say truly how good or bad the 'ending' has been. Who knows, maybe there's even one last twist that blows all of our socks off Se7en style! I kinda doubt it, but it's possible.

But the criticisms people are levying at the last couple episodes have little or nothing to do with the talent of the writing style or the quality of the writing. It's just a natural phenomenon of telling a story. I will admit they made it a little harder on themselves in this regard by giving us those two flash forwards we have seen, as that also makes guessing easier. We have points to connect in our minds. However, it was a calculated writing technique used to build suspense earlier in the season and tell the story, and I think it worked really well.

Lastly, and this goes for all popular television series, and has a little to do with the last bit, but is important to remember, 'good' and universally loved endings are very hard to achieve. Would probably only need one hand, MAYBE two, to list the series that were able to tie it up well, while it would be hard to count the other side. Even shows considered some of the best television ever have struggled with this. Remember the Seinfeld series ending? Look at how people are reacting to Dexter this year. A television series lasts years, many many hours. Much more than a movie. Providing a satisfying ending to all these characters who people have come to feel so strongly about is difficult, cause they become so real to us. We want to know more and more and more.

As well, most series work with a plot line that is only visible for the writers up to the next episode or two. And even modern shows, that are more continuing and story driven than shows in the past still often don't know if they are going to last the season so even they don't plan ahead as much, and have to tell a certain amount of story on a clock. So resolving all these plot points, that were often thrown in by necessity as the show continues can be very difficult indeed. There's a certain amount of improv to it, in a sense. Can you imagine having to write a concise ending to 55 hours of improv?

So there you have it, my thoughts on it anyway, as I know a bit about the writing process. If you made it this far thanks for listening. All I'm saying is, you're looking at the natural progression of the end of a popular show and there are things to remember when judging writing. I think they have done a fantastic job so far. Far better than many other shows, they have kept the plot tight and believable and interesting all through the series. Course the big one is still to come, even I may change my mind. They could still screw it up, for sure. But they could also hit it out of the park, we all love a good twist ending. In the end I think we'll get a satisfying but slightly predictable ending that I will be happy with.

Sure hope we get a twist though!

[King Hippo]

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

Todd is a great character, he's truly a disturbing weird individual. The calm cool way he apologizes and tries to comfort people as he does terrible things is so very interesting to watch.

When Skyler walked into the babies room and was confronted by Todd and company in the ski masks I jumped a little, didn't expect that.

Indeed, Todd is awesome. A cold killer, yet sympathetic to people

I dont see how some others blame Todd and the Neo Nazis for killing Andrea. Jesse knew they were watching her and brock. They even hung a photo of them for Jesse to see. Had Jesse thought about Andrea and Brock before he broke out of his cuffs, he would've stayed put for their safety. Todd was even nice to Jesse. Who could say no to not one, but two different flavours of Ben & Jerry's ice cream? Was Jesse grateful? no, he broke out, ran, got caught and forced their hand in killing the girlfriend.

Todd didn't kill Andrea,
Jesse killed Andrea.

[Wormius]

Yeah. Jesse's a jerk. They gave him two kinds of ice cream and he repays them by trying to escape...

[TurnedTheCorner]

While Todd is indeed terrible and deserves a painful death, I can't think of anything he's done that Walt hasn't directly or indirectly done himself.

- Keep a man confined, but kindly bring him food? Same as the dude in the basement, season 1.
- Kill someone because it's just business? Got Jesse to kill Gale.
- Kill someone in the heat of the moment? Ran over the two guys to save Jesse
- Kill your business partner to take control of the meth empire? Got Hector to kill Gus.

In fact, I can't think of a time where Todd just stood by idly and let someone die, like Hank did with Jane (and to some extent Hank).

[corporatejay]

Originally Posted by TurnedTheCorner

While Todd is indeed terrible and deserves a painful death, I can't think of anything he's done that Walt hasn't directly or indirectly done himself.

- Keep a man confined, but kindly bring him food? Same as the dude in the basement, season 1.
- Kill someone because it's just business? Got Jesse to kill Gale.
- Kill someone in the heat of the moment? Ran over the two guys to save Jesse
- Kill your business partner to take control of the meth empire? Got Hector to kill Gus.

In fact, I can't think of a time where Todd just stood by idly and let someone die, like Hank did with Jane (and to some extent Hank).

The difference is that Todd doesn't distinguish between those in the game and innocents and that's where the line is drawn. Walter could have killed Brock, but didn't because he is an innocent, Todd shot that kid and andrea simply because they were inconvenient.

[TurnedTheCorner]

That's a good point. It still doesn't make me feel too good about Walt though.

[polak]

Also Walt got Jessie to kill Gale to save his own life. It wasn't "just business".

[TurnedTheCorner]

Well sure - but from Gale's perspective, it was "nothing personal". He had no idea why he was being killed. He was just a pawn for Gus and Walt, just as Andrea was for Todd and crew.

[Wormius]

Originally Posted by polak

Also Walt got Jessie to kill Gale to save his own life. It wasn't "just business".

Well, Jesse wasn't on great terms with Gus either at the time and Gale was a replacement for Jesse just as much as Walt. Killing Gale probably saved Jesse's life, too.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Wormius

Well, Jesse wasn't on great terms with Gus either at the time and Gale was a replacement for Jesse just as much as Walt. Killing Gale probably saved Jesse's life, too.

Not to mention that Walt killing Gus (and using Brock to sway Jesse) also save Jesse's life.

I find the Nazis kind of funny in this show. We know they are bad, but they actually seem to care more about the people around them and in their inner circle more than a lot of the other characters in this show. They're the closest thing to a functional family in the whole Breaking Bad world.

[Radio]

^^I disagree. In the beginning Gus didn't like Jesse cause he was a junky. Walter started to worry that Gale would make him expendable so he convinced Gus that Gale was a screw up and he needed Jesse.

Mike took a liking to Jesse when Gus told him to keep an eye on him. After a time Gus came to see what Walt seen in Jesse, loyalty. He started to become a trusted member of Gus's empire. Walter could see that and turned Jesse to save himself...not Jesse.

[corporatejay]

Originally Posted by TurnedTheCorner

That's a good point. It still doesn't make me feel too good about Walt though.

Nor should you. Walt is a scumbag. Jesse is truly Heisenberg's "son". He's a more refined and sophisticated Heisenberg. He is the one who should be feared.

[TurnedTheCorner]

Do you mean Jesse or Todd, corporatejay?

[Daradon]

Originally Posted by corporatejay

The difference is that Todd doesn't distinguish between those in the game and innocents and that's where the line is drawn. Walter could have killed Brock, but didn't because he is an innocent, Todd shot that kid and andrea simply because they were inconvenient.

Not sure I agree with this assesment. Todd killed Andera to show Jesse he could get to those he loved, not cause she was inconvenient. I don't even really know what you mean by that.

Also Walter nearly did kill Brock. It was a calculated risk he took but I don't it was ever certain he wouldn't be killed by his actions, so Walt still harms innocents. Also I'm not sure what you mean by could have killed him, cause killing him outright wouldn't have worked for his plan. It's not like he had to choose between killing him or not and he took the high road.

All that said, there is something very cold blooded about Todd, even compared to Walt.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Radio

^^I disagree. In the beginning Gus didn't like Jesse cause he was a junky. Walter started to worry that Gale would make him expendable so he convinced Gus that Gale was a screw up and he needed Jesse.

Mike took a liking to Jesse when Gus told him to keep an eye on him. After a time Gus came to see what Walt seen in Jesse, loyalty. He started to become a trusted member of Gus's empire. Walter could see that and turned Jesse to save himself...not Jesse.

I don't really see it that way. To me, Gus was a user and equally or more deranged than Walt. With Jesse's history of relapse and motivation problems, I don't think he would have lasted long in Gus's world. Plus, his loyalty to Walt was wearing thin with Gus. Gus cut one of his loyal employee's neck with a box cutter just to make a point, I don't think he would have thought twice about disposing of Jesse once he had everything under control. Not to mention that a sensitive guy like Jesse would have never have bought in completely to Gus's savage world, as indicated by his disposition after seeing Gus torment Hector. He was already wondering what he was doing there.

Mike might have taken a liking to Jesse, but he was still a yes man to Gus and relied on Gus for his "nest egg".

[KTrain]

[King Hippo]

Originally Posted by Wormius

Yeah. Jesse's a jerk. They gave him two kinds of ice cream and he repays them by trying to escape...

not just any kind, but Ben & Jerry's ice cream! what were you thinking Jesse?

[corporatejay]

Do you mean Jesse or Todd, corporatejay?

Todd, sorry.

[Radio]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

I don't really see it that way. To me, Gus was a user and equally or more deranged than Walt. With Jesse's history of relapse and motivation problems, I don't think he would have lasted long in Gus's world. Plus, his loyalty to Walt was wearing thin with Gus. Gus cut one of his loyal employee's neck with a box cutter just to make a point, I don't think he would have thought twice about disposing of Jesse once he had everything under control. Not to mention that a sensitive guy like Jesse would have never have bought in completely to Gus's savage world, as indicated by his disposition after seeing Gus torment Hector. He was already wondering what he was doing there.

Mike might have taken a liking to Jesse, but he was still a yes man to Gus and relied on Gus for his "nest egg".

Good points.

[corporatejay]

The internet is amazing.

http://extramustard.si.com/2013/09/2...ame-from-1998/

Here are the telling details. Wisconsin and Denver only played twice that year at the Dane County Coliseum (which the Badgers would leave next season), once on February 13, 1998 and again on the following day. In the second game, the score was 2-1 in Wisconsin’s favor in the second period, eliminating it as a possibility.
The Feb. 13 game, however, fits: Denver lead 2-1 in the second period and Rycroft had scored a goal, in keeping with the announcer’s earlier comment. Amazingly, the home team came back to score 6 goals in the third period, making it an all-time classic Badgers win: