5 killed on Macleod trail crash - Update: GUILTY!

Originally Posted by urban1

He did NOT refuse to provide a breath sample.

He failed to successfully provide a breath sample.

Legally they are different. He blew into the breathalyzer but it couldnt register. The guy likely intentionaly didnt blow hard enough. But now he can argue that he has a medical condition or was scared and short of breath or something similar.

Not correct. Legally, the charge is the same. I believe you are stating that a flat out, 'no f'n way am i blowing on that thing' is harder to defend then someone not blowing hard enough. I will certainly agree with you there.

[4X4]

I've been breathalyzed before. It isn't just a quick blow into a straw. You have to go full tilt for 5 seconds or so... Not the toughest thing in the world, but I can see it giving difficulty to an old person, an asthmatic or a drunk.

[jolinar of malkshor]

Originally Posted by 4X4

I've been breathalyzed before. It isn't just a quick blow into a straw. You have to go full tilt for 5 seconds or so... Not the toughest thing in the world, but I can see it giving difficulty to an old person, an asthmatic or a drunk.

Your right, the longer the better but it doesn't need to be 5 secs, the sample just needs to collect a deep lung sample. Some people have a lot more lung volume than others.

My question is....why didn't the police try and obtain a blood sample if he wouldn't or couldn't give a proper breath sample? I know there are time issues involved but the more evidence the better.

[4X4]

Originally Posted by jolinar of malkshor

Your right, the longer the better but it doesn't need to be 5 secs, the sample just needs to collect a deep lung sample. Some people have a lot more lung volume than others.

My question is....why didn't the police try and obtain a blood sample if he wouldn't or couldn't give a proper breath sample? I know there are time issues involved but the more evidence the better.

Dude told me to keep blowing until it beeped. It took ~5 seconds...

And your second point is bang on. It should be a law at a traffic accident. If a proper breath sample is not given, call an ambulance immediately, ship the driver to the hospital and let a pro take a blood sample.

[Eddie Bronze]

Originally Posted by ken0042

Saw something a little disturbing on Global last night. They were saying that the penalty for refusing to provide a breath sample doesn't tie into the vehicular homicide; so if he was indeed drunk he was better off to not provide a breath sample. Something like max of 14 years in jail with failing to provide and killing somebody; as opposed to 25 years if he blew over.

Hopefully that law gets changed; because otherwise why would anybody give a breath sample unless they were sober?

I saw that story as well. To me that's just another example of how the laws in this country are set up to protect the criminals and forget about the victims.

[ricosuave]

^ yep, its a friggin disgrace.

[jolinar of malkshor]

Originally Posted by 4X4

Dude told me to keep blowing until it beeped. It took ~5 seconds...

And your second point is bang on. It should be a law at a traffic accident. If a proper breath sample is not given, call an ambulance immediately, ship the driver to the hospital and let a pro take a blood sample.

Depending on the Road Side screening device used, some models will determine how much flow is blowing through and wont beep until the flow rate is slowing down indicating that a deep lung breath sample will be collected. I blew into several of the devices (only so that I could be qualified to use them) and I can blow for about 9 secs. One of my coworkers could only blow for 3 secs. Depends on lung capacity.

But I agree that a law should be passed that blood samples should be mandatory in these kinds of cases. BAC in a blood sample doesn't lie.

[urban1]

Listening to the radio today... sounds like Tschetter (cement truck driver) made a court appearance this morning to try and get bail. Sounds like he tried to avoid eye contact with everyone but briefly looked up at his family at the back. The family was described as also trying to avoid eye contact, sitting with their arms crossed, and crying.

Judge is supposed to make a decision tomorrow.

It will be interesting to see if this guy spends the holidays in jail or at home with his family.

[jolinar of malkshor]

Originally Posted by urban1

Listening to the radio today... sounds like Tschetter (cement truck driver) made a court appearance this morning to try and get bail. Sounds like he tried to avoid eye contact with everyone but briefly looked up at his family at the back. The family was described as also trying to avoid eye contact, sitting with their arms crossed, and crying.

Judge is supposed to make a decision tomorrow.

It will be interesting to see if this guy spends the holidays in jail or at home with his family.

Hopefully in jail.

[Cowperson]

His lawyer, by the way, had earlier indicated that he did not expect alcohol to be a factor in the crash.

Even though there is allegedly evidence of Tschetter having consumed alcohol, Der said, "I do not expect there would be any evidence supporting that he was impaired or over the .08 blood alcohol limit for driving."

http://www.canada.com/calgaryherald/...4-4cfc0fbd31d0

Very interesting.

Cowperson

[CaptainCrunch]

Fine he wasn't drinking or impaired, that should make his sentence worse because he was driving like an idiot with a clear head.

[4X4]

Originally Posted by jolinar of malkshor

Hopefully in jail.

Almost gotta wonder if he doesn't hope the same. I have no idea what xmas would be like in my family if something like this were to happen. Of course you want to lend support to your family member, but man, what a downer.
If I were that guy, I'd probably rather sit in a jail cell than sit at the table and watch everyone avoid eye contact and dance carefully around topics and such.
At least you'd know that your family can say their prayer or whatever to acknowledge your absence and then get on with having a half assed merry christmas...

[Eric Vail]

I haven't read the all eleven pages of this thread, but it seems like people really want the book thrown at this guy.

Strange, that many of the same people feel that it was justified that Dan Heatly did not get any prision time. He did the same thing - reckless driving that resulted in the death of an innocent person.

[4X4]

Originally Posted by Eric Vail

Strange, that many of the same people feel that it was justified that Dan Heatly did not get any prision time. He did the same thing - reckless driving that resulted in the death of an innocent person.

Right. Two, young hotshots booting around in a Ferrari and crashing into a wall is the same thing as a nutcase in a heavy truck plowing into a family that is stopped at a light.

[MelBridgeman]

Originally Posted by Eric Vail

I haven't read the all eleven pages of this thread, but it seems like people really want the book thrown at this guy.

Strange, that many of the same people feel that it was justified that Dan Heatly did not get any prision time. He did the same thing - reckless driving that resulted in the death of an innocent person.

How do you know Dan Snider wasnt a willing participant...It seems from what i heard that was the case, he could of chosen to get out of the car, we know he didnt.....That's why it is different, but that doesnt make it better...DUI is a DUI no matter what happens or the circumstance.

[urban1]

Heatley wasnt drunk. He barely registered any alcohol content.

Originally Posted by MelBridgeman

How do you know Dan Snider wasnt a willing participant...It seems from what i heard that was the case, he could of chosen to get out of the car, we know he didnt.....That's why it is different, but that doesnt make it better...DUI is a DUI no matter what happens or the circumstance.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Eric Vail

I haven't read the all eleven pages of this thread, but it seems like people really want the book thrown at this guy.

Strange, that many of the same people feel that it was justified that Dan Heatly did not get any prision time. He did the same thing - reckless driving that resulted in the death of an innocent person.

There is always a difference in sympathy when innocent and unsuspecting people, especially children, are killed needlessly.

Snyder could be classified as "innocent" given he wasn't the driver, but it is unlikely that he had any real problem with how fast they were going if he was a typical young 20-something kid with a lot more money than he was used to.

[burn_baby_burn]

Not that it matters. But Tschetter is a very prominent Hutterite name. In fact there is a Tschetter colony at Irricanna.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by burn_baby_burn

Not that it matters. But Tschetter is a very prominent Hutterite name. In fact there is a Tschetter colony at Irricanna.

He is a runaway.

Left the colony about 30 years ago.

....not that it matters.

[Eric Vail]

Originally Posted by 4X4

Right. Two, young hotshots booting around in a Ferrari and crashing into a wall is the same thing as a nutcase in a heavy truck plowing into a family that is stopped at a light.

Heatly could have just as easily plowed into a family going at the speed he was when he lost control. Because he had the "good fortune" of only hitting a wall, and only killing his passenger, this makes it so Heatley walks, while the truck driver deserves the death sentence according to some. Heatley's action and the truck driver's actions were the same. They both decided to recklessly drive at an extremely unsafe speed and "accidently" killed someone.