Racism at Calgary Bars?

[ken0042]

That's good; at least they did that. Last year they just showed them not getting in.

For those of you who this affects- is it really a 5 out of 6 chance that you won't get into a place? (once again just asking to make sure we have all the facts.)

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by ken0042

Did you even read what was being said? My comments (which were then echoed) were simply that a Global news story by itself is not proof.

You say you have been discrimanted against; fine. But how often is it? I'm sure the negative events stand out for you. But if you are denied entry at the same rate as white people who have said they get denied entry, it isn't discrimination.

All I'm saying is that the race card can, at times, be brought out far too quickly.

Yes, I've read the thread and I wasn't talking about you in particular.

No, the global news story itself is not what I am basing my opinion on. This has happened to me dozens of times, and I know it happens at a much higher rate then it does to white people.
If I'm well dressed, and of age for that bar, I still have less than a 50% chance of getting into most major night clubs.
I don't need a news story to tell me this, I've lived it, and many of my white friends have had to live it too just by trying to go to the bar with me.

Sure the race card does get played too fast, and I'm no fan of that either, but in this case I guarentee you it is the case. It's not even a point of discussion, it's a cold hard fact.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by ken0042

That's good; at least they did that. Last year they just showed them not getting in.

For those of you who this affects- is it really a 5 out of 6 chance that you won't get into a place? (once again just asking to make sure we have all the facts.)

I've never tried to go to 6 different places, usually give up and go home after 1 or 2. However, I've been denied my last 5 tries running, with the exception of the back alley, which has never given me any trouble.

[Mr.Coffee]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

I've never tried to go to 6 different places, usually give up and go home after 1 or 2. However, I've been denied my last 5 tries running, with the exception of the back alley, which has never given me any trouble.

Damn straight, then just stick to what works right? Besides, the Crack is the best bar in town anyways. Im not a fan of clubs, but my buddies are. Therefore whenever we go out Im always advocating the crack alley. No dresscodes, no 56+ age limits, fair prices...(well.... fairER then the rest).

One complaint I do have about the the place is the volume level needs to be turned down about 600 decibals. Just so I can, you know, have my hearing when I'm older. Although Im pretty sure there is already permanent damage from the crack.

Anyways, nobody answered my question from before. If you are a minority, have you ever accused or contacted the establishment about racist acts??

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by Calgary Flames

Lose/Lose situation because while you may reduce violence, you're also denying coloured people who are out for a genuine time.

Coloured?

[Bobblehead]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

Damn straight, then just stick to what works right? Besides, the Crack is the best bar in town anyways. Im not a fan of clubs, but my buddies are. Therefore whenever we go out Im always advocating the crack alley. No dresscodes, no 56+ age limits, fair prices...(well.... fairER then the rest).

I was only there once, about 6 years ago. The person in front of me was told they couldn't go in because they were wearing parachute pants (remember those baggy nylon things?). When I got in, the first thing I see is this woman in rubber boots (black, with the orange toe) dancing on the speaker.

[ken0042]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

However, I've been denied my last 5 tries running, with the exception of the back alley, which has never given me any trouble.

Dang, that does suck.

And once again, I have a better team believing what you say because I somewhat know you from around here.

Has anybody tried filing a Human Rights complaint? http://www.albertahumanrights.ab.ca/

I'm just thinking that if enough people did that, perhaps that would help with the situation.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

Damn straight, then just stick to what works right? Besides, the Crack is the best bar in town anyways. Im not a fan of clubs, but my buddies are. Therefore whenever we go out Im always advocating the crack alley. No dresscodes, no 56+ age limits, fair prices...(well.... fairER then the rest).

One complaint I do have about the the place is the volume level needs to be turned down about 600 decibals. Just so I can, you know, have my hearing when I'm older. Although Im pretty sure there is already permanent damage from the crack.

Anyways, nobody answered my question from before. If you are a minority, have you ever accused or contacted the establishment about racist acts??

I've accused the bouncers, and talked to one manager. Last time I went to the Roadhouse the guy told me and my GF it was 25+ night. After waiting in line and watching so many younger people go in I didn't believe him. I refused to move from the line until he told me the truth. He told me to get out of line now. I said I'll gladly leave as soon as you tell me the real reason you're not letting me in. He then grabbed me and shoved me to the sidewalk, talling me to get the F out of there before he kicked my ass.

I've also talked about it with a bouncer from Outlaws and a manager from Tequila before, and they have openly admitted to me that they don't like the look of too many coloured guys inside, as well as the have too many asian gangsters come in, and they can't tell the difference between them and someone like me.
The guy at Outlaws eventually let me in after a long talk and told me to come see him next time I have a problem. Next time I went there he had forgetten me and denied me again.
The manager at Tequila used to let me in all the time because I got to know him through a friend of mine who was a VIP member, but if I had another coloured friend/family member come down, they would still have trouble getting in.
I have a friend that used to work at Coyotes and he admitted to me that they do this, but he could get me in if I went with him.

[TheyCallMeBruce]

In case any of you might think Winsor_Pilates is exaggerating, he is not. I personally know a lot of club/lounge owners, and I know their policy and how they work.

My friend, an owner of a certain club, has told me that he would rather not have so many asians in his club, so he's instructed his bouncers to make sure the group is more diverse. In case you're wondering if my friend is some sort of a bigot, well, he's asian, so I'm not sure how that works lol.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by Rhettzky

Yeah, they said the guys made it into one (Cowboys) out of six (Roadhouse, Tantra, Mynt, Coyotes and the Whiskey) bars.

Aren't the Mynt and the Whiskey owned by Victor Choy? So I really don't see asians begin discriminated against there.

[Shazam]

Originally Posted by ken0042

But if you are denied entry at the same rate as white people who have said they get denied entry, it isn't discrimination.

Astounding. You realize that the problem is that people are not getting allowed in because of their colour? Right, right? It's the reason that's the problem. If even one person isn't allowed in because of the color of their skin, that's discrimination.

[MacDougalbry]

If the City had any balls they'd make an example of one of these places by pulling their business license. Of course, this is a "business friendly" city... (is that just the polite way of saying "corrupt"?) This does nothing for Calgary's image... we are still seen as a racist redneck joke in the rest of the country. Any wonder why we don't get taken seriously?

[ken0042]

Originally Posted by Shazam

Astounding. You realize that the problem is that people are not getting allowed in because of their colour? Right, right? It's the reason that's the problem. If even one person isn't allowed in because of the color of their skin, that's discrimination.

Once again, please re-read what I had said. Starting with the if.

From what Windsor has said, it looks like that being of colour he gets rejected a lot more than somebody who is white.

All I was saying is that this all came about because of non-whites not being allowed in. Once some white folks expressed that they had run into this as well, I wanted to make sure it wasn't a case of somebody pulling the race card pre-maturely.

What I am trying to do is have this conversation based on intelligent observations, and not knee jerk reactions. As a white person I have had people treat me unfairly; however being white I don't ever think of it as being a race issue. I'm just trying to understand the situation, and how it is different for other people.

Because to me understanding is the first step towards the racial harmony that we all seem to be seeking here.

[Shazam]

Originally Posted by ken0042

Once again, please re-read what I had said. Starting with the if.

I did read your posts, and I am still astounded that you wrote what you did and actually believe that it's true.

From what Windsor has said, it looks like that being of colour he gets rejected a lot more than somebody who is white.

Yeah, like the time two rednecks in a corvette yelled "CHINK" to me in front of that bar where the Saigon Y2K near MacMahon Stadium is.

All I was saying is that this all came about because of non-whites not being allowed in. Once some white folks expressed that they had run into this as well, I wanted to make sure it wasn't a case of somebody pulling the race card pre-maturely.

So wait. You surmise that because white people aren't allowed in somewhere, therefore there's no way that "coloured" people aren't being discriminated because of their colour? Where in God's name did you learn logic?

God forbid a disabled Chinese female ever walk into the Calgary Petroleum Club. Those old white fogeys might just drop dead of heart attacks on the spot.

I'm just trying to understand the situation, and how it is different for other people.

Well, I'm sorry to say, but you're never going to truly understand.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by Shazam

God forbid a disabled Chinese female ever walk into the Calgary Petroleum Club. Those old white fogeys might just drop dead of heart attacks on the spot.

I wouldn't take it personally, they'd probably react to me the same way.

[Reaper]

Originally Posted by Shazam

A whole bunch of stuff that demonstrates he jumped to conclusions

I think you need to read people's posts as they are and not read so much into them. Perhaps other people really are trying to understand the situation and are thus having a discourse on the matter. It's a discussion board and people will discuss things. Try not to be so bloody dismissive because you were reading into a post.

[ken0042]

Originally Posted by Shazam

So wait. You surmise that because white people aren't allowed in somewhere, therefore there's no way that "coloured" people aren't being discriminated because of their colour? Where in God's name did you learn logic?

But does it mean that it has to be racial discrimination. You seem to be speaking in absolutes; where if you aren't allowed in the only reason is discrimination.

For example- white guy goes to club "A." He is wearing sneakers and isn't allowed in; and is told it's a dress code thing. He leaves. 30 minutes later an Asian guy goes to club "A" wearing sneakers. When the Asian guy isn't allowed in; it isn't because of discrimination. It is because of the sneakers.

Now when my white example guy then goes to club "B" and then club "C"; spending some time in each; whereas my Asian guy is told he can't come in to either because he doesn't meet the dress code; then that is discrimination.

Please, as I have said numerous times I do believe that this type of discrimination does exist. What I am trying to do is make sure we are clear as to what is happening. If the Global report says the club "A" is discriminating; they would be wrong. If they say "B" and "C" are then they would be right.

Or have you already made up your mind that because I am white I must automatically be a racist?

[Igottago]

Originally Posted by ken0042

But does it mean that it has to be racial discrimination. You seem to be speaking in absolutes; where if you aren't allowed in the only reason is discrimination.

For example- white guy goes to club "A." He is wearing sneakers and isn't allowed in; and is told it's a dress code thing. He leaves. 30 minutes later an Asian guy goes to club "A" wearing sneakers. When the Asian guy isn't allowed in; it isn't because of discrimination. It is because of the sneakers.

Now when my white example guy then goes to club "B" and then club "C"; spending some time in each; whereas my Asian guy is told he can't come in to either because he doesn't meet the dress code; then that is discrimination.

Please, as I have said numerous times I do believe that this type of discrimination does exist. What I am trying to do is make sure we are clear as to what is happening. If the Global report says the club "A" is discriminating; they would be wrong. If they say "B" and "C" are then they would be right.

Or have you already made up your mind that because I am white I must automatically be a racist?

Its been proven throughout this thread numerous times that there is racial motivation at play here, in many cases. You can bring your ABC scenarios and formulas into it all you want, and claim to be wanting all of the facts, but the issue is pretty simple. Racism exists when it comes to Calgary nightclubs. You seem to be doing everything you can to dance around that conclusion.

[jolinar of malkshor]

Originally Posted by MacDougalbry

If the City had any balls they'd make an example of one of these places by pulling their business license. Of course, this is a "business friendly" city... (is that just the polite way of saying "corrupt"?) This does nothing for Calgary's image... we are still seen as a racist redneck joke in the rest of the country. Any wonder why we don't get taken seriously?

The city doesnt have the authority to just pull a business license for discrimination.

[Bobblehead]

Originally Posted by Igottago

Racism exists when it comes to Calgary nightclubs. You seem to be doing everything you can to dance around that conclusion.

Why do you say that, when in Ken's post that you are quoting he says, "Please, as I have said numerous times I do believe that this type of discrimination does exist."

How much more clear can he be?