[PGT] Flames lose 4-1 to Winnipeg; lose Ryan to injury

[keenan87]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

At this stage it's pretty clear the top players and players in the leadership group are a huge problem. I'm harping on the coach because he didn't have a contract as head coach in the summer, and did nothing to justify his hiring.

The hiring of Geoff Ward was every bit as dumb as maintaining the same group of on-ice leaders and core players. Both were just moronic decisions.

The core of this team should not have been kept together, and the leadership group needs a complete overhaul.

...and hiring a high quality coach would be nice to see for once.

100% Agreed. Astonishing they made this coaching hire and kept the core.

I want Conroy to takeover as GM. He has been around for a while now. Yzerman and Sakic have done well.. maybe Conroy can build a proper team.

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by nieuwy-89

I listened to much of the game on the Jets feed on Sirius XM. Generally a solid game call, but a couple of oddities. The PBP guys kept referring to Markstrom as "the 36 million dollar man" in a slightly mocking tone. Also kept referring to Tanev as "Christopher Tanev" every time he touched the puck, which was just weird.

Anyway, great series for the Jets getting 5 of 6 points. That really propelled them back into contention for the division lead.

Flames players need to decide if they are invested or not. There is no net drive, no pressure, no hunger. We are back to a popgun offense with the second worst goals/game in the division. To this point in the season, other than a couple of nice periods here and there, the forwards as a group look pretty checked out.

That's what I saw too, lots of blind passes and weak efforts in the offensive zone. We have seen it before.

[Freddy]

I figured it out in the 3rd.

While Markstrom has been great, his excellence has caused the players to have lost their confidence because they no longer score in practice.

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by keenan87

100% Agreed. Astonishing they made this coaching hire and kept the core.

I want Conroy to takeover as GM. He has been around for a while now. Yzerman and Sakic have done well.. maybe Conroy can build a proper team.

My worry, Bennett is probably close to a lot of the players in the room and this might not be a good time for this saga to unfold.

[Heavy Jack]

Brutal effort tonight for the vets like Gio and Backs and the younger vets like Tkachuk and Lindholm. Uninspired and confused is how I’d describe the effort and it’s maddening because this group has shown to be amazing for some stretches and they should be able to harness that but it’s always 1 step forward couple steps back with this team it seems. We are spoiled with Markstrom atm honestly.

[zamler]

Originally Posted by Freddy

I figured it out in the 3rd.

While Markstrom has been great, his excellence has caused the players to have lost their confidence because they no longer score in practice.

lol that's a dilly of a pickle.

[jessnuts]

I wonder what Conroy is doing this weekend. I could go for a nice hike and a career change.

[Since1984]

Originally Posted by keenan87

100% Agreed. Astonishing they made this coaching hire and kept the core.

I want Conroy to takeover as GM. He has been around for a while now. Yzerman and Sakic have done well.. maybe Conroy can build a proper team.

One of these things is not like the others...

[Heavy Jack]

Originally Posted by Since1984

One of these things is not like the others...

Toon town version!

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Exactly. There are no excuses for Treliving's inability to address the core of this team. Not in the off-season, and not now. Changes are required. One of the teams involved gave up one of their top players in exchange for a player they wouldn't get to play for 2 weeks, and they still got 5 of 6 points from us in a 3 game series. There are no excuses.

You won't find me disagreeing with you on that. IMO BT has definitely given this core far too much rope when he should have made some major changes a year or two ago.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by Since1984

One of these things is not like the others...

if we're going the ex-player route, Nieuwendyk is the way to go.

[keenan87]

Originally Posted by Since1984

One of these things is not like the others...

Fair enough. But both Sakic and Yzerman spent years being groomed for the spot. That aspect is similar to Conroy.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by KootenayFlamesFan

There was literally a major trade this past week involving core players.

Pretty special circumstances.

What other teams have disgruntled top 3 picks who have asked for a trade?

[Mr.Coffee]

Originally Posted by MillerTime GFG

“It’s only 10 games. Too early to panic.”
- Resident CP apologists

We. Are. AVERAGE. It’s time to blow it up.

We’re actually below average both literally and technically.

Because of mental fragility and subpar effort level.

You can’t fix brains with anything but a blow up.

Time to blow up. And every day burned is continually reducing Gaudreaus trade value on a pending UFA situation. He ain’t re-signing here. We have seen enough to know. Blow it up.

[DomeFoam]

Sometimes I'll think upon Hartley's approach of managing an 82 game season into 7 game segments, which I thought really manifested into solving consistency issues. Trying to win at least 4 games every series.

Even if they didn't win a series, going 3-4 one series wouldn't determine their season and it gave them more determination to win the next one, building a solid foundation for a winning culture. They had something to reach for with each game and kept them in a playoff mode before the playoffs had even started.

People like to harp on that coach, but I think he was pretty underrated for the roster in front of him at the time.

Spoiler!

[VANFLAMESFAN]

Originally Posted by MillerTime GFG

There it is.

I’m almost envious of your blind optimism. What in the last 7-8 years with this core has given you belief in this group? Or the last two decades for that matter.

Not sure how this franchise can be given the benefit of the doubt for any sort of belief from its fan base. We are abysmal.

Hope will always be more fun than despair.

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by KootenayFlamesFan

You won't find me disagreeing with you on that. IMO BT has definitely given this core far too much rope when he should have made some major changes a year or two ago.

Not at this point if he knows what he is building. I agree the players are not getting it done but the GM has to shoulder some of that.

[Young Guns]

Why are they constantly going backwards? They fight like mad to get the puck, get it all the way to there blue line. Instead of chipping it out, they bring it back into there end and start the mad fight all over again. Constantly passing it right to the other team, trying to make pretty passes instead of safe ones.

Look at the bright side, I think Simon may of got his 2nd shot on goal this season?

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Originally Posted by zamler

You do realize we actually agree what the fundamental problem is. You say the core is no good I say the coaching is bad. Both have the same architect.

Agreed, although my original point is that the coach is taking a disproportionate amount of blame compared to the top players on this team, which aren't getting called out nearly as much as they should.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by KootenayFlamesFan

So I just finished reading 7 pages of this thread. I don't recall a handful of posts calling out the core/best players on this team. Timbit said the top players were awful. Is that the only post? But page after page after page of how Ward sucks.

Is there a slight chance that this team just isn't very good? That when the Flames best players have a bad game that maybe the team will look bad?

I'm not saying Ward is a great coach, but I really feel like the top players on this team are really getting a massive free pass (yet again) here tonight. Your best players have to be your best players and also have to be some of the best players on the ice. Far too often, under multiple coaches, this core has not consistently been the best players on their team, or on the ice.

Blaming the coach is easy. Realizing the core of this team just may not be that good is a tougher pill to swallow. We all wish this core was elite. They're not. Should have made big changes last season. Expect more of the same for the rest of the season unless big changes are made ASAP.

Yes it it is when it's plainly obvious the head coach is not very good. I feel we have turned back the clocks 3 years with ever optimistic fans telling us "blaming the coach is easy" when it was Gulutzan sucking the life out of the team. Ward is a terrible head coach. Terrible! It's not only that they are bad but they are extremely boring. Ward like Gulutzan coaches in a manner that sucks all the enthusiasm out of the players and the fans. This is awful hockey.