Nova Scotia Active Shooter Dead

[flames_fan_down_under]

Originally Posted by Ford Prefect

I have a little insight into what training first response agencies might have for a situation like this. I have published a national magazine for paramedics in Canada for the last 30 years, and for a period I also published a disaster management journal. Mods can PM me if they want verification of those claims.

All the the first response agencies...fire, EMS and police...would have certainly held training days where they jointly respond to major incidents, so they would have had some form of inter-agency communication and cooperation structure. Not for something of this scale, but they would have at least had a basic structure figured out. That mock training would have likely consisted of both table top scenarios and field simulations.

How complex the scenarios they may have trained for is another story, especially in a small rural community. I was discussing that with a friend who is highly placed with Corrections Services Canada, and the various scenarios they mock train for surprised me. They have plans in place for scenarios I would have never even considered. If any of those events occur they quite literally have guides they can pull off the shelf to go by.

I also know a lady who was part of a team commissioned to write a national pandemic response plan for Canada following the SARS outbreak. It was actually quite fascinating for me to watch and identify parts of that plan going into action back in early and mid-March.

I doubt the level of complexity was very high at the local level in Nova Scotia, but it is beyond imaginable to me that such a plan did not exist at the RCMP provincial level in Nova Scotia. If there wasn’t then that’s a huge fail. Or, as is more likely, there was such a plan, it broke down somewhere in the command hierarchy. I think that’s where the failure was and that’s what has to be identified and rectified for the future.

This is my feeling. Incident command likely had a lot of information coming in, and I am sure it was changing constantly, from multiple structure fires, to an active shooter response, to the person being dressed as a police officer which adds a layer of complexity that even the most seasoned incident commanders would find challenging. Review the critical incident, find areas to improve upon, and implement the changes.

[Maritime Q-Scout]

Emergency Alert was just received on my cell phone.

Potential active shooter situation in Halifax.

Not sure on all the details, will post when I know more.

[Mr.Coffee]

What?! Again???

Stay safe...

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Maritime Q-Scout

Emergency Alert was just received on my cell phone.

Potential active shooter situation in Halifax.

Not sure on all the details, will post when I know more.

You've gotta be ####ing me!

I hope they're taking no chances. Not in the mood for Round 2. But Halifax isn't Portapique, they should be able to handle this.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by Maritime Q-Scout

Emergency Alert was just received on my cell phone.

Potential active shooter situation in Halifax.

Not sure on all the details, will post when I know more.

Oh man no way.... stay safe.

[Maritime Q-Scout]

Ok,

So I was in the yard playing with our son, and doing some work in the shed while my wife was on a conference call. After the call she wanted to go for a drive. Once in the car she started to tell me about what's going on in Halifax.

Of note, I live in Sydney. So it would be like if there was an active shooter in Edmonton and you live in Calgary. I'm no where near what's going on.

Reports of shots fired, or major police presence in Hammonds Plains, Bedford, and Dartmouth. Three separate communities. A friend of ours is locked down in her office.

Checking Facebook now, the news stories and emergency alert saying shots fired in Hammonds Plains.

I'm not seeing anyone freaking out on Facebook, just telling folks to stay safe.

Insanity. Today is the vigil for the victims of Portapique. Perhaps a coninsidence?

I dug out my NS flag to hang on the shed, wife told me to put it in the window (which it is now).

Hard to believe.


Edit: I don't know how many posters we have here from Halifax. I know Halifax Drunk is, but I don't know which community. Hopefully, he and his family are safe, as is everyone else there.

[Rando]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1253766091987435522

[Maritime Q-Scout]

Apparently the incident in Dartmouth was an airsoft gun at Canadian Tire.

The Hammonds Plains incident, which is separate, has shots fired and the community is in lockdown.

[Nsd1]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1253786835156959232

[WhiteTiger]

Originally Posted by Maritime Q-Scout

Has a policing agency dealt with this kind of scenario before?

Has it been game planned and practiced?

I suppose it should have been, but real events often differ from the mock up, especially if it is novel.

The steps and resources of smaller detachments might vary as well. What if the officer in charge of communicating with the Emergency Response System was on the front line? I don't know.

Its early to lay blame (even if your gut ends up being correct).

Originally Posted by wwkayaker

I’m sure they have planned for similar events but probably not to this scale in incidents nor the ground area. Several years ago, I spoke with an RCMP officer about school shootings and readiness. We were in a small town of 4500 people with 6 rcmp members. He said the rcmp has a plan but it was wishful thinking that it would work. He said they didn’t have enough officers to cover all of the high school entrances let alone buddy up and go into a situation safely.

Yup. This sort of thing is why when there was the Active Shooter scare in CrossIron Mills, the RCMP immediately called CPS for assistance. CPS had recently completed its multi-agency/large-building response training program and were close enough to get there quickly enough in enough numbers to actually help.

But yes, you can't even train for a "large scale response event" when your entire detachment is 8 officers. Usually, at best...1-4 have been able to travel somewhere where they get to participate in those training programs. But that opportunity doesn't come around very often, either.

[transplant99]

At 10:26 p.m. last Saturday, a man drove a vehicle down the only road in and out of Portapique, N.S., heading for the highway.

He was bleeding from a gunshot wound, in urgent need of medical care, and likely going into shock. What terrors must have gone through his mind as police cars drove toward him, the first responders to the worst spree killing in Canada’s history.

These were real police, and the man, who has survived, told them what had incomprehensibly happened. A police car had just driven by in the other direction, toward the beach, and the driver fired at him as they passed on the Portapique Beach Road. He could see the shooter, a middle aged white man, was dressed like an RCMP officer.

Portapique itself was burning down as police arrived, from fires set at seven crime scenes, including houses and outbuildings, permanent homes and summer cottages. About 100 people lived there year round.

There were bodies out on the road in front of a house, and more inside, 13 in all shot dead. Three people were injured and survived, two of them in Portapique.

On Sunday morning, with 19 people already dead, RCMP Const. Chad Morrison was parked in Shubenacadie, between Truro and Halifax, waiting for his colleague Const. Heidi Stevenson, when a police vehicle pulled up. He thought it was her, but it was Wortman who pulled alongside and shot Morrison from the driver’s seat. Morrison drove away, telling dispatch he was heading for medical care. He has survived several gunshot wounds.

At that same time, Stevenson was northbound on Highway 2 when she encountered Wortman coming south. Their cars collided head on, and she engaged him, Campbell said, but he killed her, took her gun and ammunition, and set both their cars ablaze.

Just effing crazy.

https://nationalpost.com/news/when-p...box=1587778986

[transplant99]

[bigtmac19]

Sadly, some very damning evidence in the timelines, that warning people he was in a police cruiser as soon as they knew could have saved 6 lives. This is such an ugly tragedy, and to find out all these mistakes made by RCMP is going to cause the families of the victims so much more grief and anger.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/rcmp-informa...ller-1.5544744

[BloodFetish]

Interesting dilemma. What if alerting people made the situation worse because a) any RCMP officer would now be potentially misidentified as the shooter and make their task more difficult and perhaps more dangerous, and b) a the same time also alert Wortman that his cover was blown?

As it was he ditched the police uniform after shooting Morrison and being engaged by Stevenson, indicating he was trying to avoid further detection. If he had earlier warning would he have been able to evade police for longer, and kill more people?

Without perfect hindsight I don't think anyone can say with certainly what the best course of action was.

[bigtmac19]

https://twitter.com/ctvnews/status/1...057729540?s=21

Nick Beaton, husband of Karen! This is heartbreaking beyond belief.

[browna]

Originally Posted by BloodFetish

Interesting dilemma. What if alerting people made the situation worse because a) any RCMP officer would now be potentially misidentified as the shooter and make their task more difficult and perhaps more dangerous, and b) a the same time also alert Wortman that his cover was blown?

As it was he ditched the police uniform after shooting Morrison and being engaged by Stevenson, indicating he was trying to avoid further detection. If he had earlier warning would he have been able to evade police for longer, and kill more people?

Without perfect hindsight I don't think anyone can say with certainly what the best course of action was.

Exactly. I have to think the “posing as an RCMP officer” factor was the biggest concern by authorities on how and when to properly communicate that, especially province wide. The extra fear and subsequent lack of trust of any police from that announcement, would’ve made the situation take on a different dynamic, as you say.

[Lubicon]

Originally Posted by Zulu29

No such thing as a POL anymore.

Hmm, did not know that. And I just renewed mine a year or two ago. Down the internet hole I go to see the process next time I need to renew.

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by Lubicon

Hmm, did not know that. And I just renewed mine a year or two ago. Down the internet hole I go to see the process next time I need to renew.

It would have turned into a PAL if it was just a year or two ago

[Lubicon]

Originally Posted by btimbit

It would have turned into a PAL if it was just a year or two ago

I had to look at it again, and it has the sweet word 'Acquisition' on it! It's pretty subtle, there was no mention of it when I went through the renewal or when I received it. If you would not have pointed it out I may not have even noticed.

This actually might solve an issue as my dad is getting up there in age and doesn't really want to keep his rifles anymore so had asked me if I wanted them. I do, for sentimental reasons but I only had a POL so did not think it was feasible without a bunch of extra steps. Now I might be able to, just need to decide if I want the hassle of storing them.

[Envitro]

Correct, the got rid of the POL designation, as it was meant to be temporary as a "bridge" license, so the converted everyone with a POL to a PAL.