What a fascinating thread. Here's what I don't like and believe is unsafe.
People driving at or below the speed limit in the left lane for no reason.
People who think speed limits are loose guidelines and don't apply to them because their driving skills are so superior.
Here is what doesn't bother me:
A guy trying to pass someone driving slowly in the right lane and who momentarily makes me slow down as he tries to make an efficient pass.
If I'm choosing to drive 20% over a posted speed limit, I try not to get too upset if someone makes me slow down a little bit, assuming they are just trying to get to where they're going and not playing a game.
Where I live there is a ton of traffic. You'll drive yourself crazy if you think its your responsibility to judge every other driver on the road.
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My pet peeve in the mountains is when a passing lane opens up, the lead car in the convoy accelerates to make it more difficult for multiple vehicles to pass. I don't know if people unconsciously do this as they design the passing panes in safer location or if they do it on purpose.
In general don't I think that there is the same level of respect on the road as there used to be.
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Because the speed which people travel is an important element on the overall safety of the roads. The position being put forth by some is that if everyone just moves over to allow people to go whatever speed they want - that everything will be hunkey dorey.
It may not be hunkey dorey but it will be better than what we have today. People are going to drive at variable speeds. If everyone follows the predictable system that is already outlined in the rules of the road, we would be much safer than we are today. As it stands, highway traffic in this province is a free-for-all of oblivious idiots impeding traffic and reckless morons weaving around them and passing at high speed on the right. It's much safer for all drivers if the oblivious idiots move over to the right and allow the reckless morons to pass properly without speeding through merge lanes and cutting off other drivers.
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It wouldn't be hunkey dorey, just a massive improvement for flow. I don't think anyone is saying that the guy doing 140 isn't an issue.
Eh, I'll say it... obviously it's context dependent, but if the road is dry, clear, and not too crowded, and it's an AB highway (which are basically flat and straight)... the guy doing 140 isn't really any more dangerous than the guy doing 120 all other things being equal. The trucks that blast through the snow at 140 in the winter are another story, but if Flame Envy wants to rip his way out to Canmore at 140+ in his GT350, I'm no more concerned about the danger he presents than the average driver.
It all depends on the road, but for me the highway I drive most is the one heading towards the mountains, and most of the first 70km of that road could be safely driven at ~180 kph in most peoples' cars, probably.* That's probably controversial, but the danger, from where I sit, is mostly presented by reactions of other drivers not being used to people travelling that fast rather than inherent to the modern vehicle's limitations, or the road itself. I've never done that, but that's because I don't want to get a ticket.
*Edit: I should probably clarify that most peoples' cars are probably speed limited by a governor so is mostly hypothetical.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robbob
My pet peeve in the mountains is when a passing lane opens up, the lead car in the convoy accelerates to make it more difficult for multiple vehicles to pass. I don't know if people unconsciously do this as they design the passing panes in safer location or if they do it on purpose.
I wrote about this earlier, and I'm basically certain that it's an unconscious reaction. Seems to me the three main causes are not wanting to be passed, suddenly feeling self-conscious that you've been driving too slowly when there was no passing lane (all these guys really want to drive 20kph faster than me? Oh man) and just the added breathing room of there suddenly being an extra lane between you and oncoming traffic.
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Last edited by CorsiHockeyLeague; 08-29-2016 at 10:47 AM.
I don't understand why this is even a debate regarding this. If you are in the left lane and there is a wide open space on your right, you are a poor driver. The relative speed of anyone else on the road has nothing to do with it.
Also, Highway 1 west between Calgary and Banff seems to be the worst place for this in Canada. I'm not sure if it's city folk who don't know how to drive on the highway heading to the mountains or tourists in rental cars clogging the road, but man that is a frustrating stretch of road.
Volume of traffic combined with bad drivers. I just drove this stretch on Saturday and it was bumper to bumper.
When the traffic has very few gaps you get a line of 10 cars in the left lane who want to at least do the speed limit, but are stuck behind some struggler somewhere up ahead. The right lane is bumper to bumper semi trailers, campers and tourists doing 100km in the 110km. This is when you get the raging lunitic coming up behind you, flashing his lights and weaving because he thinks the 10 cars ahead of him are just being ignorant and are choosing to drive 105km in the 110km.
This is where I'm not moving over. None of the cars 2-9 have moved over for the guy behind them, because we all want to go 20+ km faster. Wait your spot in the group until the struggler clears and we can all speed up and start moving over at the appropriate speeds and time.
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Why does it have to be different. It's pretty much exactly the same rules of the road, exactly the same type of road, exactly the same cars and exactly the same levels of traffic.
And yet this is what young Germans are required to do to get a drivers license:
14 theory classes
25-50 hours of driving lessons (until whenever the instructor feels you're ready)
First aid course
The above takes about 3 months and costs EUR 1000-2000 (CDN $1,500-3,000)
Many drivers (28%) fail on their first exam and have to repeat.
Safe to say they treat driving a bit differently than we do here, and it's not just a matter of attitude and following a few simple rules.
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And yet this is what young Germans are required to do to get a drivers license:
14 theory classes
25-50 hours of driving lessons (until whenever the instructor feels you're ready)
First aid course
The above takes about 3 months and costs EUR 1000-2000 (CDN $1,500-3,000)
Many drivers (28%) fail on their first exam and have to repeat.
Safe to say they treat driving a bit differently than we do here, and it's not just a matter of attitude and following a few simple rules.
Do we need 14 ####ing hours off ####ing theory classes to ####ing beat 5 ####ing words into everyones ####ing skull?
KEEP RIGHT EXCEPT TO PASS
Jesus. Maybe we should do a mandatory hour of class where you just sit there and write "Keep Right Except to Pass" over and over like they do in elementary school detention?
I think you just outlined exactly the problem. It isn't that simple. You keep holding up Germany as this model of how things should be but then choose to completely ignore the other important aspects to how they achieve that.
And have a meltdown in the process.
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I think you just outlined exactly the problem. It isn't that simple. You keep holding up Germany as this model of how things should be but then choose to completely ignore the other important aspects to how they achieve that.
And have a meltdown in the process.
Please elaborate what about those 5 words is so hard to understand?
Do we need 14 ####ing hours off ####ing theory classes to ####ing beat 5 ####ing words into everyones ####ing skull?
KEEP RIGHT EXCEPT TO PASS
Jesus. Maybe we should do a mandatory hour of class where you just sit there and write "Keep Right Except to Pass" over and over like they do in elementary school detention?
#### me.
I thought you were leaving.
BTW, Strange Brew's response nailed it for me.
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It's not like "slower traffic keep right" is a European concept. I learned that long before I drove in Europe. The concept is universal.
The highway is not a place for you to stand your ground on what you perceive to be a speed others should drive. The sign says "Slower traffic keep right" not "traffic going slower than the speed limit keep right". If someone, in your mind, is being an ####### by driving too fast in your opinion, just move over anyway and let them go by.
The concept is so simple that I don't even understand why people feel the need to argue about it.
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Last time I was towing my trailer I almost wiped a guy out. I was cruising at 110 on the double lane, passing a semi, and mister 130 comes up on my ass. I carry on passed the semi, and just as I start lane changing Mr 130 decides to cut the semi off and pass me on the right. I in turn have to swerve back in the left lane with my car trailer, or there's gonna be a lot of metal bent.
This guy can go eff himself, the semi going 100 is doing nothing wrong, I'm not doing anything wrong, his aggresion is the only thing dangerous in this situation.
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Last time I was towing my trailer I almost wiped a guy out. I was cruising at 110 on the double lane, passing a semi, and mister 130 comes up on my ass. I carry on passed the semi, and just as I start lane changing Mr 130 decides to cut the semi off and pass me on the right. I in turn have to swerve back in the left lane with my car trailer, or there's gonna be a lot of metal bent.
This guy can go eff himself, the semi going 100 is doing nothing wrong, I'm not doing anything wrong, his aggresion is the only thing dangerous in this situation.
You passed a 100km semi at 110 towing a trailer? Yeesh. Not illegal I guess, but I'd say that's a crappy, long highway pass.
You guys are turning German drivers into some mythical driving ubermachines, in reality, Europeans just have more education and training for pretty much everything you do. You used to need to have a license to a ride a bike or go swimming as a kid (license is the wrong word but it was a card and course). Do you think that made Poland some biking and swimming utopia? It's just how things are over there. I promise you, they don't spend more than a couple minutes on "Keep Right Except To Pass". Does it take any more than a few minutes to cover this:
"If you are passing you are allowed to use the left lane. If you are not passing then don't be in that lane. If you want to pass, take a look to make sure there isn't someone coming up that will pass a lot quicker than you. Passing on the right is illegal."
That's all there is to it. There is nothing in that sentence that is left for interpretation.
This thread is making me seem like I rage up and down deerfoot on a daily basis, which I don't. I lost the will to try and weave around traffic or get mad at people a long time ago. I drive from one end of the city to the other, daily, it has numbed me to stupidity of the people on the roads.
It's seeing the responses in this thread. That's what's driving me nuts. It's basically everything wrong with what we see on the road summed up in one thread and the worst part is, it's from otherwise smart posters. I just can't understand how this is a debate of some sort. There's nothing to explain, there are no caveats to "Keep Right Except To Pass".
Last time I was towing my trailer I almost wiped a guy out. I was cruising at 110 on the double lane, passing a semi, and mister 130 comes up on my ass. I carry on passed the semi, and just as I start lane changing Mr 130 decides to cut the semi off and pass me on the right. I in turn have to swerve back in the left lane with my car trailer, or there's gonna be a lot of metal bent.
This guy can go eff himself, the semi going 100 is doing nothing wrong, I'm not doing anything wrong, his aggresion is the only thing dangerous in this situation.
Ugh, I hate that. The only thing worse than a slow semi passing a slightly slower semi is when he can't even move back over after the pass is over because there's always a few #######s that undertake him right away
You passed a 100km semi at 110 towing a trailer? Yeesh. Not illegal I guess, but I'd say that's a crappy, long highway pass.
No that sounds like a perfectly normal pass. A 10km/h difference shouldn't take long to pass. People towing trailers are allowed to pass too you know. And presuming the OP didn't cut off the car or brake check him or anything else silly, which we have no reason to believe he did, I see nothing wrong with it.
The idiot in that story should be really obvious.
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