AltaGuy has a magnetic personality and exudes positive energy, which is infectious to those around him. He has an unparalleled ability to communicate with people, whether he is speaking to a room of three or an arena of 30,000.
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: At le pub...
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blueski
I make over that and live in a used van. Guess I messed up somewhere...
Yup.
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No, that's not my argument. Are you joking around with me? I've restated my argument in every single post I've made in this thread to the point where I'm getting tired of repeating myself.
How do you not understand what I'm saying?
Ah I didn't know a 1998 Ford Probe cost more when you earned 200,000 a year.
... and just like I said, there is no way people can agree on the definition of rich without comparing the magic number to their own financial situation.
I hear this "anyone over $100K is rich" sentiment often from my kids' friends. It is especially funny hearing it from guys in their mid-20's with degrees in writing, communications and graphic design etc. that are still living in their parents' basements, drive their parents' cars and spending their days on social networks and video games.
I am with Sliver on this one. Only household's net worth (market value of all household assets less all household liabilities) is a true definition of wealth. Income is not.
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"An idea is always a generalization, and generalization is a property of thinking. To generalize means to think." Georg Hegel
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No, that's not my argument. Are you joking around with me? I've restated my argument in every single post I've made in this thread to the point where I'm getting tired of repeating myself.
How do you not understand what I'm saying?
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I disagree. You're doing well making $200k, but if you live within your means, are raising a family, socking away for retirement, maxing out RESPs, etc., then you have more in common with the guy making $60k per year than the guy with $10 mil in the bank.
You're far from the point of having your money earn an income of its own making $200k. You have to get up every day and go to work still. You have to budget. You have to plan for retirement. You can't spend willy-nilly if you want to be growing your net worth.
There are lots of guys that make that kind of money and certainly many in Calgary that look rich in that every second car is a BMW or Audi these days and the houses are beautiful. But if you're spending everything you make without actually growing your net worth, then you could hardly be called rich.
You're mistaking a high income with being rich. It's your net worth that should define whether or not you're rich.
If you go back in the thread I think Silver has been pretty consistent with what he has been arguing and in my opinion is right.
I'll try to argue it from a different angle.
A doctor or dentist will spend about 8 years doing their education and have a debt of ~250K if they don't have much help given university fees and living expenses in Canada. This is assuming they live frugally and work summers.
Once they have graduated lets say most on average make between 150-200K at first. They will pay off their debt in about 3-5 years but I don't know how anyone can call them rich or wealthy at this point. They might be able to afford to buy a house or practice eventually and with that they may become wealthy but until they have amassed some money I don't think they are rich. Being educated or having a high paying job gives you the opportunity to become rich but does not and should not mean you are classified as rich.
Its important to differentiate between making a big salary (because imho it is usually earned after years of hard work) and having a huge amount of money that you are sitting on (ie. because you inherited it or are just lucky/greedy).
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To me, having enough wealth to do whatever I want to do would mean that I'm rich. As soon as I don't have to get up to earn money everyday just to pay off the house or to save for retirement, that would be rich to me. Until then I'm a slave and it doesn't matter what my pay check is.
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If you go back in the thread I think Silver has been pretty consistent with what he has been arguing and in my opinion is right.
I'll try to argue it from a different angle.
Once they have graduated lets say most on average make between 150-200K at first. They will pay off their debt in about 3-5 years but I don't know how anyone can call them rich or wealthy at this point.
I don't disagree with your point but even a first year doctor in Alberta makes a lot more than 200k. Assuming they're working full time they can easily pull in 500K.
I own a house and make a couple of hundred grand a year, I don't feel rich but I agonize over whether I want to drop four grand on an amplifier to replace the two grand one I've got that works fine and sounds great while my mate with a kid in a wheelchair who has to work a graveyard cleaning shift and can't pay his phone bill.
That's when I realize what a lucky spoilt ####### I am and how skewed our view of wealth has become.
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I own a house and make a couple of hundred grand a year, I don't feel rich but I agonize over whether I want to drop four grand on an amplifier to replace the two grand one I've got that works fine and sounds great while my mate with a kid in a wheelchair who has to work a graveyard cleaning shift and can't pay his phone bill.
That's when I realize what a lucky spoilt ####### I am and how skewed our view of wealth has become.
This is it exactly, imo. Those defending 150k+ earners as not wealthy or particularly rich are losing the forest for the trees.
If you make $200k and decide to maximize what you own with that money and then claim "it doesn't make me wealthy or rich, look I still have a mortgage and all these things I pay for, so I'm closer to the average family than a wealthy person", you've lost perspective.
That makes as much sense as a $500k/yr earner mortgaging a multi million dollar house, buying all the amazing toys and living luxuries he could possibly afford and then saying "Well, don't tell me I'm wealthy, I still gotta watch my spending, it's no free for all like lower earners seem to think".
Statistics pretty clearly lay out where different levels of earners sit in society and if statistics show you earn in the top 3 to 5 percent of an entire society, maybe it's time to step back and really look at your life and how it compares to the vast majority of people on this earth.
Last edited by jayswin; 06-05-2016 at 02:28 PM.
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There is now a searchable database so it's up to the general public to submit tips to the authorities. But I can't imagine police forces worldwide have the resources to follow up on every tip they receive.
Yes, the 200k person can do a hell of a lot more, but they are still driving old cars because they can't afford a new one. They still have a mortgage, worry about losing their home etc....
Not to single out CorporateJay, but this was kind of the point that compelled me to post the above. I mean, sure there's people earning $200k a year that aren't driving new cars because they made a choice but you can't objectively claim that there's a bunch of $200k earners out there driving old cars because they can't afford new ones.
That's got to be a case of losing perspective, imo and confusing ability with desire. If you desire to maximize your house, toys and everything else you own, I guess you could get to a point where you had to drive an old car because you couldn't afford a new one. But there's no way you could convince me it's because that's just how close $200k earners are to the middle class, it would be through some pretty extreme spending habits and a very large mortgage, or extrenuating circumstances.
There is now a searchable database so it's up to the general public to submit tips to the authorities. But I can't imagine police forces worldwide have the resources to follow up on every tip they receive.
I would really hope that something is actually being done by the RCMP behind the spotlight. I don't mind if I am not hearing about this in the media, but the tax cheats should be brought to justice and pay whatever their share like everybody else.
With respect to the rich/poor debate, maybe it has evolved to the point where it could be its own thread.
Journalists can't afford to keep reporting on this.
People rubbing their hands together with satisfaction over the imminent demise of the traditional media might want to stop and consider how stories like this will be investigated and published in the future. Maybe dedicated, talented bloggers will work on this for hundreds of hours, without any compensation, agenda, or bias.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fotze
If this day gets you riled up, you obviously aren't numb to the disappointment yet to be a real fan.
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Well it did cause the biggest protest in Icelandic history, we ousted the prime minister. But sadly after that even with more and more crap coming out people seem numb to it. Even our one billionare has been ousted with one of the more complex schemes we've seen, over 50 offshore companies tied together, people barely batted an eye over that one.
