Ongoing Senate scandal

[Rerun]

Originally Posted by Slava

Again Rerun, let me ask you....why did Nigel Wright cut the cheque? Just out of the goodness of his heart?

I believe he cut a cheque as a loan to Duffy because Duffy knew he had to pay back the money he stole and he was crying "poor". I also believe that Wright expected Duffy to pay him back. I mean... why would he just give Duffy $90000 out of his own pocket? Wright isn't a millionaire as far as I know.

I also believe that Wright was totally in the Dark about this just being the tip of the iceberg with respect to Duffy's expense shenanigans.

[Makarov]

Originally Posted by Rerun

I believe he cut a cheque as a loan to Duffy because Duffy knew he had to pay back the money he stole and he was crying "poor". I also believe that Wright expected Duffy to pay him back. I mean... why would he just give Duffy $90000 out of his own pocket? Wright isn't a millionaire as far as I know.

I also believe that Wright was totally in the Dark about this just being the tip of the iceberg with respect to Duffy's expense shenanigans.

That's great, but I think that Canadians are entitled to more than just your speculation.

[Senator Clay Davis]

Originally Posted by Rerun

I believe he cut a cheque as a loan to Duffy because Duffy knew he had to pay back the money he stole and he was crying "poor". I also believe that Wright expected Duffy to pay him back. I mean... why would he just give Duffy $90000 out of his own pocket? Wright isn't a millionaire as far as I know.

I also believe that Wright was totally in the Dark about this just being the tip of the iceberg with respect to Duffy's expense shenanigans.

Uhh Wright is very wealthy (look up his business career). I mean he did cut a $90,000 cheque like it ain't no thing. People with limited income do not do such things. He left a 7 figure job to become Chief of Staff.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by Rerun

I believe he cut a cheque as a loan to Duffy because Duffy knew he had to pay back the money he stole and he was crying "poor". I also believe that Wright expected Duffy to pay him back. I mean... why would he just give Duffy $90000 out of his own pocket? Wright isn't a millionaire as far as I know.

I also believe that Wright was totally in the Dark about this just being the tip of the iceberg with respect to Duffy's expense shenanigans.

I have yet to see any evidence that this is a loan. Not one shred, and as far I as have seen you're the only one speculating that! So if its not a loan, he just decided to give away $90k. That makes absolutely no sense. You have to admit that in the absence of loan documents that the attempt is obvious; to avoid Deloitte and the political carnage.

Once you get to that point in the logical reasoning, its pretty obvious that Wright doesn't pay a sitting legislator $90,000 (which is also illegal) without his boss knowing. The benefit here isn't to Nigel Wright, its to Stephen Harper. It reeks.

[MarchHare]

I remember when this story broke several months ago, there was lots of speculation that the $90,000 was going to be reimbursed to Wright from Conservative Party funds. I'm not sure if there's any truth to that, but I have to suspect donors to the CPC probably don't appreciate their contributions being used that way.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

I remember when this story broke several months ago, there was lots of speculation that the $90,000 was going to be reimbursed to Wright from Conservative Party funds. I'm not sure if there's any truth to that, but I have to suspect donors to the CPC probably don't appreciate their contributions being used that way.

I forgot about that! Wasn't the original story there something about a secret fund that the PMO had and how they used that money?

[Daradon]

Originally Posted by Rerun

Oh my god... I can't believe I'm agreeing with Daradon.

Lol, I thought you said you blocked me...

I'm not sure Rerun is defending the PM here. I think he is just saying, as I am, that these senators probably won't get their proper punishment cause the way the rules are written right now. As much as I don't like that, I get it. So from here on in, we need to make sure the rules are stricter and more clear.

They know what they did was wrong morally, but unfortunately, especially since the review said the rules are written poorly, there is a legal fuzzy area. And they know that too.

Of course, politicians protect themselves first, and worry about their responsibilities to the voters secondly (if at all, haha) so getting things changed may take a while, even though all the politicians are trying to score points now by telling us they support change. I guess it'll be up to the voters to make sure the issue stays front and center even after this particular scandal.

The cheque and the PM's involvement is a different issue altogether. That needs to be further investigated. Something definitely seems fishy there, but what exactly is going on isn't known yet. Rerun seems to be admitting that.

I would love to know what it is, and I do think Harper is guilty of something substantial, but at the end of the day I've switched my vote from Harper long ago, so it doesn't really matter. It's highly unlikely that something is going to bring him down right now. And sadly, the truth is probably impossible to know. If it ever does come out, and it brings him down, I would support that. However, if it came out that there was little to no wrong doing, that would be fine too.

I just hope voters memories last another 2 years (which I believe they will).

[MarchHare]

Originally Posted by Slava

I forgot about that! Wasn't the original story there something about a secret fund that the PMO had and how they used that money?

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/pm-s...fund-1.1348639

[Slava]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/pm-s...fund-1.1348639

Rerun should re-read that as well. Make sure you catch the part about the $90k 'gift' to Duffy. First Duffy claimed he paid that with a bank loan...which I'm sure he just concocted for no particular reason!

[Rerun]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

I remember when this story broke several months ago, there was lots of speculation that the $90,000 was going to be reimbursed to Wright from Conservative Party funds. I'm not sure if there's any truth to that, but I have to suspect donors to the CPC probably don't appreciate their contributions being used that way.

Originally Posted by Slava

I forgot about that! Wasn't the original story there something about a secret fund that the PMO had and how they used that money?

Originally Posted by Slava

Rerun should re-read that as well. Make sure you catch the part about the $90k 'gift' to Duffy. First Duffy claimed he paid that with a bank loan...which I'm sure he just concocted for no particular reason!

So did the Conservative Party pay the $90,000? NO.

Now if a cheque was written on the funds bank account, then you'd have a story... but it wasn't so there isn't ... other than make believe and what if by journalists and others who want to stir the pot by throwing a few red herrings into it.

And by the way, did Harper and Wright do something illegal when they set up this fund which by the way are from contributions to the CPC? I've certainly contributed to the CPC and there wasn't any stipulation that the $20 I gave was to be solely spent on election expenses...

Are you saying that other parties don't have funds like this... assuming that is that they have money which in Liberal case probably isn't true. No I don't think so.

So I would have to assume that your problem is that Harper has and Wright did, have signing authority. I have no problem with that. If they abuse their signing authority then they would have to answer to the CPC itself. Its money that belongs to the CPC, not the government of Canada or the taxpayer.

[RedHot25]

Originally Posted by Rerun

Its money that belongs to the CPC, not the government of Canada or the taxpayer.

Like all political party funds, more than half of all the cash in the secret PMO stash ultimately comes from taxpayers' pockets. Individual donors to political parties receive generous tax credits. Parties also receive millions from taxpayers through a per-vote subsidy, which is being phased out by 2015.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by Rerun

So did the Conservative Party pay the $90,000? NO.

Now if a cheque was written on the funds bank account, then you'd have a story... but it wasn't so there isn't ... other than make believe and what if by journalists and others who want to stir the pot by throwing a few red herrings into it.

And by the way, did Harper and Wright do something illegal when they set up this fund which by the way are from contributions to the CPC? I've certainly contributed to the CPC and there wasn't any stipulation that the $20 I gave was to be solely spent on election expenses...

Are you saying that other parties don't have funds like this... assuming that is that they have money which in Liberal case probably isn't true. No I don't think so.

So I would have to assume that your problem is that Harper has and Wright did, have signing authority. I have no problem with that. If they abuse their signing authority then they would have to answer to the CPC itself. Its money that belongs to the CPC, not the government of Canada or the taxpayer.

Fact is, despite all your bluster, you can't just cut a cheque to a sitting legislator. Its obviously off-limits. Duffy knew it, which is why he tried to say it was a bank loan. You keep saying Wright loaned him the money, despite no evidence of that being the case.

Let me ask again. Why did Wright give him $90,000?

[Rerun]

Originally Posted by Slava

Fact is, despite all your bluster, you can't just cut a cheque to a sitting legislator. Its obviously off-limits. Duffy knew it, which is why he tried to say it was a bank loan. You keep saying Wright loaned him the money, despite no evidence of that being the case.

Let me ask again. Why did Wright give him $90,000?

Because he's a hell of a nice guy!!! ... and apparently (as told by SCD) he's a millionaire so its probably pocket change to him and Duffy is apparently one step removed from the poor house and Duffy just couldn't find the $90,000 himself.

[Rerun]

Originally Posted by RedHot25

Like all political party funds, more than half of all the cash in the secret PMO stash ultimately comes from taxpayers' pockets. Individual donors to political parties receive generous tax credits. Parties also receive millions from taxpayers through a per-vote subsidy, which is being phased out by 2015.

So you are saying the money doesn't belong to the CPC?

Hmmm.... somebody better tell the CPC that and every other political party out there that has received donations and the vote subsidy.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by Rerun

Because he's a hell of a nice guy!!! ... and apparently (as told by SCD) he's a millionaire so its probably pocket change to him and Duffy is apparently one step removed from the poor house and Duffy just couldn't find the $90,000 himself.

I know that you don't actually believe that, so I can't even argue with you. No one just gives away $90,000. He either expected the CPC to pay him back, or they were trying to avoid the audit or both.

[Rerun]

Originally Posted by Slava

I know that you don't actually believe that, so I can't even argue with you. No one just gives away $90,000. He either expected the CPC to pay him back, or they were trying to avoid the audit or both.

Speculation on your part.... so my speculation is just as valid as yours.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by Rerun

Speculation on your part.... so my speculation is just as valid as yours.

You're not speculating anything. You just won't admit it.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by Rerun

Speculation on your part.... so my speculation is just as valid as yours.

How is it speculation when the evidence points towards Harper knowing and being involved

His insistence that he knew nothing about the complex web of arrangements surrounding his government’s attempts, first to first protect Mike Duffy from scrutiny and then to throw the embattled senator overboard, defy belief.

They defy belief because so many people close to the prime minister are known to have been involved.

This information is not new. RCMP documents made public in June revealed that the matter of Duffy’s expenses were top of mind not only in the prime minister’s office but at the most senior levels of the Conservative Party.

Indeed, in the early days, the only question seems to have been whether the party itself would cover Duffy’s dubious expense claims in order to squelch a potential political scandal involving the then Conservative senator, or whether some other source of funding would be required.

That Harper, a notoriously hands-on leader, knew nothing of these discussions is impossible to believe, regardless of his denials.

http://www.thestar.com/news/queenspa...al_walkom.html

[Rerun]

Originally Posted by Dion

How is it speculation when the evidence points towards Harper knowing and being involved





http://www.thestar.com/news/queenspa...al_walkom.html

Its speculation unless you have proof otherwise. Do you have proof? No. Just a Toronto Star reporter's printed speculation.

And by the way this reporter is known Harper hater... and very pro NDP

Why Stephen Harper may waltz through the Senate scandal: Walkom

More union-bashing as Stephen Harper tries to deflect attention from Senate: Walkom

Stephen Harper could have avoided Mike Duffy woes by obeying the law: Walkom

Canada-Europe trade deal not really about trade: Walkom

Stephen Harper ignores Canada’s First Nations at own peril: Walkom

Economy is Stephen Harper’s weak spot despite Conservative bragging: Walkom

Why Stephen Harper disses the Commonwealth and UN: Walkom

Stephen Harper, Israel and the strange metaphor of the mourning dove hunt: Walkom

Tom Mulcair’s conservative NDP economics: Walkom .... (this story really made me laugh)

[Dion]

Originally Posted by Rerun

Its speculation unless you have proof otherwise. Do you have proof? No. Just a Toronto Star reporter's printed speculation

How can you trust Harper when dodges questions and refuses to give an straight answer?

As for Mr. Wright’s presence, the Prime Minister had at least four opportunities to acknowledge it.

Twice on June 4, Thomas Mulcair asked the Prime Minister who was present at that meeting. Neither question received a straight answer.

On June 5, Mr. Mulcair returned to the matter of the meeting and was more direct, asking Mr. Harper if Nigel Wright was present at the meeting.
The Prime Minister neither confirmed nor denied Mr. Wright’s presence.

On June 6, Mr. Mulcair tried again, asking the Prime Minister whether Nigel Wright had been present when Mr. Harper instructed Mr. Duffy to repay his expenses. The Prime Minister did not provide a straight answer in response.

http://www2.macleans.ca/2013/10/23/s...ry-13-meeting/

Or a PM who keeps changing the facts?

On June 5 in the House, Harper said: “Those were [Wright's] decisions. They were not communicated to me or to members of my office.”

“After firing Nigel Wright, the prime minister told Canadians in this House that absolutely no one else — not a few — no one else knew about the deal between Duffy and Wright. Now he admits that top Conservatives actually did know about the scheme,” Mulcair said.

If a “few” people knew of the plan, why didn’t Harper fire the others involved, Mulcair also asked.

http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/10...to-mike-duffy/