RFA's - Who gets qualified/signed, who is let go?

[PeteMoss]

Anyone who is saying they wouldn't sign Butler is off their rocker. He's a legit NHL player. He may not have a ton of potential or ever be anything beyond a 5-6 guy but you don't just let a guy walk for nothing when he's going to cost you 1.5 million and can actually play in the NHL.

I get the guy is some's whipping boy because the Regehr trade wasn't what anyone expected and he was overmatched in the top pairing role last year. But the guy is fine.

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

I'll give you young, but I wouldn't say he's cheap (he's average) and I don't see a lot of upswing, really. Just IMO. The only thing he's got is that he's young.

I wouldn't mind seeing someone like Breen or Cudari in there, if nothing else rather then just run some time off the clock and try not to set another NHL +/- record, I'd rather take a guy that brings something - physical play or offense or something. Butler really brings neither. He's just there (oh ya, and he's kind of young... well not really that young, but younger then 40)

You need more than 6 guys on the roster who can play defense. People do get hurt.

[FlameZilla]

Butler has actually looked very solid when called upon as a bottom pairing D this season. Pairing him with Sarich or Carson seems to bring the best out of him. He'll never live down how bad he was paired with Bouwmeester. What was Sutter thinking? Two 'top-pairing' defenceman and neither of them ever threw an effective body check. Stubborn fool...

[bax]

I wouldn't mind our D to look like this next year:

Gio-Wideman
Brodie-Butler
Cundari/Smith/Breen

Then hopefully give some games to Wotherspoon. It looks pretty bad on paper, but we're going to be a pretty bad team anyways

[Tinordi]

Absolutely Butler is re-signed.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by PeteMoss

You need more than 6 guys on the roster who can play defense. People do get hurt.

Is that why we parked over $4M worth of healthy defenseman in the press box?

Currently we have 4 dman under contract. (Wideman, Gio, Smith, Sarich). For our last 3 spots, we need to fill 2 top 4 dman and 1 bottom pairing dman... for that bottom pairing guy, its down to Butler ($1.25M), or Cudari or Breen (less than $1M). Not that I've seen either play, but besides being cheaper, both seem to bring some physicality to the game; Butler doesn't.

Of coarse, Butler can be our top 4 guy too, in which case, keep him. But bottom pairing? Rather give Cudari or Breen a chance as they have more upside.

[PeteMoss]

The Flames may need 2 top 4 d-men... but doubtful they are going to get them. They'll have those 4 plus Brodie and Butler. Who knows if Breen or Cundari can even play at this level at this point? If both of them are ready, you can try to trade Sarich during the year or send Smith down to the minors.

Even if you don't want Butler on the roster... you still sign him and try to move him. He's an asset. You don't just let him go for nothing because he doesn't bodycheck.

[blankall]

Butler is seriously underated here. He's a solid bottom pairing guy, who can play top 4, if need be (although admittedly, I don't want him in the top 4 full time). He will be re-signed.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by PeteMoss

The Flames may need 2 top 4 d-men... but doubtful they are going to get them. They'll have those 4 plus Brodie and Butler. Who knows if Breen or Cundari can even play at this level at this point? If both of them are ready, you can try to trade Sarich during the year or send Smith down to the minors.

Even if you don't want Butler on the roster... you still sign him and try to move him. He's an asset. You don't just let him go for nothing because he doesn't bodycheck.

Just reading what others have to say, seems like Breen is ready and is only taking a No 7 spot. If he's not, Cundari is plan C. Plan D can always be acquired as a trade. Carson isn't a bad Plan D either.

Sarich vs Butler... I'd take Sarich at this point.

No guarantee's you can get an asset for Butler... tons of guys like him out there.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by blankall

Butler is seriously underated here. He's a solid bottom pairing guy, who can play top 4, if need be (although admittedly, I don't want him in the top 4 full time). He will be re-signed.

It's kind of crazy how some fans personal dislike for Butler has clouded their minds of any logic or reasoning.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

It's kind of crazy how some fans personal dislike for Butler has clouded their minds of any logic or reasoning.

I think people forget just how bad a bottom pairing d-man can be. Butler is far from the worst and is in a solid age and salary range. Giving him up for nothing would be a huge waste.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by blankall

Butler is seriously underated here. He's a solid bottom pairing guy, who can play top 4, if need be (although admittedly, I don't want him in the top 4 full time). He will be re-signed.

If he is so solid, why was he an often healthy scratch this year?

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

If he is so solid, why was he an often healthy scratch this year?

4 times?

..and only once in the last 30.

Playing it fast and loose with the term "often" there, aren't you?

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

If he is so solid, why was he an often healthy scratch this year?

4/42 is often? Bit of hyperbole don't you think?

He's a young, competent defenseman. If you wanna get rid of him you deal him for a pick rather than let him go for nothing. He's just heading into his prime.

Those advocating we don't re-sign him are suggesting some horrible asset management. Butler's worth at least a 3rd-4th rounder IMO. Zero chance we don't re-sign him. If you're advocating trading him sure that makes some sense. Not re-signing him makes zero sense.

[Bertuzzied]

Next years Dmen.

Wideman/Brodie
Geodano/Regehr
Sarich/Breen or Carson

[Teroy]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

If he is so solid, why was he an often healthy scratch this year?

Why the heck were a lot of guys a healthy scratch this year?

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

4 times?

..and only once in the last 30.

Playing it fast and loose with the term "often" there, aren't you?

Yeah, so for key games (up until Feaster asked Iginla/Bouw to waive their NMC) he was benched 4/23 times (17% of the time, a healthy scratch).... not what I expect from a solid NHL defenseman. To me, that sounds like a fringe dman.

Even 4/42 is 10% a healthy scratch, which IMO doesn't sound like a "solid" NHLer.

Butler might be able to get a 5th round pick, but honestly, many dman of his ilk pass through waivers as well.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by Teroy

Why the heck were a lot of guys a healthy scratch this year?

Fringe NHL players (rather then "solid" NHL players, which was the description for Butler)

[Fire]

Originally Posted by Bertuzzied

Next years Dmen.

Wideman/Brodie
Geodano/Regehr
Sarich/Breen or Carson

Cundari is in the line-up next season guaranteed. I believe he was the last D-man cut from the Blues training camp this season and they have a better blue line then we do. Carson won't be re-signed. Regehr is so over the hill at this point he is already on flat ground.

Next season:

Giordano - Wideman
Brodie - Cundari
Butler - Smith
Sarich/Breen

Sarich will be traded at the deadline.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

Yeah, so for key games (up until Feaster asked Iginla/Bouw to waive their NMC) he was benched 4/23 times (17% of the time, a healthy scratch).... not what I expect from a solid NHL defenseman. To me, that sounds like a fringe dman.

Even 4/42 is 10% a healthy scratch, which IMO doesn't sound like a "solid" NHLer.

Butler might be able to get a 5th round pick, but honestly, many dman of his ilk pass through waivers as well.

Disagree, I don't think he'd pass through waivers. I think you underrate his value.

And you advocate keeping Sarich over him. By your own logic Sarich is even less of a solid defenseman. He's been scratched 18/42 times, almost 50%. He is also way older and nearing the end of his career. Why would the Flames keep a much older, more fringe defenseman over Butler?

Not really seeing any logic in your stance on this one.