Canada/US trade war brewing

[Azure]

Is this what the first trade war of the global economic crisis looks like?



Ordered by Congress to "buy American" when spending money from the $787 billion stimulus package, the town of Peru, Ind., stunned its Canadian supplier by rejecting sewage pumps made outside of Toronto. After a Navy official spotted Canadian pipe fittings in a construction project at Camp Pendleton, Calif., they were hauled out of the ground and replaced with American versions. In recent weeks, other Canadian manufacturers doing business with U.S. state and local governments say they have been besieged with requests to sign affidavits pledging that they will only supply materials made in the USA.


Outrage spread in Canada, with the Toronto Star last week bemoaning "a plague of protectionist measures in the U.S." and Canadian companies openly fretting about having to shift jobs to the United States to meet made-in-the-USA requirements. This week, the Canadians fired back. A number of Ontario towns, with a collective population of nearly 500,000, retaliated with measures effectively barring U.S. companies from their municipal contracts -- the first shot in a larger campaign that could shut U.S. companies out of billions of dollars worth of Canadian projects.


This is not your father's trade war, a tit-for-tat over champagne or cheese. With countries worldwide desperately trying to keep and create jobs in the midst of a global recession, the spat between the United States and its normally friendly northern neighbor underscores what is emerging as the biggest threat to open commerce during the economic crisis.



Rather than merely raising taxes on imported goods -- acts that are subject to international treaties -- nations including the United States are finding creative ways to engage in protectionism through domestic policy decisions that are largely not governed by international law. Unlike a classic trade war, there is little chance of containment through, for example, arbitration at the World Trade Organization in Geneva. Additionally, such moves are more likely to have unintended consequences or even backfire on the stated desire to create domestic jobs.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...051404241.html

Thoughts?

[MelBridgeman]

Not suprised...we were warned, but were too busy being "inspired"

[killer_carlson]

hmmmmm

a democrat putting up protectionist trade barriers.\

never heard of that before


at least they are not the goddamned NDP that wants us to back out of NAFTA.

[Kool Keef]

Isn't this the kind of nonsense that turns a recession into a depression?

[Daradon]

The thing is there is probably not much we can do. We've known this for a long time. I know a lot of people what to play hard ball and do things like, not sell our oil to them, but that really just hurts us more anyway.

Unless there's someway we could get around that, enough demand in Asia? You'd think we could sell exclusively elsewhere? I dunno.

[Daradon]

Originally Posted by killer_carlson

hmmmmm

a democrat putting up protectionist trade barriers.\

never heard of that before


at least they are not the goddamned NDP that wants us to back out of NAFTA.

I think the republicans would be doing the same thing if they were in power.

Let's not forget they were in power when our softwood and beef was being banned. Softwood quite illegally too, we even had a ruling from the WTO that they didn't follow.

The States does whatever they want. It's not a republican/democrat thing. It's a US thing.

[T@T]

After a Navy official spotted Canadian pipe fittings in a construction project at Camp Pendleton, Calif., they were hauled out of the ground and replaced with American versions.

So essentially a person working for the US government is playing with the free trade agreement

This could get ugly.

[RougeUnderoos]

After a Navy official spotted Canadian pipe fittings in a construction project at Camp Pendleton, Calif., they were hauled out of the ground and replaced with American versions.

That kind of action should save plenty of money and provide thousands of jobs.

Hopefully that piping company has a No Refunds policy.

[ikaris]

Let's legalize pot. Good source of income. I think it would be an appropriate response.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Kool Keef

Isn't this the kind of nonsense that turns a recession into a depression?

I don't know about that.....but it is the kind of nonsense that you don't talk about when your own economy is having problems.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Daradon

I think the republicans would be doing the same thing if they were in power.

Let's not forget they were in power when our softwood and beef was being banned. Softwood quite illegally too, we even had a ruling from the WTO that they didn't follow.

The States does whatever they want. It's not a republican/democrat thing. It's a US thing.

Meh.

Republicans aren't in power right now though, and at a time where there is economical trouble, it probably isn't a good idea to start creating issues with your biggest trading partner.

[HOZ]

140 pound weakling versus the reigning world champ. Hmmmm


Like I said 2 weeks ago. We have to hope the US lives up to it's bargains because there is not much we can do. Hopefully exemptions can be negotiated as I don't see the Obama administration reversing this trend.

[Old Yeller]

They don't want our Canadian made sewage pumps but they sure will suck down all the oil we can give them.

The USA's GDP is around 14 times the size of ours... nevermind the 300+ million consumers compared to Canada's 33 million.

Maybe we can cut ourselves loose and float on over to the EU?

[Vulcan]

Isn't Harper negotiating with the EU for a trade agreement? We need to do this as the USA and Canada don't have exactly the same aims as evidenced in the Arctic with them not recognizing our claims. Even the UK, once our best partner no longer has a stake in Canada or cares, so we're on our own.

[Daradon]

Originally Posted by Azure

Meh.

Republicans aren't in power right now though, and at a time where there is economical trouble, it probably isn't a good idea to start creating issues with your biggest trading partner.

I was just replying to the democrat = higher degree of protectionism comment. I don't see it that way. I think when the chips are down and times are bad, any government is going to be increasingly protectionist.

As for your other comment, well it doesn't appear WE (Canadians) are creating the issue, they are. The issue is already there. And as mentioned with the softwood lumber deal, it isn't the first time we get taken advantage of.

As I mentioned in my first post, there's not a whole lot we can do to fix it, but if getting tougher or standing up for ourselves by playing hardball would work, I think we should look at it. For the record though, as I mentioned in my first post, I don't think it would and it would hurt us instead. I fully understand the problem, and the fact that our trade with them pretty much rules our countries economic health. I'm just saying, if there are ways we can thing outside the box, why not? No one likes being the one making all the concessions. It should be even both ways.

I think the pot idea is a grand one. Earn some cash, put up a middle finger, and strike a victory for civil rights all in one blow.

Heck California is talking about it. The States might be right behind us on this one anyway. It may be less of an issue than it seems.

[Daradon]

Originally Posted by HOZ

140 pound weakling versus the reigning world champ. Hmmmm


Like I said 2 weeks ago. We have to hope the US lives up to it's bargains because there is not much we can do. Hopefully exemptions can be negotiated as I don't see the Obama administration reversing this trend.

Don't kid yourself, the republicans would be doing the exact same thing. They threw a WTO ruling back in our face twice during the Bush years.

Like you said 140 pound weakling vs. reigning world champ. Totally right there. I disagree wholeheartedly that it matters who is running the show though. The US will do what it wants. And in the crisis they are in now, they should be for their own people. They're in it worse than we are.

What is needed is a world body with actual teeth to mediate these matters.

[killer_carlson]

Originally Posted by Daradon

I think the republicans would be doing the same thing if they were in power.

Let's not forget they were in power when our softwood and beef was being banned. Softwood quite illegally too, we even had a ruling from the WTO that they didn't follow.

The States does whatever they want. It's not a republican/democrat thing. It's a US thing.

no way.

Remember John Kerry had protectionist policies as a major part of his campaign. There was no economic trouble at that point in time, and no reason to go down that road except that it is old school democrat policy.

Obama is an inspiration for the entire world, but that doesn't mean we have to agree with everything he does, especially the blatant promotion of protectionism.

[Daradon]

Originally Posted by killer_carlson

no way.

Remember John Kerry had protectionist policies as a major part of his campaign. There was no economic trouble at that point in time, and no reason to go down that road except that it is old school democrat policy.

Obama is an inspiration for the entire world, but that doesn't mean we have to agree with everything he does, especially the blatant promotion of protectionism.

That's fine. I don't agree with him here either.

But I find it surprising how selective peoples memories are. 2 WTO rulings that weren't complied on softwood and a whole beef ban during the Bush years.

It's not a democrat/republican thing. It's a US thing. It's a world power vs. tiny country thing. They done it to us in pretty much every administration.

To turn this into a another repub vs demo issue is silly at best and just shows peoples biases. It is a Canada US relations issue? Yes. Is it a world trade and world trade regulations issue? Yes.

Democratic vs. Republican issue? Hardly.

[FlamesAddiction]

Is there really something wrong with buying locally? If the cost and quality are the same, buying locally should be the way to go imo.

[Stranger]

I read an article when the Canadian beef ban was going down and Hilary Clinton, John Kerry and Teddy Kennedy were leading the charge to ban Canadian beef because it was putting Americans at risk. I then started my own ban on Heinz Ketchup to hit Kerry, or at least his wife, in the pocketbook. Must have cost him about $30.00.