Would you make a midseason coaching change to try to salvage playoff hopes?

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

It is not indicative of being able to communicate effectively with the players, nor is it a proxy for "mentally preparing" a team. Quite frankly, the players have to do most of their mental preparation themselves. The coach is responsible for communicating the game plan and things each individual needs to work on. They are not Svengali's capable of manipulating their players with mind control.

It's fine to be angry, just make sure it's something to actually be angry about.

The coach's job is to prepare the team.

Under pressure you sink to the level of your preparation. This team quite obviously does not trust each other on the ice, and I would suggest the game plan.

That elevates to the responsibility of the coach.

And coaches that command respect can motivate individuals. Some coaches are great at this. Listen to Babcock speak. He tells people with authority that you decide what you are going to put in to your day. There are some good stories in books written by former players. Great stories about Darryl pushing guys buttons, calling them out in front of each other in the room, and being fiercely loyal in the press interviews.

No damn way is it on just the players to mentally prepare themselves. Coach has to set the tone.

I personally see how plausible it can be that Gully isn't doing it.

[4X4]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

Seriously, if one more of you brings up the whole "he doesn't talk to players after a loss" thing, I'm going to reach through my monitor and throat punch you.

It's already been established that this is actually quite common amongst NHL coaches, and rarely does it do any good to beat up on players that are already down or pissed about a loss immediately after the event. These are pros, they don't need to be told they sucked that night. They already know it (most of the time), and need time to process what happened in that game. Leaving it until the next morning's meeting is perfectly reasonable.

It is not indicative of being able to communicate effectively with the players, nor is it a proxy for "mentally preparing" a team. Quite frankly, the players have to do most of their mental preparation themselves. The coach is responsible for communicating the game plan and things each individual needs to work on. They are not Svengali's capable of manipulating their players with mind control.

It's fine to be angry, just make sure it's something to actually be angry about.

Yeah, well, the whole way he does things isn't getting very good results. Maybe an after game stern look or *gasp* a few words might change things.

You can throat punch monitors all you want, but it wont change the FACT that Giordano, Brodie, Gaudreau, Monahan, and Bennett are sucking balls this year. I, for one, see a common denominator. Maybe GG needs to rethink his approach, instead of expecting the entire core of the team to relearn their game.

You gonna punch me for telling the truth as I see it? I'm not allowed to bitch about it, but you are? You've got a thread with a megapost, and I have to shut my trap? You can STFU.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Cleveland Steam Whistle

Also, ripping the officials never works. Might make us fans feel better, but it serves no purpose. Especially if the Flames are already getting a raw deal from them because of Wideman gate.

Actually yelling at the refs in football does work. So therefore yelling at the refs in hockey likely has a similar affect.

In football more penalties are called for the team by ref on the bench sideline then by the ref on the opposing sideline and more are called in the middle of the field than either end.

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features...freakin-works/

[Igottago]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

Seriously, if one more of you brings up the whole "he doesn't talk to players after a loss" thing, I'm going to reach through my monitor and throat punch you.

It's already been established that this is actually quite common amongst NHL coaches, and rarely does it do any good to beat up on players that are already down or pissed about a loss immediately after the event. These are pros, they don't need to be told they sucked that night. They already know it (most of the time), and need time to process what happened in that game. Leaving it until the next morning's meeting is perfectly reasonable.

It is not indicative of being able to communicate effectively with the players, nor is it a proxy for "mentally preparing" a team. Quite frankly, the players have to do most of their mental preparation themselves. The coach is responsible for communicating the game plan and things each individual needs to work on. They are not Svengali's capable of manipulating their players with mind control.

It's fine to be angry, just make sure it's something to actually be angry about.

Any coach would tell you that's part of their responsibility. You can go on and on with examples in the history of professional sports (and probably amateur sports) on how great coaches mentally prepared their teams. Phil Jackson used to use zen techniques to build mental strength on the Chicago Bulls. Heck, even our last coach, crap on his system all you want -- how did he get any results? Motivation.

Now I'm not sure if Gulutzan does something to try to motivate them. I'm sure he does something. But whatever it is it seems highly ineffective.

[flamesforthecup2017]

bad idea for a couple of reasons, the first being we are not exactly a playoff contender so there is no guarantee if they turn it around it will mean a playoff spot.

Second is the team is young and i think we need a guy like gully going forward.

new coach, new system.

things would really have to blow up for me to change my opinion

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

The coach's job is to prepare the team.

Under pressure you sink to the level of your preparation. This team quite obviously does not trust each other on the ice, and I would suggest the game plan.

That elevates to the responsibility of the coach.

And coaches that command respect can motivate individuals. Some coaches are great at this. Listen to Babcock speak. He tells people with authority that you decide what you are going to put in to your day. There are some good stories in books written by former players. Great stories about Darryl pushing guys buttons, calling them out in front of each other in the room, and being fiercely loyal in the press interviews.

No damn way is it on just the players to mentally prepare themselves. Coach has to set the tone.

I personally see how plausible it can be that Gully isn't doing it.

I agree with all of this, but to say with certainty that Gulutzan doesn't do this well enough because "he doesn't talk to players directly after a loss" is asinine. That was my only point.

By all accounts Gulutzan modifies his approach for each individual, and depending on their personality, and what they need at that given moment in time, he either criticizes, pats them on the back for the things they ARE getting right, or leaves them alone. He's stated before that his approach is one where he builds his relationship with each player and builds them up, so that when he needs to go back to them and "make a withdrawal" as he puts it (I assume that means asking them to work harder, do more, whatever) then he can do so with confidence that the player is likely to respond. This seems like a reasonable modern day approach, and when things aren't complete crap from top to bottom, it probably works quite well.

I stand by my thought that if a pro at this level can't get themselves up for a game, or if they can't respond to going down by a goal, then there's something wrong with their personal resiliency. It's not like they haven't been in that situation before.

Now there's is definitely something wrong with the entire team right now, which is why I think you saw Gulutzan's uncharacteristic outburst. They needed something different to shake them out of this. I don't think Gulutzan even WANTED to call his team out publicly like that, but he was running out of options and is trying his damnedest to turn it around. Let's hope it works.

[Par]

A new coach is needed, this much is certain but it cannot be any new coach that should be bought in, it should be a coach with experience and success because this is a young team and it needs a veteran coach to give them confidence(if Claude Julien becomes available than you jump at opportunity).

And if you do bring in Claude Julien, fire all the assistants(Gelinas included) and I mean all the coaches(the goaltending, special teams coach everyone) and give Claude Julien the chance/opportunity, to bring in his own assistants.

If we look at the Edmonton Oilers and the success they are having, they hired a good experienced coach in Todd McLellan. I don't think that the Flames are that behind the Oilers in terms of skill and grit(the edge they have is McDavid and they are getting good goaltending), plus Todd McLellan is getting the most out of his players and good coaches do this. Columbus Blue Jackets are also a young team and they hired a veteran coach and look at the success they are having.

Claude Julien is doing the same thing with Brad Marchand but the problem that Claude Julien has, is that his system is built on speed(plus other things) and the Bruins are slowing down(this won't be the problem with the Flames).

What Gulutzan is doing is that he is not playing to the teams strengths and he is implementing a system that is not made for this team.

As for this season just ride it out and get a top 5 pick(I know people are saying this is a weak draft but you can never predict how drafts are going to go). At the trade deadline trade Wideman, Elliott, Engelland and Bouma, get picks for these assets because that will go a long way at the draft.

Here the coaches their contracts and how much they are being paid:

https://www.capfriendly.com/coaches

[Monahan For Mayor]

^

Dave Tippett is the second highest paid coach in the NHL ? Haha! That's expensive, boring hockey.

[Par]

Originally Posted by Monahan For Mayor

^

Dave Tippett is the second highest paid coach in the NHL ? Haha! That's expensive, boring hockey.

I was surprised at that too, with the Coyotes losing so much money and sucking, how can they pay Tippett that much.

What did you think of my comments

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Par

A new coach is needed, this much is certain but it cannot be any new coach that should be bought in, it should be a coach with experience and success because this is a young team and it needs a veteran coach to give them confidence(if Claude Julien becomes available than you jump at opportunity).

And if you do bring in Claude Julien, fire all the assistants(Gelinas included) and I mean all the coaches(the goaltending, special teams coach everyone) and give Claude Julien the chance/opportunity, to bring in his own assistants.

If we look at the Edmonton Oilers and the success they are having, they hired a good experienced coach in Todd McLellan. I don't think that the Flames are that behind the Oilers in terms of skill and grit(the edge they have is McDavid and they are getting good goaltending), plus Todd McLellan is getting the most out of his players and good coaches do this. Columbus Blue Jackets are also a young team and they hired a veteran coach and look at the success they are having.

Claude Julien is doing the same thing with Brad Marchand but the problem that Claude Julien has, is that his system is built on speed(plus other things) and the Bruins are slowing down(this won't be the problem with the Flames).

What Gulutzan is doing is that he is not playing to the teams strengths and he is implementing a system that is not made for this team.

As for this season just ride it out and get a top 5 pick(I know people are saying this is a weak draft but you can never predict how drafts are going to go). At the trade deadline trade Wideman, Elliott, Engelland and Bouma, get picks for these assets because that will go a long way at the draft.

Here the coaches their contracts and how much they are being paid:

https://www.capfriendly.com/coaches

How much success did McLellan have in his first year with the Oilers?

[Par]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

How much success did McLellan have in his first year with the Oilers?

I honestly thought that this was his first year with the Oilers.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Par

I honestly thought that this was his first year with the Oilers.

I do agree that he seems to be a capable coach, with a track record of success. But his success this year is a testament to needing more than one year to have an impact.

I believe the Oilers respect him but I have little to base that on. I really have no clue what goes on in the Flames dressing room which makes it so hard to evaluate a coach.

My biggest fear is that the Flames "turn it on" once we are clearly out of the race. Just not sure what that would mean.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Monahan For Mayor

^

Dave Tippett is the second highest paid coach in the NHL ? Haha! That's expensive, boring hockey.

His role was expanded as recently as he has say on personnel which may be reflected into higher pay.

[Teroy]

Keep Gulutzan one more year. Anyway, why do we want to make the playoffs this year? The Flames are not capable of advancing more than one round. We need to build this team with top draft choices. We don't need to spend big dollars bring in so called better players from other teams. It's time to give the players in Stockton a chance to make the Flames. I'd part with Wideman, Bouma, Chiasson, Elliott, Smid and maybe Brower. I'd give Giordano a chance to be traded to a team capable of winning the cup soon if he'd agree. I'd only spend money next year bringing in a #1 goaltender unless one of those on the farm convinced me otherwise. It's time to be patient.

[Par]

Originally Posted by Teroy

Keep Gulutzan one more year. Anyway, why do we want to make the playoffs this year? The Flames are not capable of advancing more than one round. We need to build this team with top draft choices. We don't need to spend big dollars bring in so called better players from other teams. It's time to give the players in Stockton a chance to make the Flames. I'd part with Wideman, Bouma, Chiasson, Elliott, Smid and maybe Brower. I'd give Giordano a chance to be traded to a team capable of winning the cup soon if he'd agree. I'd only spend money next year bringing in a #1 goaltender unless one of those on the farm convinced me otherwise. It's time to be patient.

What's the point of trading away Giordano and getting a #1 goalie. If you do that, than you might as well trade Dougie Hamilton and Brodie and start the rebuild over again.