[News] Ben Street called up. Backlund out 4-6 weeks MCL. Babchuk activated

[sa226]

Actually, I think you just don't know what a re tread is.

Niemez is a prospect, Byron is an acquired prospect, as is Horak.

Best example of a re tread is Kolanos. He was once a top prospect for another organization that didn't pan out. Last year he got a second chance at an NHL contract while being much older and still didn't pan out. That is a retread.

If you want to call them crappy prospects, fine. But at least understand what retread means in this context.

[Alberta_Beef]

Originally Posted by Dienasty

Haha the fact that you haven't realized that Byron was put on WAIVERS, and no one claimed him should give you a hint that he isn't considered NHL quality. 5 foot nine forwards who don't score aren't considered useful. He is about a half a point a game player in 2 seasons with abbotsford, and has played 4 years total in the AHL.

As for Nemisz, he is a lost cause, he can't skate, is injury prone, and in three AHL seasons has yet to show any development and as such is burried on the fourth line if they even let him play. Nemisz is looking like the guy who put up points in junior because his linemate was good (Hall). He has 3 assists, -4 in 28 games this year, yeah I doubt the Flames re-sign that kid.

Keep spouting nonsense Alberta Beef.

What exactly is your point. I never made any claims those players were good, just that they weren't re-treads, which I gather you have no idea what a re-tread actually is.

I haven't spouted anything, just pointing out that you have no idea what a re-tread is.

[browna]

Originally Posted by Bingo

To me if you want to find a silver lining, the Backlund injury likely gives the Flames a chance to get him signed to a three year deal at very reasonable money because the injury derailed what was shaping up to be a 15 goal 30 point 48 game season (25 goal, 50 point pace for 82)

He was on a one year deal looking to prove himself, and I'm guessing he and his agent won't look for the moon to get a longer term deal

opportunity

IMO, 1/6 of the season hasn't proved enough to sign a guy for 3 more years, a guy that was dangerously close a couple times last year from going down to the minors.

Especially when that 1/6 of a season is 8 games.

He's done well, better then many had thought, and started out on the right path back, but IMO, he has to come back and keep up that pace for at least another 20 games or more, probably the rest of the season.

Signing him at this point after 8 games of a trial, is far too presumptuous that committing to him for another 246 games, everything is going to be a-ok and that this 8 game pace is indicative of the next 3 seasons.

The Flames still hold all the cards in negotiations, even if he does come back and have a great rest of the season. The Flames can easily argue that Backlund's got one proven (injuries or otherwise) season out of three and it was a contract year.

[Dienasty]

Originally Posted by sa226

Actually, I think you just don't know what a re tread is.

Niemez is a prospect, Byron is an acquired prospect, as is Horak.

Best example of a re tread is Kolanos. He was once a top prospect for another organization that didn't pan out. Last year he got a second chance at an NHL contract while being much older and still didn't pan out. That is a retread.

If you want to call them crappy prospects, fine. But at least understand what retread means in this context.

well it seems that we have different definitions of re-treads.

Mine would be guys who have been called up more then once usually around 3 times, and in all three attempts did little to nothing that would lead to hope that this player would be able to preform in the NHL.

Byron was called up what 2-3 times last year and did very little, thus calling him up this year, I would define him as a re-tread.

Nemisz was called up once in each of the last 2 seasons it I am correct and has done absolutely nothing. Thus re-tread.

Different definitions.

[Dienasty]

Originally Posted by Alberta_Beef

What exactly is your point. I never made any claims those players were good, just that they weren't re-treads, which I gather you have no idea what a re-tread actually is.

I haven't spouted anything, just pointing out that you have no idea what a re-tread is.

Really?

My whole point is that fans are getting excited about Street being called up. I am pointing out that it is sad that the Flames fans are getting excited about a 26 year old minor leaguer in his second organization and should probably keep expectations in check. Basically stating that it would be nice to have the shelves stocked in the AHL for times when we need call ups.

You are the one who argued that Street was good and I stated my argument that in all liklihood he isn't that good, than you wanted to put up a fuss that I stated Byron and Nemisz are orgnaizational fodder. Due to the facts that I presented you then turned it into a grammar competition.

Congrats!

Oh yeah, our converstation started with you and I disagreeing on Backlunds usage.

[BEANZ]

This thread has managed to add a user to my ignore thread, can you imagine who it might be?

[Bertuzzied]

Originally Posted by BEANZ

This thread has managed to add a user to my ignore thread, can you imagine who it might be?

Someone quote my post!! I'm not so easily ignored!

[JiriHrdina]

Originally Posted by Dienasty

Really?

My whole point is that fans are getting excited about Street being called up. I am pointing out that it is sad that the Flames fans are getting excited about a 26 year old minor leaguer in his second organization and should probably keep expectations in check. Basically stating that it would be nice to have the shelves stocked in the AHL for times when we need call ups.

You are the one who argued that Street was good and I stated my argument that in all liklihood he isn't that good, than you wanted to put up a fuss that I stated Byron and Nemisz are orgnaizational fodder. Due to the facts that I presented you then turned it into a grammar competition.

Congrats!

Oh yeah, our converstation started with you and I disagreeing on Backlunds usage.

Nothing wrong with fans getting excited, that's what fans do. What is more irksome is when guys like you think they have to come in and squash excitement. Most fans here get that street is a long shot but it is still cool to seem him get a shot. Nothing wrong with that.

[calgARI]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

I actually agree a little that it sounds like a few people are overhyping him, but I want to see what he can do before judging.

Here are some NHL players that have followed a similar path:



Kevin Westgarth - full university career, and 3 years in the minors before getting an NHL shot (26 years old).

Rich Peverey - full university career, 3 years in the minors, before getting an NHL shot (25 years old - played 13 games that year).

Martin St. Louis - full university career, played mostly in the minors until he was 25 (played 13 NHL games before that age nd then 56 as a 25 year old, so basically a "career minor leaguer until that point).

Mark Letestu - Played a full career of junior B, one year of university, 4 years in the minors and 10 NHL games before the age of 26 (like Street, another one from the deep Pens prospect pool).

Drew Miller - Maybe more of a stretch. Full univesitry career, mostly in the minors until he was 26,but played 53 NHL games before then.

Jarred Smithson - Played in the WHL, then in the minors. Played 30 NHL games before the age of 26.

PA Parenteau - Played in junior, then the minors - 5 NHL games before the age of 27.

Joey Crabb - Full university career, then minors. First crack at the NHL as a 25 year old - played 29 games.

Throw one of the most underrated players in the NHL in there, Matt Moulson. He played Junior B, four years of college, wasn't signed by the team that picked him in the 9th round and didn't become an NHL regular until 26. He has three straight years at 30 goals running which I'm guessing only a handful of other guys have.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by Dienasty

well it seems that we have different definitions of re-treads.

Mine would be guys who have been called up more then once usually around 3 times, and in all three attempts did little to nothing that would lead to hope that this player would be able to preform in the NHL.

Byron was called up what 2-3 times last year and did very little, thus calling him up this year, I would define him as a re-tread.

Nemisz was called up once in each of the last 2 seasons it I am correct and has done absolutely nothing. Thus re-tread.

Different definitions.

I'd say he played very well. Sucks he's struggling this year, but he was great last year.

[Ped]

Originally Posted by Bingo

To me if you want to find a silver lining, the Backlund injury likely gives the Flames a chance to get him signed to a three year deal at very reasonable money because the injury derailed what was shaping up to be a 15 goal 30 point 48 game season (25 goal, 50 point pace for 82)

He was on a one year deal looking to prove himself, and I'm guessing he and his agent won't look for the moon to get a longer term deal

opportunity

Sorry if I am missing something, but Backlund's current pace had him finishing with 24 points this year or 41 in a full season, no?

[devo22]

Originally Posted by calgARI

Throw one of the most underrated players in the NHL in there, Matt Moulson. He played Junior B, four years of college, wasn't signed by the team that picked him in the 9th round and didn't become an NHL regular until 26. He has three straight years at 30 goals running which I'm guessing only a handful of other guys have.

yup, pretty elite club. Nine guys have done it:

Stamkos - 51/45/60 - 156
Ovechkin - 50/32/38 - 120
Marleau - 44/37/30 - 111
Kovalchuk - 41/31/37 - 109
Iginla - 32/43/32 - 107
Ryan - 35/34/31 - 100
Kessel - 30/32/37 - 99
Moulson - 30/31/36 - 97
Nash - 33/32/30 - 95

[indes]

Man we missed backlund last night, he's been pushing the pace lately and we had none of that down the middle last night

[Goodlad]

I thought Street looked OK out there. Not great, but not too bad. Definitely fighting some jitters, but won more board battles than he lost, put a few shots on net, and didn't seem lost in the d-zone. I don't know if he's a great fit with the Czechs though. Street seemed to be playing more of a North-South game while Hudler and Cervenka are all about the finesse. Wonder of we'll see Stajan back on that line and Street with Stempniak/Comeau. Could be a good fit.

[Stay Golden]

Originally Posted by indes

Man we missed backlund last night, he's been pushing the pace lately and we had none of that down the middle last night

The drop off from Backlund to Street was significant.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by Stay Golden

The drop off from Backlund to Street was significant.

Yup. With the flames having the weakest center group in the league they could not afford to lose Backlund. Who ever takes his place has to somehow play as well as Backlund or the flames get even worse at the center position.

Other than losing Kipper long term, losing Backlund is probably the 2nd worst thing that could have happend to the flames this year. That includes Iggy, Cammi, and Bouw.

[SuperMatt18]

Flames should call up Horak to play center.

I understand that he's excelling playing the wing in Abbotsford but he played 61 games last year as a center in the NHL and looked serviceable.

I think he would be much better fit in the top 6 with Hudler and Cervenka compared to Street. Has great offensive instincts and proved last year he can be defensively responsible as a center.

[Wolven]

Originally Posted by Dienasty

well it seems that we have different definitions of re-treads.

Mine would be guys who have been called up more then once usually around 3 times, and in all three attempts did little to nothing that would lead to hope that this player would be able to preform in the NHL.

Byron was called up what 2-3 times last year and did very little, thus calling him up this year, I would define him as a re-tread.

Nemisz was called up once in each of the last 2 seasons it I am correct and has done absolutely nothing. Thus re-tread.

Different definitions.

But your definition is wrong.

The players you are talking about are not established NHLers by any stretch of the imagination. When you re-tread a tire you take a used tire and try to make it new. Byron and Nemisz are the definition of "new" as both of them are new to the NHL and have only ever been temporary call ups to the big show.

99% of the time when we talk about "re-treads" on this forum we are not simply talking about veteran NHLers that are trying to find their previous form on a new team. The term usually refers to players that were with the Flames and are coming back for another tour with the team (Jokinen, Tanguay, etc.)

On the topic of Street, I liked his speed and acceleration last night. It really stood out when he would suddenly zoom past other players. I hope he gets some more opportunities to show he can use his speed at this level.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by browna

IMO, 1/6 of the season hasn't proved enough to sign a guy for 3 more years, a guy that was dangerously close a couple times last year from going down to the minors.

Especially when that 1/6 of a season is 8 games.

He's done well, better then many had thought, and started out on the right path back, but IMO, he has to come back and keep up that pace for at least another 20 games or more, probably the rest of the season.

Signing him at this point after 8 games of a trial, is far too presumptuous that committing to him for another 246 games, everything is going to be a-ok and that this 8 game pace is indicative of the next 3 seasons.

The Flames still hold all the cards in negotiations, even if he does come back and have a great rest of the season. The Flames can easily argue that Backlund's got one proven (injuries or otherwise) season out of three and it was a contract year.

It's not just the 8 games, Backlund has a pedigree better than anyone else except Seven.

[gargamel]

I though Street looked decent individually, but his line was invisible. If Hudler and Cervenka are going to stay together, Street needs to be on the 3rd line and Stajan should center the Czechs. If not, until Cammalleri is back, maybe let Hudler play on the top line and put Glencross with Street and Cervenka. Either way, I don't want to see Street with both Czechs again.