I wish calgaryborn would enter back into this thread and back up his ridiculous statement.
LOL, you must have missed his disappearing act in countless threads,he's a one hit wonder,typical bible thumper who runs and hides as soon as his so-called faith is put to the test.
Sad that people live that way..but lets not forget he loves guns. Great combo in the making!
If you ever taught about eternal damnation, an immortal soul, or the concept of a triune God from your pulpit, then there's really no point in attempting to discuss the Bible with you.
There's 30,000 Christian denominations, all have what they believe is Biblical support for their beliefs. You, like each of them, think they have the right of it and everyone else are "outright or ignorantly hypocrites".
You believe what you believe, if you want to argue about a triune God or eternal damnation then you can do so with Scoreface or Calgaryborn, both of whom would disagree with you.
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What exactly caused the shift to atheism?
Who said I was an atheist?
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Loss of loved one? The birth of a mentally or physically handicapped child? Abuse? Hypocrisy you saw within the Church? And "education" as an answer is a non-starter.
So if you've decided what answers are acceptable and are not acceptable, then why ask the question?
Education was part of it, the basic answer is what I've said before; a desire to understand why I believed what I believed, to get back to the foundations of my beliefs. In doing so, in reading the Bible more carefully and learning the history of it, I had to change my beliefs. And during the process I learned a lot of other things to influence my conclusions.
I think a change of beliefs due to a significant event is often an emotional response, not a rational one, and beliefs are irrational enough already.
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The are many scientists who believe in ID.
And there's many Christians who reject it. So?
And there aren't very many (a tiny percentage in relevant fields), and they may be scientists and they may believe in ID, but they don't actually do any science in ID (for some reason).
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And I'm not being hostile, just blunt. Whereas these comments are belittling and insulting without contributing any evidence or argument:
You're holding me responsible for what others say?
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So let's shift gears and just for fun, what if the Big Bang formed a God-like creature that created everything else?
What if it created a race of powerful aliens that created everything else?
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How would you feel about that?
Why should how I feel enter into evaluating the validity of a claim?
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Would we be considered Gods to any self-aware robots or life that we as humans created? What exactly would you define as "God" even?
Sure you can play around with definitions, but what's the point of this?
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And more on topic about Hawking, what if one day he came out and said he actually did believe in a God? Would that discredit all his earlier work or writings?
His science writings? Of course not, since the science is based on its scientific merit, not on Hawking's belief.
That's the difference between a real scientist and many ID proponents and creationists, ID proponents start with a conclusion and work backwards to find evidence to support their conclusion. Real science observes phenomenon and draws whatever conclusions fall out.
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So let's shift gears and just for fun, what if the Big Bang formed a God-like creature that created everything else? How would you feel about that? Would we be considered Gods to any self-aware robots or life that we as humans created? What exactly would you define as "God" even?
And more on topic about Hawking, what if one day he came out and said he actually did believe in a God? Would that discredit all his earlier work or writings?
Neat! I love fun. To address you first question, so I'm just going to assume, for the sake of argument that what you are suggesting (ie big bang created god) is true. If that were in fact the case, I would feel as if this god, as we humans understand it, would have done a really terrible job of showing us he or she, or it exists. Furthermore, in terms of creating and dictating life on planet earth, this god would have been incredibly inept, lazy, indifferent, and caprious.
When I reference 'God' in these discussion I refer to the man made idea of the Juedo-chirstian god or Yahweh the god of the Old Testament.
Hawking personalizes his view by putting it in the context of his own life. To him the prospect of death is an old friend. He faces his own mortality with acceptance. But at the same time he affirms his love for life – life is possibility and he wishes to make the most out of his own brief existence, which he also hopes is not that brief.
While referring to such beliefs as a “fairy story” may come off as dismissive, it is clear that Hawking is stating his own personal opinion. He says, “I regard.” He is not claiming to have a logical argument that disproves God or an afterlife. He is not offering proof of the materialist paradigm. He is simply choosing to take a scientific view of reality.
The defenders of science mostly (of course there are exceptions) are interested in clarifying the extent and limits of science – carefully delineating its arena. Defenders of theology are the ones who are frequently blurring the lines and making a philosophical mess of things.
related(ish) to the discussion, didn't think it needed (another) religious thread!
A highschool student in Lousiana stepped up for his rights of having no prayer at graduation in a public school. Has now had teachers making rude remarks, death threats, etc if he shows up for Graduation. His parents have kicked him out of his house... Pretty crazy how intense they are down south. http://www.reddit.com/r/atheism/comm...for_prayer_at/
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Stuck in Edmonton until my degree is done, which sucks. Cheering for the flames in Edmonton, oh so much fun!
related(ish) to the discussion, didn't think it needed (another) religious thread!
A highschool student in Lousiana stepped up for his rights of having no prayer at graduation in a public school. Has now had teachers making rude remarks, death threats, etc if he shows up for Graduation. His parents have kicked him out of his house... Pretty crazy how intense they are down south. http://www.reddit.com/r/atheism/comm...for_prayer_at/
Christian spirit is alive and well down there I see. All of the controlling, guilt inducing rules, none of the kindness, quite the combination.
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As you can see, I'm completely ridiculous.
related(ish) to the discussion, didn't think it needed (another) religious thread!
A highschool student in Lousiana stepped up for his rights of having no prayer at graduation in a public school. Has now had teachers making rude remarks, death threats, etc if he shows up for Graduation. His parents have kicked him out of his house... Pretty crazy how intense they are down south. http://www.reddit.com/r/atheism/comm...for_prayer_at/
"I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ"
Pretty disgusting that a family can treat its flesh and blood this way. I recall talking to a religious friend of mine and posed the questions, which would be worse: "That you have a son and at the age of 18 he becomes addicted to hard drugs and will struggle with this addiction throughout his life. Or that your son at the age of 18 loses his faith, and becomes an atheist." It took him awhile to deliberate but he chose for his hypothetical son to be a drug addict over a non-believer. Can anyone hear themselves think? These are the people who claim to be loving? Who claim to have family values? Anyone who considers their relationship with a fictional character in the sky, more important than their relationship with their children is deranged.
For centuries, those that claim to be Christian have obfuscated, twisted, and distorted the Bible for personal gain. People are sick of religion. It's the cause for much of the problems worldwide.
But I maintain it's because of those who claim to be Christians and not because of what the Bible says.
You can't blame the car for the accident when a drunk driver was behind the wheel.
Are you talking about the part of the bible that says to stone women, kill your children, or the part that says homosexuals are an abomination? Just curious.
Really? Someone else saying a prayer is "emotionally stressing" on you?
How? How is it that someone praying to their god causes you any distress at all?
I too live in the bible belt and I am far from "religious" as it gets. You cant go out for something to eat without a surrounding table doing a small prayer before chowing down...and not once, ever, could I possibly describe it as a feeling of stress on my part because they were doing what they believe. I am unaffected by it, so why would I care?
There is a huge difference between eating at outback steakhouse and listening to a family pray before dinner and a public high school doing prayer at a school ceremony.
One is legal, one isn't.
The kid is probably just fed up and is taking a stand. I doubt he's emotionally upset by it, but you never know, kids find all kinds of crazy reasons to be emotionally upset, its all those hormones.
Really? Someone else saying a prayer is "emotionally stressing" on you?
How? How is it that someone praying to their god causes you any distress at all?
I too live in the bible belt and I am far from "religious" as it gets. You cant go out for something to eat without a surrounding table doing a small prayer before chowing down...and not once, ever, could I possibly describe it as a feeling of stress on my part because they were doing what they believe. I am unaffected by it, so why would I care?
Just ridiculous.
Gotta disagree. Having been in large assemblies where people are praying to something I don't believe in, it can definitely be unsettling and mildly 'distressing'. When you are expected to bow your head, close your eyes, clasp your hands in obeisance to an entity you don't believe in, it is distrssing. When it becomes a social norm to follow the rituals of a belief system you don't ascrbe to, that is distressing. When you propose a compromise such as a moment of silence in which people can choose to pray, or simply choose to reflect and you are shot down, that is distressing. Just because you are not distressed by it doesn't mean that someone else cannot be reasoably distressed in these situations.
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onetwo and threefour... Together no more. The end of an era. Let's rebuild...
