Flames trade player with a 1st round pick to Montreal
Montreal trades same player and gets a 1st round pick
We can justify it all we want but that's f'n ugly. If it was the Oilers who did that the defenders wouldn't doing the lolOilers schtick so fast
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I long for a trade rumour that could (temporarily) save this thread.
Kadri, may or may not be traded this season. And if he is traded, he has 13 teams on a list that the Flames cannot trade him to.... Or trade him to. Either/Or.
Also, Rasmus Andersson is likely to be traded this season as the Flames and Andersson are quite far apart on an extension.
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Flames trade player with a 1st round pick to Montreal
Montreal trades same player and gets a 1st round pick
We can justify it all we want but that's f'n ugly. If it was the Oilers who did that the defenders wouldn't doing the lolOilers schtick so fast
If they get a good return for Kadri it all kind of equals out.
I also tend not to look at the second 1st Montreal got that much either.
In that last year of his contract that the Flames traded to Montreal Monahan got 17 points in 25 games and was shut down for the season. That likely would have been the end of his Flames career either way.
He decided to re-sign in Montreal for 1 year and $2M and it's that contract that allowed him to be traded to Winnipeg for a 1st.
Smart asset management for Montreal for sure - but very unlikely the Flames ever would have been able to take advantage of that 1 year contract like Montreal was.
Last edited by SuperMatt18; 11-07-2025 at 03:59 PM.
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They literally traded Monahan like the day before signing Kadri.
It's not revisionist at all either, from the second that trade and signing happened it was positioned as Monahan+1st for Kadri.
Now I do think there were possibly other avenues they could have taken to open that space but that's the one the Flames decided on and don't think it's wrong to group it together.
If Kadri doesn't say "yes I'll sign" the Flames aren't moving Monahan with that 1st attached.
The flames made a choice from a few options to clear the money for Kadri, saying it was a trade implies the flames had to give up a 1st to get him which simply isn't true. There were plenty of players on the roster who other teams would have moved assets to get and could have created space. I love Backlund, he's one of my favourite flames but they absolutely could have moved him for a positive return to a team desperate for a 2c for example, he's 31 and on 5.35 mil at that point playing great defensive hockey, in the selke conversation, and putting up about 0.6PPG and the flames chose to use him as the 3rd line center instead of Mony.
They acquired Kadri for free other than the money and chose the Monahan deal as the means of freeing up the cap space. At the time I understand why they made the gamble, I'm not saying it was immediately an idiotic move, they had holes to fill and wanted to stay competitive and were worried Monahan couldn't be counted on to be the 3C.
In retrospect I disagree strongly with anyone who says that trade was a decent move though, history has shown it to be a poor choice that panned out very poorly. Monahan turned out to still be a productive if injury prone player when on ice and brought back another 1st at the deadline.
Wasn't a disaster for calgary as the pick turned out to be mid level.
Monahan is not a fiasco at all. It gets framed that way and I don't understand it at all.
It is actually quite easy to understand. The Flames traded away a player who was beloved by the franchise and one of the faces of the team post Iginla and sent a 1st rounder that had some questionable protection on it in order to do so. The move was made to sign a player to help push this team forward to the cup but you see the team has missed the playoffs in each year since the deal despite the cap space being used on a highly effective and impactful player. The team ended up giving the 16th overall pick as part of that deal which was the better of the 2 picks that could have been in the trade. Not only that Monahan bounced back to be a heck of a player hence why some may refer to it as a fiasco.
Oh don't get me wrong I still hate the trade itself because I also agree there would have been other ways to clear that cap space potentially (Lucic, others) and thought Monahan still had more to give.
But in the end from a pure asset perspective it will likely work out to:
1 Year of Monahan
1st
for
4 years of Kadri (hopefully no more to maximize the trade return)
Whatever return they get for Kadri
And that will likely net out to a net neutral outcome in terms of what actually did happen, even if I still don't like the way we got there.
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But again explain to me how it's comically bad.
If you trade a 1st to sign a guy who ends up being your best skater for multiple seasons, and you then trade that player for some additional assets - how is that bad let alone comically bad?
They could have kept Monahan and still missed the playoffs for 4, 5 or 6 years. I doubt Kadri signed up for this, and I hope this wasn’t the plan. The team made a play for the present and has achieved mediocrity, which is worse than failure when failure is rewarded with draft capital. At the time, myself like many posters felt the Flames had to see the writing before them and move towards a future. They saw something different and if they miss the playoffs again, it is a tragedy for Kadri, but a comedy to a league who witnessed a team pay a significant price to clear space for an asset that has done nothing more than harm their ability to potentially acquire elite talent.
If the Oilers did this we’d needs Depends for days.
I doubt Montreal acquired a player they thought they could later flip for another 1st rounder. They probably thought they were getting a player that would be injured a lot of the time like he was in Calgary. It was fortuitous circumstance that he beat the odds and stayed healthy and they were able to trade him for that kind of return.
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Last edited by FlamesAddiction; 11-07-2025 at 04:24 PM.
I don't think it was revisionist history at all - Flames couldn't sign Kadri until they made room, and Monahan was the room that was made.
The organization was rumoured to have tried to move Lucic, but he refused to waive his NTC apparently. Yes, they could have moved other pieces, but that doesn't have anything to do with the moves that were made.
Out: Monahan, a first and cap space
In: Kadri and his 7 million cap hit
I don't see what is revisionist about connecting these two players.
There's no problem with connecting them, the flames clearly made that choice to create the space from their options - but it wasn't a trade at all to sign Kadri, Kadri wasn't a part of the Monahan trade and the flames didn't have a gun to their heads, two separate transactions. The flames had Kadri willing to sign and they chose to make the Monahan trade from their options as the best possible route, and it turned out to be a costly one when you look at Monahan's career since. No one was taking Lucic his deal was buyout proof and his salary was way way too high for his production at that point.
I'm not trying to be pedantic but the flames easily could have moved other players coveted by other teams for assets, the team at that time was strong and there were depth forwards making 2-5 mil that played on the 3rd and 4th line that other teams would have wanted, they chose to push a player out the door no one wanted at a massive premium.
Last edited by Matty81; 11-07-2025 at 04:04 PM.
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I strongly believe they had a deal for Lucic in place and he blocked it.
That's interesting. Wonder what that would have looked like and if it could have been done for less than a 1st as assuming that would have been another deal where the flames gave up a good asset, at the time there were Boston rumors I think? Would have been nice to keep Monahan, such a great person and player for the organization, another guy like Backs who I admire as much for what they've done in the community as what they have done on the ice.
If they had moved a guy to create space where it would have returned an asset, like for a younger player on an entry level, it would have had to be Mangi, Backlund or Dube and other parts I am thinking. Anyway hindsight is always 20-20 right. I'm so glad that didn't turn out worse, I was really worried last year the MTL deal was going to cost us an even higher pick.
That's interesting. Wonder what that would have looked like and if it could have been done for less than a 1st as assuming that would have been another deal where the flames gave up a good asset, at the time there were Boston rumors I think? Would have been nice to keep Monahan, such a great person and player for the organization, another guy like Backs who I admire as much for what they've done in the community as what they have done on the ice.
If they had moved a guy to create space where it would have returned an asset, like for a younger player on an entry level, it would have had to be Mangi, Backlund or Dube and other parts I am thinking. Anyway hindsight is always 20-20 right. I'm so glad that didn't turn out worse, I was really worried last year the MTL deal was going to cost us an even higher pick.
I have heard there was a deal on the table for Lucic with Anaheim and with Montreal for Monahan.
But I had heard that it was a combination of both Lucic and Sutter that kind of blocked the Anaheim trade. As Sutter thought Lucic would be more valuable than Monahan for them that season.
But that was a rumour so who knows how true that was.
Well to be clear, you decided to inject yourself into a conversation by quoting me and adding your usual PepsiFree arrogance. Try being less pompous, until then I can't imagine not saying anything about it if it's directed towards me.
I personally believe Steinberg does have his finger on the pulse of this situation. Maybe you don't listen to him, that's fine. He's not breaking news, that's not what he does. And really it's not about trying to guess what the Flames will do, but some people wanting to discuss what they would like to see them do. IMO that's a more interesting topic. If you're not "fussed" about that, great.
Didn’t realize it was a private conversation and asking you a question was arrogant and pompous. You’ll have to forgive me, but I also find that and your previous comments funny coming from someone who takes shots at me replying to other people, or “interjects” into conversations I’m having just to insult me. That’s not the kind of person I’m rushing to take advice from (lots of great posters here who don’t get into the muck, or do, have fun with it, and are self aware enough not to give advice they don’t follow) so conserve that limited energy friend.
If Steinberg isn’t breaking anything and it’s not what he does, I think we can safely take “what he’s hearing” with a grain of salt. And I think it’s pretty obvious the conversation is around both what people want them to do and what people expect/guess/predict they’ll do. Even though I’m not much interested in doing the latter, I still find it pretty interesting what reasons (yours included) people give to back up those guesses and whether they really hold true or not.
Like it or not, what Conroy has done and how that shapes what he will or won’t do has been a pretty big conversation for months around here. Maybe you missed it or don’t find less interesting, that’s fine. But I’m good to continue questioning the narratives around Conroy’s tenure so far and how that might impact Kadri’s future. If that’s not too pompous and arrogant for you, I guess.
But again explain to me how it's comically bad.
If you trade a 1st to sign a guy who ends up being your best skater for multiple seasons, and you then trade that player for some additional assets - how is that bad let alone comically bad?
Apologies for emphasizing only part of your post in my previous response. If the Flames were to convert Kadri into future assets, that would resolve the comedy part of the equation, and might actually turn the deal into a valued documentary.
Helps to actually ingest the thoughts of a poster before responding…..
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Revisionist history that they "traded" their 1st and Monahan for Kadri.
They got Kadri for nothing except cash.
Cash that they would not have had… unless they traded Monahan.
Quote:
There would have been many options as far as moving money out to accommodate him, including buyouts earlier that summer.
If they had bought out Monahan, he would still have had a $2 million cap hit, and for a longer period. They'd have had to buy out someone else at the same time. And they had no way of knowing, during the buyout window, that Kadri was still going to be available. IIRC, it was considered a done deal that he would sign out east until the moment that he didn't.
Quote:
Likely someone else would have actually given us an asset for Backlund, or Dube and another player to clear some space. They chose the Monahan deal.
They didn't want to trade Backlund away, for obvious reasons – starting with the fact that they were looking to add a centre, not subtract one.
They did try to trade Lucic, but he wouldn't go. I'm sure they tried other moves that didn't work out. It takes two to make a trade, and Montreal was the only team willing to take on that big a cap hit for an injured player.
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Monahan is not a fiasco at all. It gets framed that way and I don't understand it at all.
You traded Monahan and a 1st for the ability to sign Kadri.
Kadri has been their best forward for the last number of years and you will recoup some of that asset value if you trade Kadri.
I know some fans will then argue that Montreal then traded Monahan for a 1st. But that came only after he re-signed their as a UFA.
It's not anywhere near the list of fiasco deals the Flames have made. If Kadri had turned out to be bad - sure. But he's been pretty great and still has value.
The fiasco was spending money like a drunk sailor and then not having enough to sign Kadri, a guy GMBT wanted for years, when he was available as a FA and interested in signing here.
Having to pay MTL a 1st to take Monahan in order to clear space was a result of those earlier mistakes.
It was a fiasco years in the making.
Brad made some stupid decisions trying to make the Flames better, his mistakes offset the good he did (Flames took BPA the high pick years, so minimum credit for that). Maybe he is a little in the green, not much.
That's interesting. Wonder what that would have looked like and if it could have been done for less than a 1st as assuming that would have been another deal where the flames gave up a good asset, at the time there were Boston rumors I think? Would have been nice to keep Monahan, such a great person and player for the organization, another guy like Backs who I admire as much for what they've done in the community as what they have done on the ice.
If they had moved a guy to create space where it would have returned an asset, like for a younger player on an entry level, it would have had to be Mangi, Backlund or Dube and other parts I am thinking. Anyway hindsight is always 20-20 right. I'm so glad that didn't turn out worse, I was really worried last year the MTL deal was going to cost us an even higher pick.
