Sven "Fricken" Bartschi!

[devo22]

Originally Posted by 3 Justin 3

No way the Flames are crappy enough next season to get McKinnon. One can only hope though.

well, I'd be happy with Shinkaruk too

[Poe969]

If we traded Kipper, Iggy, JayBow and some others for some younger players we could for sure be in the running for a top 5 pick next year.

[kirant]

Originally Posted by 3 Justin 3

No way the Flames are crappy enough next season to get McKinnon. One can only hope though.

If they move Kiprusoff and Irving doesn't try to play saviour, they probably will.

[IliketoPuck]

Is MacKinnon really the next Crosby? Or is he more like the next Bobby Ryan.

Don't get me wrong, I would love to have a player like Ryan on our team, but does drafting first overall and sucking for an entire season really seem worth it?

[Da_Chief]

Originally Posted by IliketoPuck

Is MacKinnon really the next Crosby? Or is he more like the next Bobby Ryan.

Don't get me wrong, I would love to have a player like Ryan on our team, but does drafting first overall and sucking for an entire season really seem worth it?

We've been sucking for last few years without the top picks, so why not suck and get a top pick while we're at it?

[IliketoPuck]

It is really tough to suck that badly. How Columbus and Edmonton have managed to do it consistently is pretty impressive.

If you wanted to be the 30th place team you would have to get rid of: Giordano, Bouwmeester, Iginla, Jokinen, Glencross, Cammalleri, Kipprusoff......and replace them with prospects / picks.

[Stay Golden]

wrong thread

[MissTeeks]

Sven was named WHL Player of the Week:

http://flames.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=620610

[kermitology]

Originally Posted by kirant

If they move Kiprusoff and Irving doesn't try to play saviour, they probably will.

My thought exactly. We'd be lower than the Oilers if not for Kiprusoff.

I like the idea of getting a grade A prospect, but at the same time, I doubt I'd attend as many games as I have this season. I already barely watch any of the games on TV, though that's due to different circumstances.

[3 Justin 3]

Originally Posted by IliketoPuck

Is MacKinnon really the next Crosby? Or is he more like the next Bobby Ryan.

Don't get me wrong, I would love to have a player like Ryan on our team, but does drafting first overall and sucking for an entire season really seem worth it?

No he is not the next Crosby, no one is. Most of the comparisons to Crosby are because they are both from Cole Harbour (MacKinnon says this anyway). They are taking the exact same path (except different CHL teams), but the similarities really end there (in my opinion anyway).

Look at the stats, Crosby had 130 then 160 points in the QMJHL, MacKinnon has half of that in his first year. I believe MacKinnon also plays wing, Crosby was a center.

Having never seen him play I can't really say he isn't the next Crosby, but Crosby is a one of a kind player, and there is no one that is close to his level (other than maybe Malkin when he wants to play).

It's funny, Crosby is the best player in the game right now and yet he didn't even come close to dominating the CHL like Mario Lemieux did (look up his stats if you want to have your mind blown).

[Da_Chief]

Originally Posted by IliketoPuck

It is really tough to suck that badly. How Columbus and Edmonton have managed to do it consistently is pretty impressive.

If you wanted to be the 30th place team you would have to get rid of: Giordano, Bouwmeester, Iginla, Jokinen, Glencross, Cammalleri, Kipprusoff......and replace them with prospects / picks.

All you have to move is Kipper and this team is one of the worst as shown this year.
Giordano still recovering and can't play 60 minutes.
Bou = suckage
Iginla, plays when he wants to so that would amount to about 10 wins
Jokinen is all hustle, love him but teams with him as one of the top players have always sucked
Glencross, all losing teams have these kinds of players
Cammi, tries but is a complimentary player

Kipper to Caps makes so much sense this off-season, they need him badly.
Iginla to Blues makes so much sense.
Keep Olli, Cammi...Trade Glencross for a 1st (I think he can fetch that at the draft)
Bouw to just anyone, and make it Gio's team.

[Lt.Spears]

Originally Posted by IliketoPuck

It is really tough to suck that badly. How Columbus and Edmonton have managed to do it consistently is pretty impressive.

If you wanted to be the 30th place team you would have to get rid of: Giordano, Bouwmeester, Iginla, Jokinen, Glencross, Cammalleri, Kipprusoff......and replace them with prospects / picks.

To suck as badly as Edmonton we would only have to get rid of Kipper. The team would be easily bottom 3 without him.

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by Lt.Spears

To suck as badly as Edmonton we would only have to get rid of Kipper. The team would be easily bottom 3 without him.

I keep seeing this sentiment, and frankly I think it's a load of crap.

This team was in the same boat last year, and Kipper was average at best for the most part.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

I keep seeing this sentiment, and frankly I think it's a load of crap.

This team was in the same boat last year, and Kipper was average at best for the most part.

This team was 7th in scoring last year, we're 26th this year, so we're not really in the same boat.

[Sylvanfan]

Originally Posted by IliketoPuck

It is really tough to suck that badly. How Columbus and Edmonton have managed to do it consistently is pretty impressive.

If you wanted to be the 30th place team you would have to get rid of: Giordano, Bouwmeester, Iginla, Jokinen, Glencross, Cammalleri, Kipprusoff......and replace them with prospects / picks.

I think if you got rid of Kiprusoff...that would be enough to make the Flames the worst team in the NHL, unless Columbus got rid of Nash for nothing this summer. Even than...you can tank for a player...and still lose the draft lottery. So really not worth trying to suck on purpose just to get one player.

[sworkhard]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

I think if you got rid of Kiprusoff...that would be enough to make the Flames the worst team in the NHL, unless Columbus got rid of Nash for nothing this summer. Even than...you can tank for a player...and still lose the draft lottery. So really not worth trying to suck on purpose just to get one player.

If Karlsson is Kipper's replacement, you could very well be right. However, it's unlikely that the Flames would replace kipper with a replacement level goalie, and as such, we would still be unlikely to draft top 5.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

I keep seeing this sentiment, and frankly I think it's a load of crap.

This team was in the same boat last year, and Kipper was average at best for the most part.

our backups are 11-20-11 in the last three and 3/4 years. There is no question really.

08/09 1-6-1 (7th in the NHL)
09/10 5-4-0
10/11 4-5-6
11/12 1-6-4

Can't argue with that

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

our backups are 11-20-11 in the last three and 3/4 years. There is no question really.

08/09 1-6-1 (7th in the NHL)
09/10 5-4-0
10/11 4-5-6
11/12 1-6-4

Can't argue with that

Yes you can, and the argument is fairly simply formulated as follows: In the event that the Flames do trade Kiprusoff, chances are extremely high that they would not leave the goaltending duties in the hands of a current backup calibre NHL goalie. All told this is sort of a ridiculous argument that fails to factor into consideration the sorts of subsequent changes that are likely to happen to the entire team in the absence of Kiprusoff. Simply put: Nobody has any idea what sort of effect his permanent absence would have on the team because there are too many intangible variables involved. All one needs to do is examine the recent history for top-goaltender trades and replacements to see as much: more often than not, the effects are not nearly so catastrophic as we imagine them to be.

[HighLifeMan]

Originally Posted by nik-

This team was 7th in scoring last year, we're 26th this year, so we're not really in the same boat.

No, its because the coach changed the system once again.

It's no surprise Kipper's numbers went to hell under Mike Keenan...ALL goalies need somewhat of a structured system to have success in the current NHL. Last year we severely lacked defensive structure, and as a result were much more offense oriented. This year we did a complete 180, so it is no wonder we rely upon our goaltender as much as we do.

I honestly think we are much better suited to try and score a ton of goals seeing as Kipper will still give us a chance to win on a game to game basis even if his statistics as a whole are not appealing.

So no, I dont think we would be a bottom five team in the NHL without Miikka. (contingent on what he would return in a trade obviously)

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Yes you can, and the argument is fairly simply formulated as follows: In the event that the Flames do trade Kiprusoff, chances are extremely high that they would not leave the goaltending duties in the hands of a current backup calibre NHL goalie. All told this is sort of a ridiculous argument that fails to factor into consideration the sorts of subsequent changes that are likely to happen to the entire team in the absence of Kiprusoff. Simply put: Nobody has any idea what sort of effect his permanent absence would have on the team because there are too many intangible variables involved. All one needs to do is examine the recent history for top-goaltender trades and replacements to see as much: more often than not, the effects are not nearly so catastrophic as we imagine them to be.

In searching I cannot find an example of a trade where the backup had a much worse record than the starter. Remember that Toskala was a starter for a few years and our record ws catastrophic. Your logic is reaching if you assume we could get something close to Kipper. Anyway you look at it our record would be worse. Seven less wins is realistic and that would put us with somethingspecial up north