Training Camp Day 2 Notes

[Ashes]

With Kadri not suiting up for many pre-season games as Daryll eluded to yesterday, I hope we get a chance to see Ruzicka or Zary get a few reps at C with the big team over the next few weeks. Especially Ruzicka, who I think showed flashes last season that he's right on the cusp of being a full-time NHL'er (I think 3C would be ideal for him but he's not replacing Backlund anytime soon).

Might as well see what we have to work at C from the young guys incase of injuries during the season. But I'm sure right now the focus is on determining which of the PTO's are a good fit with the club. Still three weeks to go until the season starts, lots of time and opportunity for the young guys to force their way onto the team or cement themselves as the first or second call-up.

[joejoe3]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

Instead of expressing my counterargument, I'll defer to Arnold:

IYKYK

[gvitaly]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Sorry to take this off the rails a bit, but these sorts of uninformed revisions of history are annoying. Poirier absolutely looked like a stud that first year, and the only reason he fell short was because of how deeply, tragically his personal life interfered with his hockey career. Since there is no reason to think that Pelletier is similarly plagued by his own demons, then I don't see how this is at all a relevant comparison.


Sent from my SM-G986W using Tapatalk

I am aware of his history with alcohol abuse. I'm not trying to revise anything. However, you can't know for certain that it's the only reason that his production fell off a cliff. I agree that it did play a role, but my point is that you never know with prospects... it can be injury, or personal life that gets in the way.

[Monahammer]

I don't get the eakin dislike here. He's a former 20 goal scorer in limited minutes. Still young. Played on a bitterly terrible buffalo team. I think he's a great guy to have in the mix for the bottom 6 if he's coming at PTO level contract.

[Moneyhands23]

I'm listing to 650 and it's interesting how different these camps are.

Canucks are in whistler and have 500 plus fans at the rink. The radio guys figure it'll be a thousand or more ppl on the weekend.

I guess the fans are getting real good access and it's a really cool experience.

[sureLoss]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1573369561541660672

[Kipper_3434]

I want to see
Huby- Lindy- Mangiapane
Dube-kadri- toffoli
Coleman-Backs- Ruzicka

[Wastedyouth]

Originally Posted by Moneyhands23

I'm listing to 650 and it's interesting how different these camps are.

Canucks are in whistler and have 500 plus fans at the rink. The radio guys figure it'll be a thousand or more ppl on the weekend.

I guess the fans are getting real good access and it's a really cool experience.

Their team is also trash, so, different expectations I guess.

[Calgary4LIfe]

Originally Posted by gvitaly

I don't think think he has. Phillips deserves more of a spot than Pelletier, and so does Ruzicka. They were both more productive in the AHL. However it just shows you the level difference between the two leagues. Gawdin had a similar production to Pelletier but couldn't stick with the team.

I agree he is a top prospect in the AHL, but Emile Poirier seemed like a top prospect in the AHL after his first season. I just don't see the rational of simply giving Pelletier a spot on the team. If Jooris could have a great camp and make the team, then so can Pelletier if he's ready. So unless Pelletier does something to force his way onto this team he can stay in the AHL, and I don't think that will hinder his development.

I agree 100% with what you wrote, but Emile Poirier I argue would probably have ended up as a solid NHL'er if not for his demons off the ice, so not an ideal comparison. Still, you are right in that a lot of prospects seemingly look great in the AHL for a season or two, but can't string together solid seasons, or fail to make the jump and transition into the NHL effectively.

Just to add my 2 cents to the thread:

Waivers.
Which players have the inside track on earning a spot this year? Waiver eligible players do. That means Ruzicka, Valimaki, Mackey, Pospisil, Meloche, Phillips. There are other waiver-eligible prospects/young players, but these are probably the highlights. They will get the longest look in camp, and if they are going to be reassigned to the Wranglers, then it will be on that last day that teams are busy trying to push their own players through. Sure, a good handful of them will pass through waivers at any point in the season really, but not all will. I doubt Ruzicka will pass at any time this year, so in my opinion, he is basically a lock for this team. If Valimaki has a good camp, I don't think that Calgary will want to risk that, and Mackey had a great season in Stockton last year. After that, I think everyone passes, including Meloche.

Competition
Looking at the competition for spots - realistic competition - as far as it comes for prospects, I see the following:

Defence:
Valimaki is probably the favourite to fill-in for the temporary void left by Kylington. Stone is probably next, with Mackey and Meloche following-up.

4th line: Pospisil is going to get a good look, but he has Schwindt (probably the favourite) and Jones (runner-up) most likely ahead of him. However, Pospisil does offer that sandpaper type of game that Sutter likes. It is a tough road as Rooney, Ritchie (guaranteed to be the 13th or 14th forward playing only 20 or so games) and Eakins are all competing for this one spot too. You can add in Ruzicka to this list (and 1st on the list IMO) if Milano makes the team.

Top 9: Spot open right now, with Milano being given the most consideration. I expect Ruzicka gets this spot, but he has to earn it of course. After him, then my next bet is Zary, then Pelletier, then Schwindt (I think he will be competing for more than one spot), ditto for Jones, and probably rounded-out by Phillips. I think Phillips has to have a dynamite camp to be in this mix.

I don't expect anything to change in goal.

I will be surprised if Eakins makes the cut and gets offered a deal. Great faceoff guy, but unless he can offer something more than Rooney, I don't think he will earn a deal. Sutter likes Ritchie, and Ritichie is a prototypical 4th liner who brings a tonne of tenacity and sandpaper, and is really strong on the forecheck. He helps make for a fairly effective and extremely difficult to play against 'energy line'. Now, if depth scoring is an issue, you rotate him out. I actually only think Ritchie will be good for ~20 games or so. You don't want a young player sitting that often anyway. Lucic - Rooney - Lewis is the expected 4th line to start the year, so having Ritchie as a scratch makes sense, and with Valimaki, Mackey and Meloche all needing waivers too, I can't see the Flames having 14 forwards, especially with the farm team in Calgary this year.

My bet:
Milano is signed, Ruzicka goes to the 4th line and gets rotated with Lewis (or Rooney) until an injury occurs, and Valimaki makes the team (temporarily at least until Kylington returns).


A prospect has to really out-perform a vet for an organization to willingly lose another asset through waivers or lack of room for a free asset from PTO. Being able to recall an equal replacement level player is an advantage. Depth is important. Treliving will have to play the asset game here. I don't think Pelletier makes it this year when getting this all on paper, unless he really out-shines everyone else. Any prospect at this point is going to have to seriously out-shine a vet in the lineup, not just equal them.

[Mass_nerder]

Originally Posted by Johnny Makarov

thats nice and all but who were the unfittest Flames?

Name and shame!!

[EVERLAST]

Originally Posted by hah

Where did you "hear" this? Kylington is not even at camp.


Probably spent too much time partying a D J ing in Greece when he should have been training. ( From the limited Twitter Pictures that were out of him in the off season).

Treliving, Leslie and Parker all mentioned it very glowingly in fact.

Hearing it 3 times made me moist

[AndyM]

Originally Posted by Moneyhands23

I'm listing to 650 and it's interesting how different these camps are.

Canucks are in whistler and have 500 plus fans at the rink. The radio guys figure it'll be a thousand or more ppl on the weekend.

I guess the fans are getting real good access and it's a really cool experience.

This is all business for the Flames. No need for distractions.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by hah

Where did you "hear" this? Kylington is not even at camp.


Probably spent too much time partying a D J ing in Greece when he should have been training. ( From the limited Twitter Pictures that were out of him in the off season).

#### like this is annoying.

Guy posted a picture back on July 3rd of him vacationing in Greece, literally the only post he has on instagram from the offseason, and somehow that translates into partying too much instead of training.

Not to mention dude was still shredded in those pictures he posted.

[Moneyhands23]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

#### like this is annoying.

Guy posted a picture back on July 3rd of him vacationing in Greece, and that translates into partying too much instead of training.

Not to mention dude was still shredded in those pictures he posted.

But the players are our property and they have no right to have days off and enjoy even one day in summer!!!!

And to go to Greece and have a beer and some baklava is a boarder line criminal act

[schteve_d]

Originally Posted by Hack&Lube

Unfortunately it sounds like practices are going to be closed to the public for the entire year. Not sure what the reason for this is. Maybe for security or staffing issues? Maybe dirty Oilers spies were watching our practices.

To stop Woodcroft from lurking in the shadows trying to put together how to run an NHL practice.

[Flaming Horse]

Originally Posted by gvitaly

In my opinion the main reason behind it is that a rookie can be better than veterans in spurts. However, as soon as the grind of the season sets in rookies often taper off, start making more mistakes, and lose their confidence. This applies to vets too, but they have the experience to limit the mistakes and the mental fatigue side of things. Again, that's just the way I see it.

The flames team is not into developing players on the big club. That is what the wranglers are for. If you are playing for the big club you will have to be able to contribute right away. You need to be able to jump right into the lineup and be able to produce right away. Everyone keeps talking about Pelletier but at this point I think he is a long shot at best to make the opening night roster. A guy like Ruzicka has a lot better chance and depending if Milano gets a contract or not Ruzicka could side into the third line LW.

[Flaming Horse]

Originally Posted by AndyM

This is all business for the Flames. No need for distractions.

We should have the same access. People can put whatever spin they want and some may act like it is no big deal but it is. What about a dad who wants to take his son or daughter and the kids who want to see the players.This is just wrong and needs to change. It is a gate driven league especially Canadian teams and they treat there fans like this. They need to make it a lot more fan friendly,especially when they want our money for a new arena. The more money the players make the bigger the divide between the fans.

[Reggie Dunlop]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Do you really think so? How much appetite is there from the fanbase to attend practices? How much impact does this really have on the team's bottom-line?

I seriously doubt that this will have any effect at all. Most people are not that bothered about not seeing practices.

One less connection to the fan experience. It's like giving out a free sample of the product.

As others have mentioned, public money is going into the new arena.

[UnitedFlames]

Maybe it's to help the new Flames. Keeps extra pressure away from them as they try to get used to new teammates, coaches, media, etc.

[Shazam]

Maybe not enough staff to man the entrance or perhaps not well people hanging out outside?