[Signing] Flames RFA and UFA Tracking - Page 4 - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

Bingo · 08-03-2015, 09:52 AM

He played well here, so he'd be an easy guy to bring back. The fact they haven't tells me they really want to leave a space open for a competitive battle in camp. There's danger if gifting spots to kids, but also a danger in adding contracts that you my have trouble moving.

Seems to me they think Wotherspoon, Culkin, Morrison and Nakladal is a strong enough field to supply that 7 that could push up and become a 6.

Enoch Root · 08-03-2015, 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bingo

He played well here, so he'd be an easy guy to bring back. The fact they haven't tells me they really want to leave a space open for a competitive battle in camp. There's danger if gifting spots to kids, but also a danger in adding contracts that you my have trouble moving.

Seems to me they think Wotherspoon, Culkin, Morrison and Nakladal is a strong enough field to supply that 7 that could push up and become a 6.

I agree with your points, but I think the only possible #7 in that group is Nakladal.

For the younger guys, it would have to be #6 or Stockton, IMO (pushing Engelland to 7).

And there is still the Smid wildcard.

And of course all these conversations assume no injuries, which almost never happens.

sureLoss · 08-03-2015, 10:04 AM

Would be surprising if Nakladal claimed a NHL roster spot out of camp.

He has never played on NHL sized ice and probably needs at least a while in the AHL adjusting.

IMO, the delay in potential Schlemko signing is Smid's health.

Vinny01 · 08-03-2015, 10:05 AM

Lets not forget that Amid may make a return this year and could fill that 7 spot

FlamesAddiction · 08-03-2015, 10:10 AM

Schlemko is in a tough situation. He is probably good enough to be on an NHL roster, but most teams also have cheap young players that are good enough or need to play in the NHL in order to develop further.

He will probably catch on somewhere after training camps wind down and teams can see what they have.

oldschoolcalgary · 08-03-2015, 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Schlemko was put on waivers twice last year (so I am working on the assumption that he could clear).

If I was Treliving, I would offer Schlemko a position as the veteran leader in Stockton, with the understanding that, come injuries, the Flames would call him up.

Make it clear that guys like Nakladal, Wotherspoon and Morrison also need NHL time to be seen and tested. And that Stockton needs a leader, but that the NHL door would not be closed in the slightest.

I like schlemko, and hope we resign him, but there was definitely a number of posters that really overvalued him...

Strange Brew · 08-03-2015, 10:06 PM

Obviously the flames know far more about Smid's situation than any of us. Even so, seems unlikely they are counting on a full return to form. I am guessing Flames would love to see Schlemko in camp but I think someone out there offers him a contract.

Fire · 08-03-2015, 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Obviously the flames know far more about Smid's situation than any of us. Even so, seems unlikely they are counting on a full return to form. I am guessing Flames would love to see Schlemko in camp but I think someone out there offers him a contract.

I've heard he's been offered a 2 year $6 million deal, but he's holding out for a 3 year deal.

Cheerio · 08-03-2015, 11:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FBI

Who was saying schlemko should be signed for 3 mill aav again? Wonder if they want to take the under now.

That was me, and I still believe that he is a perfect #5 dman who can fill in as a #4 as necessary. The going rate for that type of player is $3MM a year. Obviously this year the GMs didn't give out the contracts they did on every other July 1 due to the Canadian dollar and the potential for expansion next season. Mark Fayne is a good comparable and he got 3.625 over 4 years. He put up 8 points and their fans still think it's a great contract due to his ability to generate shots for his team and suppress shots for the opponent. Schlemko has very similar underlying numbers to Fayne.

heep223 · 08-03-2015, 11:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cheerio

That was me, and I still believe that he is a perfect #5 dman who can fill in as a #4 as necessary. The going rate for that type of player is $3MM a year. Obviously this year the GMs didn't give out the contracts they did on every other July 1 due to the Canadian dollar and the potential for expansion next season. Mark Fayne is a good comparable and he got 3.625 over 4 years. He put up 8 points and their fans still think it's a great contract due to his ability to generate shots for his team and suppress shots for the opponent. Schlemko has very similar underlying numbers to Fayne.

I like Schlemko. His going rate is probably around a million dollars. And he'd be #7/8 on the depth chart next year. Fayne is way better than Schlemko.

Cheerio · 08-03-2015, 11:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by heep223

I like Schlemko. His going rate is probably around a million dollars. And he'd be #7/8 on the depth chart next year. Fayne is way better than Schlemko.

Why is Fayne so much better than Schlemko? And I think he would be sixth on the depth chart, ahead of Engelland. IMO the only reason that Engelland got so much more ice than Schlemko after Gio went down was that Engelland spent all season in Hartley's system. It seems to me that Hartley has a lot more faith in guys that have spent all year learning his system whether from him or from Huska, rather than guys who were dropped in mid season like Schlemko or Shore.

heep223 · 08-04-2015, 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cheerio

Why is Fayne so much better than Schlemko? And I think he would be sixth on the depth chart, ahead of Engelland. IMO the only reason that Engelland got so much more ice than Schlemko after Gio went down was that Engelland spent all season in Hartley's system. It seems to me that Hartley has a lot more faith in guys that have spent all year learning his system whether from him or from Huska, rather than guys who were dropped in mid season like Schlemko or Shore.

Bigger. Tougher. With similar or better skill set. I think there's some truth to what you're saying in regards to players who have been in the system vs not, but there's a reason that Schlemko has been through waivers a few times man. You are way overrating him and he doesn't really provide much that we don't already have in spades. Engelland is ahead of him on the depth chart because he provides something that we need. Which makes Schlem cat a good depth guy, #7 or #8. He could fill in higher on a team with crappy D.

Cheerio · 08-04-2015, 12:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by heep223

Bigger. Tougher. With similar or better skill set. I think there's some truth to what you're saying in regards to players who have been in the system vs not, but there's a reason that Schlemko has been through waivers a few times man. You are way overrating him and he doesn't really provide much that we don't already have in spades. Engelland is ahead of him on the depth chart because he provides something that we need. Which makes Schlem cat a good depth guy, #7 or #8. He could fill in higher on a team with crappy D.

Is being bigger and tougher the difference between getting 14 million over 4 years and being lucky to receive a camp invite? I don't think it is personally. And the reason he was waived in Arizona was because they were going full on tank, so they might as well get the guys that have in their long term plans such as Gormley ice time to see what they can (and can't) do. With Dallas, they had a bunch of young defencemen that they wanted to see in action before they became waiver eligible and were not really in the playoff race (6 points out with 17 game sleft chasing 4 teams).

Does Engelland provide something we need? Do we really need a face puncher who makes everyone on the ice on his team worse rather than someone who makes them better? If you look at Brodie's underlying numbers with Schlemko versus them with Engelland it is amazing how much more effective he was when paired with Schlemko than he was with Engelland. Engelland is a tougher, worse defensively, cheaper Ladislav Smid.

Street Pharmacist · 08-04-2015, 12:29 AM

Schlemko was underappreciated here. Solid defensively, can contribute on offense. He's not fast, but far faster than Engelland.

I honestly believe the flames would've been better with Schlemko beside Brodie over Engelland. The guy really held Brodie back IMO

Cheerio · 08-04-2015, 12:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

Schlemko was underappreciated here. Solid defensively, can contribute on offense. He's not fast, but far faster than Engelland.

I honestly believe the flames would've been better with Schlemko beside Brodie over Engelland. The guy really held Brodie back IMO

That is very true.
Schlemko+Brodie 58.5% CF (small sample size)
Brodie+Engelland=36.4% CF (Much larger sample size)
Brodie+anyone else= 45.3% CF

The Schlemko sample size is too small to make much note of, but given the amount of time Engelland and Brodie played together, that 36.4% number is absolutely horrendous.

Street Pharmacist · 08-04-2015, 01:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cheerio

That is very true.
Schlemko+Brodie 58.5% CF (small sample size)
Brodie+Engelland=36.4% CF (Much larger sample size)
Brodie+anyone else= 45.3% CF

The Schlemko sample size is too small to make much note of, but given the amount of time Engelland and Brodie played together, that 36.4% number is absolutely horrendous.

I'm far from being an "advanced stats guy" but I find a lot of value in Corsi for defensive pairings. Individual Corsi and team Corsi have more independant variables, but a defensive pairing (with sample size) can be more descriptive IMO.

Having said that, it was plain as day to see. Brodie had to worry more about both ends of the ice more

Stay Golden · 08-05-2015, 01:37 AM

Nothing against Schlemko i would like to see him resigned for less than 1.7 per. He was a great fill and stepped up to the challenge, but unfortunately in the world of the NHL and roster spots he becomes a expendable piece.

TheDebaser · 08-05-2015, 05:33 AM

I'd take Schlemko over Smid any day of the week.

King Theo · 08-05-2015, 06:23 AM

For the love of God and everything that is holy, please do NOT sign Schlemko. He is a 5/6, we have 5 guys that are ahead of him, plus we have Engelland who is a 6/7, leave a spot for a 6/7 for one of the kids.

Poe969 · 08-05-2015, 07:20 AM

The only way I see Shlemko getting signed by the Flames is if there is a trade and an opening and no younger guys take that spot. Shlemko is good but he's not offensive enough to replace Gio, Brodie, Hamilton, Wideman or even Russell and he isn't physical or tough enough to replace Engelland. If Russell wasn't signed and wanted a bigger contract, I could see them keeping Shlemko but that isn't happening.

If no prospect takes a spot (which I doubt) then MAYBE they'll sign Shlemko.