As Violence worsens, drugs become cheaper and more available

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Flames_Gimp

As long as Harper is in power we will never see legalization. He wants to keep putting more money in the pockets of real criminals!

Not sure if it is a federal issue, or how much influence the federal government has. If BC as a province decides to legalize pot, I'd be really curious as to how the Supreme Court would rule.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Calgaryborn

The reason why B.C. has become the North American's supplier of marijuana is the weak penalties on growing/ dealing. Reagan's war on drugs pushed growers into B.C. along with the organized crime that goes with it.

Drug testing should be manditory for all employment. That would make work places safer while drying up the 95% of the money in the drug trade. It would then be managable for law enforcement to deal with the rest.

There is no plausible or 'sane' reason to throw people who smoke pot into jail if we as a society allow them to drink alcohol which is WAY more dangerous both mentally, and as well health wise.

There is a BIG connection between the increased level of poverty in the US and the inability of young people caught in that situation to overcome it, and the war on drugs, and how it deals with those same people. The fathers of these young people are being sent off to prison which basically repeats the same violence/drug cycle all over again.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by blankall

Even if what you are saying is true, that won't result in a decrease in violence. If you legalized marijuana, that's not really going to affect gun violence, which is over the harder and more profitable drugs.

Personally, I don't think legalizing marijuana will make that large of a difference. The cops really don't divert that many resources to marijuana growing in BC. You can pretty much buy it freely already. The full legalization of marijuana sales would be more of a cultural shift/recognition issue than anything. It'd be really just a symbolic move.

The 'system' still uses a lot of resources to house the people who are often handed ridiculous sentences for being caught with pot. Especially in the US with their tough on crime bill.

Seems like the Conservatives passed a similar bill here in Canada so I'd imagine the law will suddenly deal a lot more harshly with people caught with pot. Selling or using.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Flames_Gimp

B.C. medical health officers join call to legalize pot

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/britis...marijuana.html

I like it a lot.

Good on BC for bringing this issue to the forefront. I was hoping we would have this discussion in my lifetime.

[Rathji]

Originally Posted by HOOT

...

Marijuana doesn't cause brain damage. Maybe step back from your blind hate for the drug and information you learned in the 70's and see what information is out in 2011 about marijuana and it's effects on the brain and body.

...

I am not saying that we shouldn't legalize pot, because I am all for it joining tobacco behind the counter at 7-11, but saying there are no harmful effects of marijuana, even if it doesn't kill brain cells, is really just lying to yourself.

I wish I could find an image of a poster that they have in one of the sites I work at, that lists many negative effects from pot, that most people would agree on.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by Rathji

I am not saying that we shouldn't legalize pot, because I am all for it joining tobacco behind the counter at 7-11, but saying there are no harmful effects of marijuana, even if it doesn't kill brain cells, is really just lying to yourself.

I wish I could find an image of a poster that they have in one of the sites I work at, that lists many negative effects from pot, that most people would agree on.

If you abuse it, of course it has negative consequences. But so does Wendy's. Smoke on Friday night, your health impact is going to be negligible.


This isn't directed at you specifically, but why do people assume grow ops would lose money with legalization? Wouldn't it be easier to just buy it from them legally with a regulatory system that ensures they aren't lacing it with cocaine or something else not nice? We've got to get our legal weed from somewhere... Earn off the people who do it already and know how to make a good product?

[Calgaryborn]

Originally Posted by HOOT

Well if you only witnessed it once, than that sounds scientific enough for me. I'm sure it has nothing to do with it being easier to hide drinking, which is why you never see it.

Hoot! Hoot! Hoot! Try to focus here. You asked me about personal experiences and I answered the question. Also, the alcoholics I worked with did manage to refrain from drinking while at work. Booze isn't easy to hide if your working out of a truck.

Originally Posted by HOOT

Marijuana isn't addictive and people don't turn into addicts because they smoke pot. 1 in 100 marijuana users use cocaine, 1 in 104 use crack. What an epidemic!

People don't get physically addicted to marijuana but, there is a psychological addiction which can make it hard to quit.

Originally Posted by HOOT

Marijuana doesn't cause brain damage. Maybe step back from your blind hate for the drug and information you learned in the 70's and see what information is out in 2011 about marijuana and it's effects on the brain and body.

Marijuana does harm developing brains. It also will change ones personality.

Originally Posted by HOOT

Yes smelly Marijuana is harder to conceal than booze in a bottle. Try again. Smoke a joint and walk past one and tell me how conceal it is compared to sneaking in a sip of vodka.

Smoke it outside and then have a cigarette right after. If your still paranoid about the smell use a little febreze. Your arguement about pot being harder to conceal is false. One guy can bring enough marijuana to keep 5 or 10 guys wasted for a whole shift. He can hide it in his pocket. A drunk might hide a mickey in his jacket pocket or lunch kit but, it would need to be his personal supply which means he would probably have to hide it. Beer the most common drink of choice is pretty much impossible to hide in reasonable quanities.

Originally Posted by HOOT

You also have zero trust in the youth of our nation if you honestly believe legalizing marijuana will somehow turn them into alcoholic drug addicts because it's legal. What a stupid stance to take, when studies have shown otherwise.

No what I'm saying is increased access to marijuana which legalization would no doubt cause will make it much easier for youths to make a bad decision. Studies which amount to surveys can be made to tell you anything you want to hear but, that doesn't mean they are accurate. It is like anything else; easier access will result in more experimentation.

How many smokers first cigarette came from their parent's pack or drink came from their parents cabinet?

Originally Posted by HOOT

Do you think drugs go out of your system as soon as you wake up the next day? If someone smoked pot on Friday, got tested on Monday, they wouldn't be "clean" so they would be fired. I'm not saying these people smoke on the job.

Yes but, if your not addicted then reason should tell you it isn't wise to smoke on Friday because it will cost you your job. If your psychological addiction is such that you can't refrain then perhaps you might be a risk of smoking up on the job. You should get help.

Originally Posted by HOOT

Some of the smartest and most successful people on the planet smoke/smoked pot. It has no harm to society, unlike the drugs they ignore that cause addicts and problems in our society. The only reason marijuana is a problem is because the government makes it one, inflates the cost of it and puts money into organized crime.

There is no link between smoking pot and intelligence or success. Smokers who succeed do so despite their crutch.

Originally Posted by HOOT

Spend as much money as you want tracking it down (the USA has tried spending $53,000,000,000 since the war on drugs was introduced), put people in jail for longer and you are only playing into growers and dealers hands and giving them more and more money. Ask the police chief in Kelowna how his fight is going, it is estimated that they could bust a grow house every day for a year and not even put a dent into the problem, do you think stricter penalties would solve that problem? I don't!

I've already outlined why the war on drugs has failed and where the money would be better focused. Certainly in B.C. the penalties for growing and trafficing are far too small. The money is too attractive and the consequences of getting caught are too small.

Originally Posted by HOOT

But take away their profits by offering it like alcohol and cigarettes and you see that number drop drastically. Of course you will still see some underground things like cigarettes but the profits won't be there. I know someone who sells illegal cigarettes and makes pennies compared to the tens of thousands a grower makes.

I don't like the government making profits on the doping up of its citizens. I see a conflict there. Sure the government makes huge profits on booze and tobacco but, they both are a negative in our society.

Originally Posted by HOOT

I get it, you support organized crime, you encourage higher penalties increasing the profits for them. As I have said in the past I don't care either way, it is readily available for me legal or illegal, I have tons of friends who make their living from it who otherwise would have to pay taxes for money made if it was legal, or maybe get a real job. They have no problem making $30k every 2 months for watering some plants.

I would like to see your friends go to jail for a very long time for their contribution to the stupifying of our nation.

Originally Posted by HOOT

The War on Drugs has never worked, will never work and it is nothing more than the government wasting our tax money chasing something they can't control. It's a plant, god put it on the planet for a reason, no?

Spoken like a true stoner: It's too hard-it can't be done!

If government changed its focus it could be wiped out in a generation.

[CaramonLS]

Does anyone have any demographics figures on the achievements of marijuana users?

I bet regular users (at least once a day) are on average less educated, paid less, and overall crappier than your average Canadian citizen.

[SeeBass]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

Does anyone have any demographics figures on the achievements of marijuana users?

I bet regular users (at least once a day) are on average less educated, paid less, and overall crappier than your average Canadian citizen.

In other words nowhere near as successful as the average CP poster then.

But I bet that result would be the same as alcohol, fast food eaters, high volume tv watchers, and people of certain races.

[Rathji]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

If you abuse it, of course it has negative consequences. But so does Wendy's. Smoke on Friday night, your health impact is going to be negligible.


This isn't directed at you specifically, but why do people assume grow ops would lose money with legalization? Wouldn't it be easier to just buy it from them legally with a regulatory system that ensures they aren't lacing it with cocaine or something else not nice? We've got to get our legal weed from somewhere... Earn off the people who do it already and know how to make a good product?

Sure the impact is negligible, but it is still negative, even in small doses. Claiming there are no negative side effects though, is just ridiculous.

I don't care if grow ops lose money or go out of business. If people are going to be buying pot, I would rather it come from a controlled source and contribute tax dollars. The fact that it might put some of the smaller operations out of business really is a side benefit that I really don't care about.

[Frank MetaMusil]

Originally Posted by Calgaryborn

People don't get physically addicted to marijuana but, there is a psychological addiction which can make it hard to quit.

Yes they do, I can't sleep without it.

[Calgaryborn]

Originally Posted by Frank MetaMusil

Yes they do, I can't sleep without it.

Frank nobody is debating the medical benefits marijuana can have in some instances. I don't think anybody is against medical distribution of marijuana. What your talking about is a physical need for marijuana for pain relief rather than an addiction.

[Frank MetaMusil]

Originally Posted by Calgaryborn

Frank nobody is debating the medical benefits marijuana can have in some instances. I don't think anybody is against medical distribution of marijuana. What your talking about is a physical need for marijuana for pain relief rather than an addiction.

I don't have pain though, I just toss and turn all night. Ask Sainters7 and check out his posts in the insomnia thread. I'm pretty sure it's just addiction for smoking it over 10 years.

[Calgaryborn]

Originally Posted by Frank MetaMusil

I don't have pain though, I just toss and turn all night. Ask Sainters7 and check out his posts in the insomnia thread. I'm pretty sure it's just addiction for smoking it over 10 years.

Then you are talking about a psychological addiction.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by Calgaryborn

Then you are talking about a psychological addiction.

Can you remind me where you went to med school?

[Calgaryborn]

Originally Posted by valo403

Can you remind me where you went to med school?

I read. There is no pyhsical addiction associate with marijuana use but, there has been reported psychological dependancies. The guy says he needs marijuana to sleep; What conclusion do you reach?

[Frank MetaMusil]

Originally Posted by Calgaryborn

Then you are talking about a psychological addiction.

Physical addiction or psychological addiction – Is there a real difference?
There's no such thing as a purely psychological addiction

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/...-real-differen

All in all, the only way to look at Addiction is as both a psychological addiction AND a physical addiction that are inextricably liked through our psyche's presence in the brain, a physical part of the body

[CaramonLS]

Originally Posted by SeeBass

In other words nowhere near as successful as the average CP poster then.

But I bet that result would be the same as alcohol, fast food eaters, high volume tv watchers, and people of certain races.

Yep, so why add another vice which encourages people to act like dregs of society.

Except for your last point of course, if you are being serious, it shows that you are missing the bigger picture by a huge amount. There are many barriers that people of different races face and your ignorance on systemic and immigration issues is really coming through.

[8sPOT]

I bet once legalized, there will be a lot of shock and awe at the number of people who come out of hiding their 'dangerous addiction'. I would be willing to be that there are a LARGE number of professional, succesful, and otherwise 'normal' people that smoke pot.

[Calgaryborn]

Originally Posted by 8sPOT

I bet once legalized, there will be a lot of shock and awe at the number of people who come out of hiding their 'dangerous addiction'. I would be willing to be that there are a LARGE number of professional, succesful, and otherwise 'normal' people that smoke pot.

You mean to provide balance from what we see from regular open users.