Many who voted in favour of Brexit have said they did so hoping to curb or halt immigration from the EU, which has seen about three million EU citizens move to the U.K. – two-thirds of them since 2004, when the EU added 10 new member countries, most of them in Eastern Europe. The influx has been blamed for keeping salaries down, as Eastern European workers expect lower pay than British workers do, while driving up housing prices and putting additional strain on the public health-care system and other social services.
Is this incorrect though? Don't get me wrong, I am from an immigrant family and have put up with bigotry even in Canada because of it, but mass immigration does have a negative impact when politicians fail to keep it sustainable at a rate where institutions can keep up. Directing their anger to the immigrants themselves is obviously wrong, but natural citizens should be upset at the politicians who let them down.
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Blaming this on immigrants accomplishes nothing and neither does throwing around racist, xenophobia or bigot. Opening your borders is just as stupid as closing your borders. When you take the right response vs the left response the best answer is somewhere in between - it's a failure of humanity period. Politicians are only listening to people on their side.... Sick of everyone!!!!! Especially the blog media
The whole Brexit fiasco is likely only going to embolden the racism and xenophobia, turn it mainstream. The segment is going to take the Brexit as "oh hey look, we're the majority now! The majority thinks this way and will back them up."
“And they are saying this to individuals and families who have been here for three, four, five generations. The atmosphere on the street is not good.”
Warsi originally backed the leave campaign, but switched to support remain, calling the Leave campaign “divisive and xenophobic”.
In Gloucester, Max Fras said he was in a Tesco supermarket on Friday night with his young son when a white man became agitated in the queue for the checkout and began yelling: “This is England now, foreigners have 48 hours to #### right off. Who is foreign here? Anyone foreign?”
"Table next to me says to Polish waitress "How come you're so cheerful? You're going home." Him and the missus started laughing." Disgusting
Anti-immigrant leaflets saying "Leave the EU - no more Polish vermin" were put on cars near a school, local police said, the day after the country voted to leave the European Union.
"We voted you out. Go home you f*****g immigrants."
"Rapefugees Not Welcome", as they shouted "f*****g p**dos" and "Allah, Allah, who the f*** is Allah?". Police later made two arrests. father has a broken arm, and possible neck trauma, son has severe facial fractures, broken jaw and nose. my god
with graphic pics of Polish Father and son after being swarmed
Karen moved to Britain from Germany in the 1970s but since Thursday's vote, she's become terrified as she faced a series of xenophobic attacks.
From having dog excrement thrown at her door to friends telling her they don't want to see her again, Karen gave a harrowing account of how she now feels unwelcome in the country where she made her home.
"I haven't been out of the house for three days," she sobbed. "My neighbours told me they don't want me living in this road.
"My friend's grandson got beaten up because he had a foreign grandmother.
"I'm so scared, I don't know what's going to happen next."
Asked about the atmosphere since the EU referendum he said: "I think there was an undertone there before this Brexit and the voting within the referendum, but I think the result maybe has pushed people to somehow justify now that they think it's ok now to act out in this way, which obviously it's not."
The whole Brexit fiasco is likely only going to embolden the racism and xenophobia, turn it mainstream. The segment is going to take the Brexit as "oh hey look, we're the majority now! The majority thinks this way and will back them up."
“And they are saying this to individuals and families who have been here for three, four, five generations. The atmosphere on the street is not good.”
Warsi originally backed the leave campaign, but switched to support remain, calling the Leave campaign “divisive and xenophobic”.
In Gloucester, Max Fras said he was in a Tesco supermarket on Friday night with his young son when a white man became agitated in the queue for the checkout and began yelling: “This is England now, foreigners have 48 hours to #### right off. Who is foreign here? Anyone foreign?”
"Table next to me says to Polish waitress "How come you're so cheerful? You're going home." Him and the missus started laughing." Disgusting
Anti-immigrant leaflets saying "Leave the EU - no more Polish vermin" were put on cars near a school, local police said, the day after the country voted to leave the European Union.
"We voted you out. Go home you f*****g immigrants."
"Rapefugees Not Welcome", as they shouted "f*****g p**dos" and "Allah, Allah, who the f*** is Allah?". Police later made two arrests. father has a broken arm, and possible neck trauma, son has severe facial fractures, broken jaw and nose. my god
with graphic pics of Polish Father and son after being swarmed
Karen moved to Britain from Germany in the 1970s but since Thursday's vote, she's become terrified as she faced a series of xenophobic attacks.
From having dog excrement thrown at her door to friends telling her they don't want to see her again, Karen gave a harrowing account of how she now feels unwelcome in the country where she made her home.
"I haven't been out of the house for three days," she sobbed. "My neighbours told me they don't want me living in this road.
"My friend's grandson got beaten up because he had a foreign grandmother.
"I'm so scared, I don't know what's going to happen next."
Asked about the atmosphere since the EU referendum he said: "I think there was an undertone there before this Brexit and the voting within the referendum, but I think the result maybe has pushed people to somehow justify now that they think it's ok now to act out in this way, which obviously it's not."
It is becoming really hard to not paint more and more of England with one brush. The dumbest can sometimes have the loudest voices, but, there are a lot of loud voices
We have very different immigration issues then England, and perhaps have it much easier (I have no idea), but I am proud of Canadians when some hate crime happens here and fellow Canadians come out the next day to show we care (i.e. rebuilding a mosque, etc).
Last edited by Kavvy; 06-28-2016 at 08:00 PM.
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No immigration or free movement of EU citizens, no access to market. Not a surprise to any sane person, but I'd imagine the xenophobes haven't thought it through.
Writing in the Daily Telegraph on Monday, Johnson, the former London mayor and leading Brexit campaigner, had suggested the UK might “take back democratic control of immigration” while continuing to enjoy free market access. “Whoever wants to leave this family cannot expect to shed all its responsibilities but keep the privileges,” Merkel said. “Those, for example, who want free access to the single market will in return have to respect European basic rights and freedoms ... that’s true for Great Britain just as much as for the others.”
Merkel said the UK could enjoy access to the single market only if it accepted the “four basic European freedoms – that of people, goods, services and capital”.
“Clearly we want to retain tariff-free access to the single market,” said Mike Hawes, the head of the Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders, which represents the U.K. auto industry. Mr. Hawes wouldn’t speculate on the industry impact if the U.K. loses access to the single market.
Access to the single market is a high priority for almost every U.K. manufacturing and services business, but how exactly Britain would keep that access is unclear. Norway, for example, is part of the European Economic Area but has to accept free movement of EU citizens and contribute to the EU budget—two things many pro-Brexit voters in the U.K. firmly oppose.
__________________ "The great promise of the Internet was that more information would automatically yield better decisions. The great disappointment is that more information actually yields more possibilities to confirm what you already believed anyway." - Brian Eno
Strange way to term open borders policy. That is in no way a "basic freedom".
__________________ "The great promise of the Internet was that more information would automatically yield better decisions. The great disappointment is that more information actually yields more possibilities to confirm what you already believed anyway." - Brian Eno
Strange way to term open borders policy. That is in no way a "basic freedom".
In the context of a European Union I guess.
Kinda like how Alberta can't arbitrarily restrict the movement of people from Saskatchewan or people from British Columbia from driving through the province eastward. Though that's a simplification given the difference in provinces versus the countries involved.
It's a totally false analogy. Saskatchewan is not in another country, as you noted. That's a huge, huge difference.
There's nothing at all objectionable about a sovereign nation wanting to protect its borders and control who comes in. There are stupid extremes one could take that to that are terrible policy, like Trump's "ban all Muslims", or whatever, but it's a policy decision to have stricter, or less strict, controls on your borders that a country can legitimately make. It's not somehow a violation of a "basic European freedom" to make that policy choice and say, "here are our rules for entrance into the UK; if you don't follow them you can't come in".
Merkel is absolutely awful for moralizing.
__________________ "The great promise of the Internet was that more information would automatically yield better decisions. The great disappointment is that more information actually yields more possibilities to confirm what you already believed anyway." - Brian Eno
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The whole Brexit fiasco is likely only going to embolden the racism and xenophobia, turn it mainstream. The segment is going to take the Brexit as "oh hey look, we're the majority now! The majority thinks this way and will back them up."
“And they are saying this to individuals and families who have been here for three, four, five generations. The atmosphere on the street is not good.”
Warsi originally backed the leave campaign, but switched to support remain, calling the Leave campaign “divisive and xenophobic”.
In Gloucester, Max Fras said he was in a Tesco supermarket on Friday night with his young son when a white man became agitated in the queue for the checkout and began yelling: “This is England now, foreigners have 48 hours to #### right off. Who is foreign here? Anyone foreign?”
"Table next to me says to Polish waitress "How come you're so cheerful? You're going home." Him and the missus started laughing." Disgusting
Anti-immigrant leaflets saying "Leave the EU - no more Polish vermin" were put on cars near a school, local police said, the day after the country voted to leave the European Union.
"We voted you out. Go home you f*****g immigrants."
"Rapefugees Not Welcome", as they shouted "f*****g p**dos" and "Allah, Allah, who the f*** is Allah?". Police later made two arrests. father has a broken arm, and possible neck trauma, son has severe facial fractures, broken jaw and nose. my god
with graphic pics of Polish Father and son after being swarmed
Karen moved to Britain from Germany in the 1970s but since Thursday's vote, she's become terrified as she faced a series of xenophobic attacks.
From having dog excrement thrown at her door to friends telling her they don't want to see her again, Karen gave a harrowing account of how she now feels unwelcome in the country where she made her home.
"I haven't been out of the house for three days," she sobbed. "My neighbours told me they don't want me living in this road.
"My friend's grandson got beaten up because he had a foreign grandmother.
"I'm so scared, I don't know what's going to happen next."
Asked about the atmosphere since the EU referendum he said: "I think there was an undertone there before this Brexit and the voting within the referendum, but I think the result maybe has pushed people to somehow justify now that they think it's ok now to act out in this way, which obviously it's not."
It's a totally false analogy. Saskatchewan is not in another country, as you noted. That's a huge, huge difference.
There's nothing at all objectionable about a sovereign nation wanting to protect its borders and control who comes in. There are stupid extremes one could take that to that are terrible policy, like Trump's "ban all Muslims", or whatever, but it's a policy decision to have stricter, or less strict, controls on your borders that a country can legitimately make. It's not somehow a violation of a "basic European freedom" to make that policy choice and say, "here are our rules for entrance into the UK; if you don't follow them you can't come in".
Sure of course it's not apples to apples but isn't this kinda the whole point of the European Union? You want to be part of a Union, you need to follow the rules. You can totally decide to lock up your borders and break the Union rules that you signed up for originally (as a sovereign nation), that's Article 50. But then you can't be surprised if the other members of the Union don't let you have the privileges of the same Union.
Nevermind that as a sovereign nation, the UK signed up for the rules to join the Euro in the first place.
I don't think people are begrudging the UK for being allowed to vote and to leave and break the Euro rules. But you can't do that AND expect to keep all the benefits like unchanged access to the Euro market. And frankly, people were warning of that potential consequences well before the vote.
EDIT: It would be like us signing on for NAFTA and then voting to leave and break rules of it. We can't have the benefits of the agreement and still flaunt our ability to break the agreements that we made. Even though we would be well within our rights to certainly throw up tariffs as a sovereign nation.
Or is your objection with the semantics of somebody saying "basic European freedom" in this context?
There's certainly been an effort to downplay as the fringe or an extreme vocal minority.
On the other hand, the losers have done little more than fume about bigotry and xenophobia, discounting any notion that there could be more at work than bigotry when half the country voted against what most politicians, bankers, business leaders, and the affluent wanted.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chemgear
The whole Brexit fiasco is likely only going to embolden the racism and xenophobia, turn it mainstream. The segment is going to take the Brexit as "oh hey look, we're the majority now! The majority thinks this way and will back them up."
Actually, I think we would have seen worse if Stay won the referendum. People get much angrier when they lose than when they win.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fotze
If this day gets you riled up, you obviously aren't numb to the disappointment yet to be a real fan.
...To be sure, there are many nuances and complications among leave voters. In the inner-city Birmingham neighbourhood of Handsworth, I met Sikh shopkeepers who claimed that the country is full, with just as much oomph as anyone white; in Leominster, Herefordshire, there are plenty of Tory voters gleefully defying Cameron’s instructions, and fixating on questions of sovereignty and democracy.
But make no mistake: in an almost comical reflection of the sacred lefty belief that any worthwhile political movement will necessarily be built around the workers, the foundation of the Brexit coalition is what used to be called the proletariat, large swaths of which are as united as in any lefty fantasy, even if some of their loudest complaints are triggering no end of anxiety among bien-pensant types, and causing Labour a great deal of apprehension.
In Stoke, Merthyr, Birmingham, Manchester and even rural Shropshire, the same lines recurred: so unchanging that they threatened to turn into cliches, but all the more powerful because of their ubiquity. “I’m scared about the future” … “No one listens to us” … “If you haven’t got money, no one cares.”
...What has any of this got to do with the EU? Not much, but such is the nature of referendums: offer people a ballot paper, and they will focus whatever they feel strongly about on to it. There again, one obvious issue is directly linked to the EU, and so central to the political moment that it arises in countless conversations within seconds.
Yes, some people – from bigots in the stockbroker belt to raging gob####es in south Wales shopping precincts – are simply racist. But in a society and economy as precarious as ours, the arrival of large numbers of people prepared to do jobs with increasingly awful terms and conditions was always going to trigger loud resentment. For many places, the pace of change and the pressures on public services have arguably proved to be too much to cope with.
...for millions of people, the word “immigration” is reducible to yet another seismic change no one thought to ask them about, or even explain.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fotze
If this day gets you riled up, you obviously aren't numb to the disappointment yet to be a real fan.
Last edited by CliffFletcher; 06-29-2016 at 11:18 AM.
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South African police fired rubber bullets and tear gas on Thursday to disperse anti-immigrant protesters in Johannesburg, as the country's president called for a halt to a wave of violence directed at foreigners.
Around 200 protesters, shouting that they wanted immigrants to leave, had pelted passing vehicles and police with rocks in an eastern suburb of the country's biggest commercial city, triggering the show of force.
At least four people have been killed in the unrest that started two weeks ago in Durban, a major port on South Africa's Indian Ocean coast where further clashes broke out on Thursday.
Violence flared days after Zulu King Goodwill Zwelithini said in remarks reported by local media that foreigners should leave South Africa. He has since said his comments were misinterpreted.
The foreign ministry of China, a major trade partner, said Chinese-run shops had been damaged in Johannesburg. The Chinese consulate lodged a protest with the police and asked that they ensure the safety of Chinese people.
Johannesburg was the epicenter of anti-foreigner attacks in 2008 that killed more than 60 people as locals vented frustrations over various issues, particularly the high level of unemployment that plagues Africa's most advanced economy.
Zambia’s government deployed more than 1,000 riot police in the capital on Wednesday as authorities sought to retain order after days of anti-immigrant violence that have left at least five people dead and tarnished the nation’s image as a haven for foreign workers and investment.
Violence erupted on Monday in two impoverished suburbs of Lusaka after rumors circulated on social media that foreign nationals were behind a spate of killings in recent weeks that have left victim’s dismembered. The attacks—which were focused mainly on Zambia’s large community of Rwandan immigrants—quickly spread to several suburbs as mobs ransacked foreign-owned shops. Government officials said that at least five people have been beaten and burned to death since Monday, with more than a dozen hospitalized.
A hate speech rally in Tokyo’s Ginza district was met with a silent counter-demonstration on March 6 with protesters denouncing the rally by holding up placards bearing anti-hate speech messages.
The counter-demonstration was organized by citizens’ groups including Tokyo Q-sui Crew (TQC), whose goal was to fight back in silence against rallies that loudly blare out abusive words against foreigners in Japan.
“We intentionally organized a silent protest to make citizens understand the reality of the hate speech demonstration,” said Masayuki Kusakabe, a representative of TQC.
Hate speech demonstrators waved Japanese flags and marched through the streets of a fashionable shopping area in Ginza shouting rhetoric, including “Destroy Korean schools” and “Abolish the government-funded study abroad program for Chinese people.”
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fotze
If this day gets you riled up, you obviously aren't numb to the disappointment yet to be a real fan.
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