China needs to chill out. Big time.

[flamey_mcflame]

I am so excited about the Beijing Olympics. The games will go on as scheduled, and as far as the so called protesters, they are in the clear minority. Most people are very excited about a new world power opening up its' door to the athletes. These games are gonna rock, not as much as Vancouver 2010, but they will be a spectacle. So go ahead and protest, you'll have that moral superiority that no one will care about. The Dalia Lama should stick to spirituality rather than interfere in politics. If he knows whats good for him.

[Dan02]

every time I think China is taking a step forward they take 82 steps back....

[Torture]

Originally Posted by flamey_mcflame

I am so excited about the Beijing Olympics. The games will go on as scheduled, and as far as the so called protesters, they are in the clear minority. Most people are very excited about a new world power opening up its' door to the athletes. These games are gonna rock, not as much as Vancouver 2010, but they will be a spectacle. So go ahead and protest, you'll have that moral superiority that no one will care about. The Dalia Lama should stick to spirituality rather than interfere in politics. If he knows whats good for him.

Do you even realize what's going on in Tibet? I suspect if you had an idea you'd have an entirely different view on the matter...

The Dalia Lama has not said anything to the effect that he's behind the protesters.

However, none of the groups taking part in the protest walk were affiliated with the government and neither the Dalai Lama nor Tibet's government in exile have issued any official statement on the march.

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/World/20...959726-ap.html

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by flamey_mcflame

I am so excited about the Beijing Olympics. The games will go on as scheduled, and as far as the so called protesters, they are in the clear minority. Most people are very excited about a new world power opening up its' door to the athletes. These games are gonna rock, not as much as Vancouver 2010, but they will be a spectacle. So go ahead and protest, you'll have that moral superiority that no one will care about. The Dalia Lama should stick to spirituality rather than interfere in politics. If he knows whats good for him.

Wow, theres a lot of heady stuff in your post.

Clearly you've missed the boar on the Dalia Lama's role in this, he's stayed clear of the protesters. This crackdown by China was a fabrication ready to happen as the free Tibet protests happen on a fairly regular basis.

And apparently the international community does feel moral superiority in this case, especially when you combine it with China's long history of human rights abuses.

The last sentence sounds like a threat on the Dalia Lama who is pretty safely secured away from China's security apparatus, and its unlikely that China can do anything but bluster about this.

Where this can effect China in terms of the Olympics is in terms of actual tourism, as people might be less likely to attend the games, and in terms of dollars from sponserships. With the right pressure a lot of the incoming dollars might go away as China's stance is becoming less popular in a hurry.

[flamey_mcflame]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

Wow, theres a lot of heady stuff in your post.

Clearly you've missed the boar on the Dalia Lama's role in this, he's stayed clear of the protesters. This crackdown by China was a fabrication ready to happen as the free Tibet protests happen on a fairly regular basis.

And apparently the international community does feel moral superiority in this case, especially when you combine it with China's long history of human rights abuses.

The last sentence sounds like a threat on the Dalia Lama who is pretty safely secured away from China's security apparatus, and its unlikely that China can do anything but bluster about this.

Where this can effect China in terms of the Olympics is in terms of actual tourism, as people might be less likely to attend the games, and in terms of dollars from sponserships. With the right pressure a lot of the incoming dollars might go away as China's stance is becoming less popular in a hurry.

China is awash in foreign currency, especially US treasury bonds. They are experiencing 7.0 growth rate. The last thing China needs to worry about is tourist dollars. The Olympics, for China, is all about showcasing their modernization and economic might. If China wants Tibet like they want Hong Kong and/or Taiwan, the world will not get in their way. Tibet will have to choose between India or China sooner or later. Thats where their bargaining chip lies. An independent Tibet is the least likely option because the 4 other UN security council members have not even paid lip service to Tibet's pleas. Reality always trumps right/wrong and ethics. What world are you living in??

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

Where this can effect China in terms of the Olympics is in terms of actual tourism, as people might be less likely to attend the games, and in terms of dollars from sponserships. With the right pressure a lot of the incoming dollars might go away as China's stance is becoming less popular in a hurry.

I'm pretty sure all tickets are sold and sponsorship contracts signed.

I don't see any boycott of the Beijing Olympics other then a few far and few in between that are stuck in the Cold War mentality. Human rights? Tibet? Hey, we've had these issues forever with past and present world powers, including USA, England and so on. China has skeletons in their closet just like most other countries in the world - and like most of those counties, they do what they can to put a blanket over it. I bring up the USA simply because its a case closer to home, where the USA can use their veto power to keep the travesties of Cambodia from becoming official, as not a single member of the Khmer Rouge has been brought to court for their war crimes to date.

I don't disagree that the Olympics more then just sports. In fact, I think the Beijing Olympics will be a smashing success for China and will be one of many big steps China takes to becoming the world's most powerful country.

[HotHotHeat]

Originally Posted by flamey_mcflame

I am so excited about the Beijing Olympics. The games will go on as scheduled, and as far as the so called protesters, they are in the clear minority. Most people are very excited about a new world power opening up its' door to the athletes. These games are gonna rock, not as much as Vancouver 2010, but they will be a spectacle. So go ahead and protest, you'll have that moral superiority that no one will care about. The Dalia Lama should stick to spirituality rather than interfere in politics. If he knows whats good for him.

Wow...

So, this 'minority' you speak of. Let's discuss it.

The USA, Canada, and the EU have all condoned China's actions and are diplomatically protesting the oppression.

There are serious talks in high levels of governments in all these countries that would suggest a boycott is not only possible, but plausible.

Governments aren't the only ones. Today I read about a marathon runner who has decided not to go to Beijing this summer because of the terrible air quality conditions of the race route. He said the runners that will be in the race are probably going to wear gas masks.

A clear minority? Moral superiority? If you say so.

[Torture]

Governments aren't the only ones. Today I read about a marathon runner who has decided not to go to Beijing this summer because of the terrible air quality conditions of the race route. He said the runners that will be in the race are probably going to wear gas masks.

I'm just trying to picture all the runners wearing gas masks right now...

[HotHotHeat]

Originally Posted by flamey_mcflame

China is awash in foreign currency, especially US treasury bonds. They are experiencing 7.0 growth rate. The last thing China needs to worry about is tourist dollars. The Olympics, for China, is all about showcasing their modernization and economic might. If China wants Tibet like they want Hong Kong and/or Taiwan, the world will not get in their way. Tibet will have to choose between India or China sooner or later. Thats where their bargaining chip lies. An independent Tibet is the least likely option because the 4 other UN security council members have not even paid lip service to Tibet's pleas. Reality always trumps right/wrong and ethics. What world are you living in??

Are you saying the US has nothing to do with China's economic boom?

It's not about growth rates alone. It's about healthy, stabilized growth in all sectors of an economy. They took a huge hit when the US lowered the value of it's currency on the world market. Nothing about the Chinese economy is stable. They have huge hurdles to jump before they'll become an economic superpower.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by HotHotHeat

Wow...

So, this 'minority' you speak of. Let's discuss it.

The USA, Canada, and the EU have all condoned China's actions and are diplomatically protesting the oppression.

Wasn't London's mayor on TV 3 months ago saying the Beijing Olympics will be the greatest Olympics ever put on and the best there will be for the next decade? (Noting that London gets 2012) In the same interview, the London mayor also said that these Olympics will be symbolic in bringing China to the forefront of the world, and establish themselves as world leader.

[flamey_mcflame]

Originally Posted by HotHotHeat

Wow...

So, this 'minority' you speak of. Let's discuss it.

The USA, Canada, and the EU have all condoned China's actions and are diplomatically protesting the oppression.

There are serious talks in high levels of governments in all these countries that would suggest a boycott is not only possible, but plausible.

Governments aren't the only ones. Today I read about a marathon runner who has decided not to go to Beijing this summer because of the terrible air quality conditions of the race route. He said the runners that will be in the race are probably going to wear gas masks.

A clear minority? Moral superiority? If you say so.

Of course,these countries have backed up these condemnations with economic blockades. Maybe not. The marathon runner, Gebresalassie, is boycotting because he has asthma and the pollution may have dire effectsa for him. I still haven't seen one country say they are boycotting the Olympics because of Tibet. In fact, I'd say these Olympics will go down as the biggest yet. The world is intrigued by China. The excitement is palpable.

[HotHotHeat]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

Wasn't London's mayor on TV 3 months ago saying the Beijing Olympics will be the greatest Olympics ever put on and the best there will be for the next decade? (Noting that London gets 2012) In the same interview, the London mayor also said that these Olympics will be symbolic in bringing China to the forefront of the world, and establish themselves as world leader.

Possibly. Don't see how that's relevant, it seems fair to think one hosting city would cuddle up close to another. The US and EU are the major players, not the Mayor of London. His priorities are much different.

[flamey_mcflame]

Originally Posted by HotHotHeat

Are you saying the US has nothing to do with China's economic boom?

It's not about growth rates alone. It's about healthy, stabilized growth in all sectors of an economy. They took a huge hit when the US lowered the value of it's currency on the world market. Nothing about the Chinese economy is stable. They have huge hurdles to jump before they'll become an economic superpower.

You need to research financial markets. The US depends on China to buy its treasury bonds to finance their debts. China needs the US to sell their exports, but with a population of one billion and a massive middle class, their dependance on the US for exports will minimize in the future. And most importantly, their government and population is not soaked in debt like the US. They are using all the US treasury bonds to buy resources and assets. The only problem China is having is dumping the bonds because the rest of the world does not want US money. China is a little more stable than the US.

[NuclearFart]

Originally Posted by HotHotHeat

Wow...

So, this 'minority' you speak of. Let's discuss it.

The USA, Canada, and the EU have all condoned China's actions and are diplomatically protesting the oppression.

I don't think you want to use that word here...

Originally Posted by HotHotHeat

There are serious talks in high levels of governments in all these countries that would suggest a boycott is not only possible, but plausible.

Governments aren't the only ones. Today I read about a marathon runner who has decided not to go to Beijing this summer because of the terrible air quality conditions of the race route. He said the runners that will be in the race are probably going to wear gas masks.

A clear minority? Moral superiority? If you say so.

Which "high level governments" are openly disclosing this? I'd be interested to read about this, but I haven't seen anything of the sort. And over-exaggerations about marathon runners wearing gas masks actually weaken arguments . I was in Beijing last year and it aint clean air by any stretch, but it isnt that bad. Toronto or L.A. on a hot summer day are comparable.

The previous post about china moving into Tibet and "colonizing" it is kind of interesting, and just out of curiosity, does anybody else see a parallel with Isreal?

[HotHotHeat]

I should mention, I think a boycott is extremely unlikely. The olympics are a negotiating tool that is being used against China.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by flamey_mcflame

You need to research financial markets. The US depends on China to buy its treasury bonds to finance their debts. China needs the US to sell their exports, but with a population of one billion and a massive middle class, their dependance on the US for exports will minimize in the future. And most importantly, their government and population is not soaked in debt like the US. They are using all the US treasury bonds to buy resources and assets. The only problem China is having is dumping the bonds because the rest of the world does not want US money. China is a little more stable than the US.

I'm actually going to agree with you here. Count me in the group that thinks China's economy is more stable then the USD.

[HotHotHeat]

Originally Posted by flamey_mcflame

You need to research financial markets. The US depends on China to buy its treasury bonds to finance their debts. China needs the US to sell their exports, but with a population of one billion and a massive middle class, their dependance on the US for exports will minimize in the future. And most importantly, their government and population is not soaked in debt like the US. They are using all the US treasury bonds to buy resources and assets. The only problem China is having is dumping the bonds because the rest of the world does not want US money. China is a little more stable than the US.

I think you need to research economics. A growth rate of 7% is extremely unhealthy. That's not to say the US is in great shape, but the picture you're painting of China is not taking all factors into account. They have a long ways to go. Corruption still might be their biggest problem. Not to mention their banking system.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by NuclearFart

Which "high level governments" are openly disclosing this? I'd be interested to read about this, but I haven't seen anything of the sort. And over-exaggerations about marathon runners wearing gas masks actually weaken arguments . I was in Beijing last year and it aint clean air by any stretch, but it isnt that bad. Toronto or L.A. on a hot summer day are comparable.

China is pretty bad, but they have taken drastic measures to clean up their environment in the past year, and have made it a top priority to clean up the pollution with the Olympics coming along. Look at the environmental science interests propping up in China, such as designs for eco-city Dongtan.

And I agree that places like Toronto, LA and San Fransisco are pretty comparable to Beijing.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by HotHotHeat

I think you need to research economics. A growth rate of 7% is extremely unhealthy. That's not to say the US is in great shape, but the picture you're painting of China is not taking all factors into account. They have a long ways to go. Corruption still might be their biggest problem.

Corruption hurts every government, including the USA as well. Just look at the Iraq war. I'd argue that China's corruption is less of a concern (economics wise) then the USA's corruption.

Inflation was ridiculously high for China, and the government did try and slow down their economy. However, their inflationary pressures were more demand push rather then cost pull (as opposed to the USA) which is alot healthier. While the USA fears stagflation, China's high inflationary pressures arn't without its due. It comes from being a pretty hot economy.

[HotHotHeat]

Originally Posted by NuclearFart

I don't think you want to use that word here...



Which "high level governments" are openly disclosing this? I'd be interested to read about this, but I haven't seen anything of the sort. And over-exaggerations about marathon runners wearing gas masks actually weaken arguments . I was in Beijing last year and it aint clean air by any stretch, but it isnt that bad. Toronto or L.A. on a hot summer day are comparable.

The previous post about china moving into Tibet and "colonizing" it is kind of interesting, and just out of curiosity, does anybody else see a parallel with Isreal?

You're right. Wrong word. Great of you to make a point of that.

The talks of boycotting the Olympics in the US have been around since 2006, for a variety of reasons. France has threatened a boycott due to the Darfur situation.

There's just as many politicians and officials speaking out against a boycott, but the debate is ongoing.