JG, SM, JH, KR, DJ, JC, JJ, Goalie Extensions - which ones happen, which ones don't?

[JiriHrdina]

You think if he (Colborne) hadn't been injured he would have been cut?

[adc]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

Granlund is one of our top prospects who's shown an ability to score at the NHL level while Wotherspoon couldn't even beat Kulak out for a roster spot in his make-or-break year and it's way too early to give up on Ortio unless he craps the bed all season. Agostino and Arnold are way better than "AHL-only contract players"... they're better than Hamilton for starters.

...And Colborne barely survived training camp cuts by getting injured. Not exactly "re-sign for sure" territory.

Granlund hasn't shown much of an ability to score at the NHL level at all.

21 points in 56 isn't bad but it isn't very good either. I don't see him having the offensive game to be in the top 6 and his strength and defensive game doesn't add much to the bottom 6. He has had a lot of chances and hasn't looked good in his time in the NHL.

Agostino and Arnold are going to be 24 and have shown nothing at the AHL level to indicate they have a role going forward with the NHL team. Hamilton re-signed as an AHL vet for the farm team and a quick fill in if absolutely needed.

I was more impressed with Wotherspoon than Kulak in the pre-season so that is why I keep him as a definite re-sign. I think he is a better defenseman than Kulak but realize the Flames brass don't agree.

And no way was Colborne going to be cut. I like his size and cycling ability would love to see him on a 3rd line with Bouma and he is a guy that can fill in in the top 6 if need be.

[Vulcan]

I can't believe how some of you just want to throw away assets. Maybe some will never be NHL regulars but we need a farm team as well, if for nothing more that teach the rookies how to perform.

[Calgary4LIfe]

In my opinion, building a team and giving out contracts requires a few different looks at the short and long-term. You need to group players who fall into core, secondary core, support players, and youth with upside that you retain.

The Core - Before doing anything, I think you have to identify who is the 'core' you are building around. That should be easy - Brodie, Bennett, Gaudreau, Monahan, Hamilton and some may add Giordano to this list (I am one of those).

Secondary 'core' players - guys you want to keep around, and do your best to retain. These guys help you win games fairly consistently, or are younger guys that are projecting to be as such. Backlund, Colborne, Hudler, Frolik, Bouma, Russell and Wideman (though the latter two haven't been showing well this season). Ramo and Hiller should at least be here, but you can make an argument that one or both of them are in the next tier.

Roster filler - Jones, Stajan, Engelland, Raymond, Bollig, and Smid all fit in here. Sure, some guys definitely step up huge and help you win games. Some provide sheltering and leadership. You just have to make sure they don't sign for big dollars or big term. As the young players are gaining experience, they require less sheltering and leadership, and take a much more active role. The guys above should end up getting replaced by young roster players making much less.

Young and developing - These guys are definitely not the young superstar players like Bennett or Hamilton, but with some definite upside due to their age and the way they may be trending. Guys who can maybe develop into one of the above 3 breakdowns. Jooris, Ferland (though you can make an argument that the first two have graduated into one of the other sections already), Ortio, Granlund (since he has been getting call-ups regularly, I will include him here as well) and Grant.

This makes the most sense to me. Who is important today, who is important moving forward. Who can be easily replaced? Who is barely hanging onto their respective level? Who looks like they are moving up a level or more?

Gaudreau - he gets signed. Would be absolutely crazy to think otherwise. Hopefully closer to 5.5, but I bet around 6.5. Could be more - who knows? Really hope a number around 6 coupled with a lengthy term.

Monahan - same as above.

Hudler - complicated. No question this guy injects skill, experience, leadership - but he is probably set to command a bigger and longer-term contract than I think he fits according to the breakdown. Even if you feel he is a core player today, I am thinking within a few years he won't be, but will still be on the team being paid as a core player. I have him as a guy the Flames trade this year.

Russell - another guy I really like. Tough season (but improving) so far. I think the whole 'blocked shots vs not having the puck enough' argument is asinine. Here is a guy you can watch skate up the ice very well with the puck under pressure, and can also make a very good first-pass out of the zone. Great IQ in this kid, and he is fearless. He is the Bouma of the defensive ranks. Will fight as well. Great shot - accurate and hard, which makes him an asset on the 2nd unit PP as well. One of the leaders on this team too. The downside? He is small, and I do think he will likely command a hefty raise this year. I love him, but I think the Flames move on this season (and probably next season with Wideman as well). There should be enough pressure coming up the ranks, and Hamilton is really starting to look like a guy that can carry a defensive partner, not to mention Engelland can take additional minutes to help shelter your Kulak, Wotherspoon, Nakladal, etc., coming up through the ranks. Wideman has hovered between 'terrible' in his own end, to being '1st pairing level' at different times in his tenure so far with the Flames (as well as being elite to near-elite offensively). I really like him, but that long-term piece has to be a guy that can win puck-battles in the corner more consistently in addition to moving the puck and solid defensively. Russell only checks 2 out of 3 for me, and I do see an over-payment looming on the horizon to retain him.

Jones - hated him when the Flames first got him, hated him for the first half season (or even full-season), but he definitely has a spot on team. When he is skating and using his size to be physical, he is definitely important. However, his best seasons were with the Avalanche of 45 and 37 points respectively, and that was 3 seasons ago. He is definitely over-paid right now, but useful (much in the same way as Engelland). However, he is a guy you don't re-sign and instead trade sometime this season. I think he will only trend down, and at 31 years old and never playing a full-season in the NHL due to injuries, I think the trending down will accelerate. He would probably be wanting to find a 3+ year contract somewhere. For the Flames, you re-sign him for only a year at a time for now at most I think, especially with the uncertainty of the cap. He should be replaceable.

Colborne - the advanced-stats crowd will dislike him (and rightfully so - terrible numbers for sure). My eye-test tells me otherwise. I think people either look at him as a finished (or nearly finished) developing player. I see him as having room to grow still, and showing consistent flashes of it. He is a guy that I think is either in the support-core, or at least nearly there. His size, underrated playmaking, work along the boards, skating and IQ all point to a guy who will be important moving forward. I don't think he would be expensive to re-sign anyways, and really fills up a few holes on the Flames. A no-brainer to re-sign from these standpoints.

Jooris - I do think he is growing still. He gives you tonnes of speed and intangibles out there like heart. Defensively sound. Offensively 'decent' when you factor in his minutes. Decent on the PK. He is definitely signed to another low money contract. He has room to grow.

Goalies - unless you can upgrade through trade/UFA signing, Ramo makes sense re-signing near the end of the season if he is still doing well. You keep re-signing him until you find something better. Pretty simple I think.

Hudler, Jones, Russell, Hiller = out. The rest you re-sign unless someone demands way too much for their role.

[hockey.modern]

Originally Posted by Calgary4LIfe

Hudler, Jones, Russell, Hiller = out. The rest you re-sign unless someone demands way too much for their role.

Just adding to your quote,

OUT:
Jiri Hudler:$4,000,000
David Jones:$4,000,000
Kris Russell:$2,600,000
Jonas Hiller:$4,500,000
______________
$15,100,0000

CORE:
Johnny Gaudreau: 6-7 years, AAV: -$6,500,000
Sean Monahan: 6-7 years, AAV: -$6,500,000

Didn't add the other players, but the numbers from them can make it more flexible in terms of resigning the ones left out.
______________
$2,100,000

[Crumpy-Gunt]

Originally Posted by H2SO4(aq)

I really think its time to sell high on johnny gaudreau. He is too small, a light breeze would blow him over, if he had been in town yesterday when it was so gusty he'd probably have bounced all the way to manitoba like tumbleweed. His longevity in this league is highly questionable playing at that size and if Brad Trellving has any smarts he would dish him for some heavier guys like Backes or Chris Stewart while his value is at its highest.

ahahahahaha






ha

[Da_Chief]

I don't think losing this year is a bad deal in the long run. Add another top prospect to the pool. Hopefully a top 5 talent.

This allows them to sell guys like Hudler, Jones, Russell etc instead of trying to sign them to extensions.

Makes guys like Gaudreau/Bennett/Brodie/Monahan/Hamilton face adversity.

Most of all, it tampers the expectations of the whole franchise and the fans. This is year 4 of the re-build. Next year is when major improvements were to happen but there are still plenty of holes in the lineup.