The Apathetic Voter Thread - 2011

[Bring_Back_Shantz]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

The First Past the Post System is the reason for any apathy for me. That system combined with where I live means my vote is pretty much assured to be completely meaningless.

We need Proportional Representation badly.

Did I mention that Harper and the cons scare me?

Too bad I really cannot do a thing about it. A non-conservative vote in Alberta is usually a throwaway vote. How can anybody in Alberta ever get excited about elections while we continue to blindly vote conservative every election? Makes elections pretty much irrelevant to Albertans and hands the power to make change to other provinces.

Man do I hate our first past the post voting system. What a piece of crap. Just reinforces the two big parties and makes 50% of the population's votes irrelevant.

This kid of thinking really bugs me.

Seriously, everyone who wants to vote liberal in Calgary probably thinks their vote isn't worth anything.

Well you know what? If all those apathetic Liberal would be voters actually got off their asses and rallied each other, and actually voted, there would probalby be enough of them to beat a Conserative candidate who only got 50% of his voting base out.

Call it apathy if you want guys, but it looks a lot like laziness to me.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by Bring_Back_Shantz

This kid of thinking really bugs me.

Seriously, everyone who wants to vote liberal in Calgary probably thinks their vote isn't worth anything.

Well you know what? If all those apathetic Liberal would be voters actually got off their asses and rallied each other, and actually voted, there would probalby be enough of them to beat a Conserative candidate who only got 50% of his voting base out.

Call it apathy if you want guys, but it looks a lot like laziness to me.

I will actually vote and it will be a non-conservative vote. So don't bother calling me lazy about it. I definitely strongly encourage everyone in Alberta who does not like the conservatives to go out and vote against them and unfortunately the Liberals are likely the only chance to beat out any conservative candidates.

But that does not change that this is a thread about voter apathy, and I am saying our first past the post system helps to contribute to said apathy. It helps to marginalize a large percentage of the population and give them no representation in Ottawa.

Do you disagree that our voting system encourages apathy and makes a lot of people's votes meaningless? Do you disagree that proportional representation would help fix some of that?

Many ridings are won in the first past the post system with less than 40% of the votes. That means that 60+% of people in that riding are not being represented by a person and a party that they feel shares their values and ideals. That is a problem for democracy. A conservative MP is not going to fight for what I want, therefore I am not being represented at all in Ottawa.

Our democracy is a joke. I'm not saying the country is always being run into the ground but the idea of democracy and our practice of it are very far from each other. How can it be rule by the people when 50+% of the population aren't being represented by someone who shares their values? MP's far too often tow the party line but even if they were to consult their constituents, we'd still have a large percentage of the population's opinions being ignored.

Our "democracy" is quite clearly broken. And this leads to voter apathy. Unfortunately I do not see how proportional representation can become a reality. The Cons and Libs are not going to produce the electoral change that our system badly needs.

[Bring_Back_Shantz]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

I will actually vote and it will be a non-conservative vote. So don't bother calling me lazy about it. I definitely strongly encourage everyone in Alberta who does not like the conservatives to go out and vote against them and unfortunately the Liberals are likely the only chance to beat out any conservative candidates.

But that does not change that this is a thread about voter apathy, and I am saying our first past the post system helps to contribute to said apathy. It helps to marginalize a large percentage of the population and give them no representation in Ottawa.

Do you disagree that our voting system encourages apathy and makes a lot of people's votes meaningless? Do you disagree that proportional representation would help fix some of that?

Many ridings are won in the first past the post system with less than 40% of the votes. That means that 60+% of people in that riding are not being represented by a person and a party that they feel shares their values and ideals. That is a problem for democracy. A conservative MP is not going to fight for what I want, therefore I am not being represented at all in Ottawa.

Our democracy is a joke. I'm not saying the country is always being run into the ground but the idea of democracy and our practice of it are very far from each other. How can it be rule by the people when 50+% of the population aren't being represented by someone who shares their values? MP's far too often tow the party line but even if they were to consult their constituents, we'd still have a large percentage of the population's opinions being ignored.

Our "democracy" is quite clearly broken. And this leads to voter apathy. Unfortunately I do not see how proportional representation can become a reality. The Cons and Libs are not going to produce the electoral change that our system badly needs.

Sure I won't deny that proportional represnation wouldn't improve voter turnout, but don't kid yourself, in that system there's no guarantee that you'll be represented any better than you are now. Look at conuntries with proportional reprsenation around the world. What you usually see is coalition governments, which means a lot of compromise and the guys you voted for aren't now necessarily representing you the way you thought they would.
Is that really relevant to this? Probalby not.

What is relevant is that we have the system we do and it isn't going to change any time soon. So there are a few options.

1) Vote for your guy and live with the fact that someone you didn't vote for may be elected to represent you (like happens in every democratic country in the world)
2) Don't vote and claim it's because you know your candidate won't win anyway (ultimately self defeating)
3) Go out and try to get potential voters for your candiate engaged and try to raise their turnout relative to the general population

That third option is the only real way to change things as a voter. Most Conservative voters in this part of the country aren't going to go out and do it becasue they see a Conservative win as inevitable. But if the Liberal voters did it, there's a decent chance that if the worked hard enough they could rally enough support to get their candidate elected.

That's why I say it's just as much laziness as it is apathy.
I'm pretty lazy when it comes to the election because so far there's been no real reason for me to get out and wave the Conservative flag and work to get someone elected. But that certainly doesn't mean I'm apathetic about the election, if there was a chance the Liberals could win in my riding, I would likley be doing a lot more to get Conservative votes out to the polls.

[Traditional_Ale]

I have an idea that might fix how the gov't works. If there is an election and the party in power is not re-elected, then the MPs of said party are out of politics for good.

[Mr.Coffee]

A lot of people hop onto their high horses and start blasting others for not voting. The reality is though, that we really are pretty powerless. Governments that are voted in don't even do what they say they'll do anyway.

What party plans on taking on our gouging, borderline mobster banks and telecommunications giants? None of them. What party can gaurantee they won't be influenced by lobbyists? None of them. What power do we actually have? Not much.

So F off with your high horse bullcrap. Our vote doesn't mean anything because no matter what party gets power it can't even do anything material or meaningful anyway based on the current system.

People have the freedom to vote. That's what we are lucky to have. The freedom to choose to vote too. That doesn't mean you have to vote for some asshat who plans to do whatever the hell he wants to do anyway.

North American politics is the biggest crock of %^&! I've ever seen in my life. They don't represent bull. They don't really do anything but piss everybody off.

[Shazam]

Make voting mandatory.

[Ford Prefect]

Ballots need a "None Of The Above" option. And they need to tally those votes.

[llama64]

So far I'm thinking of voting for Greens simply because May showed up in Calgary.

Democracy is so stifled in this city it's frightening.

But still, Layton's mustache calls to me. Maybe there should be a new tradition - election beards. The leader with the best beard get's to be PM (women might have an issue with this though...)

Still gonna vote. Can't complain about your government if you don't cast a ballot - my opinion at least.

[Ark2]

Originally Posted by llama64

So far I'm thinking of voting for Greens simply because May showed up in Calgary.

Democracy is so stifled in this city it's frightening.

But still, Layton's mustache calls to me. Maybe there should be a new tradition - election beards. The leader with the best beard get's to be PM (women might have an issue with this though...)

Still gonna vote. Can't complain about your government if you don't cast a ballot - my opinion at least.

If you vote for someone because they have a moustache, then I think we would all be better off if you just stayed home and didn't vote at all.

[CaptainCrunch]

I think that we should follow the same voting rules as the brethren Pirate lords.

No election works because only the candidates can vote and they would only vote for themselves.

[Sr. Mints]

Originally Posted by Mazrim

How am I supposed to vote when these people are the choices in my riding?



I mean...look at them!! At least one of them has a good playoff beard going.

Voting on the most number of chins? What's #2 hiding, I wonder...

[HOOT]

Originally Posted by Shazam

Make voting mandatory.

They would be counting a lot of spoiled ballots.

[WilsonFourTwo]

^^ Who cares. As long as I get my tax credit.....

[mrkajz44]

Originally Posted by WilsonFourTwo

^^ Who cares. As long as I get my tax credit.....

Hmmm, tax credit for voting. That's actually not a bad idea.

[llama64]

Originally Posted by Ark2

If you vote for someone because they have a moustache, then I think we would all be better off if you just stayed home and didn't vote at all.

Why exactly? When people vote Conservative/Liberal simply because that's how they've always voted I really don't see the difference.

How many voters ACTUALLY consider the candidate they vote for these days? The campaigns themselves are not about the party nor are they about any sort of platform - they are about the leaders. And NONE of the leaders are worthy of my vote.

Don't call me out because I'm thinking of alternate reasons to cast my ballot. Call out people who don't think about why they are voting.

[MoneyGuy]

Originally Posted by Traditional_Ale

I have an idea that might fix how the gov't works. If there is an election and the party in power is not re-elected, then the MPs of said party are out of politics for good.

Seriously? Bad, bad idea. You'd be turfing some very good MPs. It would take that party a long time to recover. If the Tories were turfed now, there would be virtually no option for years to the Libs because who else has a chance.

Originally Posted by mrkajz44

Hmmm, tax credit for voting. That's actually not a bad idea.

No thanks. I hate the idea of paying or requiring people to vote. Lots of people, maybe most, couldn't care less and are ignorant of the issues and the candidates. Let them stay home. They would just guess and make the votes less important for those of us who are informed.

Voter apathy is unfortunate but don't try forcing people to vote. Voters who guess or vote for the best-looking candidate is worse than apathy.

[HOOT]

Originally Posted by MoneyGuy

Voters who guess or vote for the best-looking candidate is worse than apathy.

New idea! Voting for elections should be similar to American Idol. Lowest vote gets voted off and whoever is left standing by the end runs the country for 12-18 months, or whenever the next election is called.

[Traditional_Ale]

Originally Posted by MoneyGuy

Seriously? Bad, bad idea. You'd be turfing some very good MPs. It would take that party a long time to recover. If the Tories were turfed now, there would be virtually no option for years to the Libs because who else has a chance.

I was speaking hyperbole.

[Yasa]

Originally Posted by HOOT

New idea! Voting for elections should be similar to American Idol. Lowest vote gets voted off and whoever is left standing by the end runs the country for 12-18 months, or whenever the next election is called.

Can all the candidates be filtered through Simon, Randy and Paula first?

[Isbrant]

Originally Posted by MoneyGuy

Seriously? Bad, bad idea. You'd be turfing some very good MPs. It would take that party a long time to recover. If the Tories were turfed now, there would be virtually no option for years to the Libs because who else has a chance.



No thanks. I hate the idea of paying or requiring people to vote. Lots of people, maybe most, couldn't care less and are ignorant of the issues and the candidates. Let them stay home. They would just guess and make the votes less important for those of us who are informed.

Voter apathy is unfortunate but don't try forcing people to vote. Voters who guess or vote for the best-looking candidate is worse than apathy.

In my ideal world, I would have voting be manditory but you have to pass a test first in order to vote. Everyone would have to make an informed decision.