Fair or unfair

[Sylvanfan]

Well thanks for the feedback.

I've read all the books suggested and the like. I really used to be exceptionally good with money. I do have a few safety triggers built into my system that invovle an accelerated mortgage repayment, and automatic deductions from my paycheques to registered accounts. So with those we do have some savings, but it's all money I can't touch till I'm retired, or will free me of obligated mortgage payments sooner. But my fiancee is on that exact end of the spectrum, where she has always been bad with it. Certainly we both have been raised very differently when it comes to the subject of money. The one thing we do fight about as a couple is money, and perhaps counselling is required. Of course that also costs a whole schwack of money!!!!

How SpecialK described his first couple of months is what we're experiencing. Having sent her to school and than having to move and not being able to get a company to pay the relocation expenses certainly cost me a pretty penny. Now I have managed to pay off most of my debts and am really close to having it all cleared off, and it's all on an unsecured LOC thats at prime +.5% that I got back in the old days when I was a good money manger. But as I mentioned earlier recently theres been a lot of episodes where $200 or $300 gets spend on unneccessary things and it's pushed back the payments that I wanted to make on the LOC. I've tried to sit down with her, and explain this and show it to her, but it just hasn't worked. It's like if you live with an alchoholic but kept an ample supply of booze around the place for yourself. Eventually the addict will likely give into the temptation.

What I'm trying to do is take away access to the extra money without having her have a bank account where she constantly racks up $20 NSF charges or a bunch of withdrawal fees where she's always trying to sneak $20 out of it. If I let her have a bankcard attached to an account thats exactly what she'll do, and to make matters worse the bank would offer her some type of overdraft and she'll end up abusing it. With this system when she runs out of cash and no longer has access to more of it, it might make her stop and contemplate things and ask herself some basic questions.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by SpecialK12

A few great books to read "The Wealthy Barber" .

I'll second that.

Got it as a Christmas gift last year and it really helped me out. I'm slightly retarted when it comes to money and long-term goal thinking and it's simple approach really helped me.

[Sylvanfan]

I personally think the wealthy barber should be required reading as part of the high school curriculum. They really don't do enough in school to teach people about money. Reading that book will serve kids in school a lot better than 99% of the rest of the stuff thrown at them.

[notoepik]

Originally Posted by Reaper

Like cuffing your husband in the head for not being eloquent when suggesting you not have a bank card? I bet that one sounded better in your head.

Nope, it sounded just like I meant it. Getting his attention, not beating the living crap out of him.

And is a far cry from calling someones wife something as demeaning as a ho.

[J pold]

I am never getting married

[notoepik]

Well Syl, it sounds like you have sat down and discussed things with her then. Which is what I was saying above would be the step to take, talk about it, rather impose your will on her.

I guess she has to discover what drives her to spend money unwisely. There have been suggestions in this thread already on how to do that. Maybe she is compensating for you being a cheap bugger

[Reaper]

Originally Posted by notoepik

Nope, it sounded just like I meant it. Getting his attention, not beating the living crap out of him.

And is a far cry from calling someones wife something as demeaning as a ho.

I wasn't commenting on the "ho" thing.

Perhaps I'm just different but since I would never hit my wife I expect that she shouldn't hit me either.

[notoepik]

Well Reaper, I wouldn't hit my husband either. Cuffing him in the side of the head is euphamism for getting his attention. If we have a problem, we sit down and talk about it. Believe it or not, we have never yelled at each other, let alone hit each other.

He would never make an ultimate to me, like taking away my credit card. But then, I use it responsibly. I wouldn't do that to him either. He would also not call me a Ho, even if he was trying to be mildly amusing

[Cowperson]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

They really don't do enough in school to teach people about money. Reading that book will serve kids in school a lot better than 99% of the rest of the stuff thrown at them.

For a few years I was part of a Junior Achievement program which brought in junior high kids from around Calgary to Mount Royal College for a one day workshop on what they would need to do financially to live in the real world.

The intent was to educate and prevent drop-outs.

So . . . . part of the program was having them scour the classifieds finding jobs they were qualified for with a Grade 9 education - ones that stated the hourly wage - find apartments, budget for essentials, etc . . . . . and, of course, scare the crap out of them when they saw how they would have to live on their 7-11 wages.

Don't know if that program is still running.

Sylfanfan, I think you'd be wise to settle the issue to the satisfaction of both of you before you get married . . . . because when the bloom is off the rose in year seven, its something like this that will kill your relationship dead. But be prepared to compromise yourself as I said earlier.

Cowperson

[Antithesis]

I agree with CP, that you're going to have to be willing to meet her in the middle and hope that she's willing to do the same. I'm lucky that my wife and I more or less agree on the subject of money (though I actually think she's a little too deferential towards me on the subject .... I wasn't the best but am getting better)

Money is so important to talk about in any serious relationship, and I really hope you can get her to see where you're coming from because it is important. I think you're on the right track making the same limitations on yourself (or harsher limits) than those you'd like on her.

If you truly think that she might need counselling on this issue, maybe bring that up, because I can't imagine, when presented with the numbers, that there'd be any rational response to why its happening. Maybe even offer to go with her!

[JiriHrdina]

Re. The Wealthy Barber - it was actually part of my C.A.L.M. (Career and Life Management) curriculum when I was in high school. Do they still have CALM? Anyhoo, it was the best part of the course and taught me a lot about planning long-term finanically...even though other things have prevented me from following all of the lessons it contains.

Regardless, I do hope they still do include it as part of the course.

[V]

Is it fair to take away here bank and credit cards? Only if yours are taken away as well. It's gotta be even-steven, I think. You have a community card that comes out every Monday to withdraw an agreed upon amount. A percentage goes to her, a percentage goes to you and when the money runs out it's gone.

One agreement my wife and I made before we got married is that we never, ever fight about money. It's just not important enough to get ****y about. Maybe it's easy for me to say, because my wife and I don't fight about money, but I think it's doable as long as you put the effort into it. Talk about goals, wants, needs, draft up a nice spreadsheet for a budget and be relentless with sticking to it. Keep every single receipt, even the $2 ones. Track everything. After a while you'll both be used to living the lifestyle your income dictates and it'll get easy. You'll have nice lump sums of money to spend on vacations, or extra special things (house stuff for me).

But being a tyrant about it, as necessary as you might think it might be, will not be the correct solution.

[albertGQ]

Originally Posted by Cowperson

For a few years I was part of a Junior Achievement program which brought in junior high kids from around Calgary to Mount Royal College for a one day workshop on what they would need to do financially to live in the real world.

The intent was to educate and prevent drop-outs.

So . . . . part of the program was having them scour the classifieds finding jobs they were qualified for with a Grade 9 education - ones that stated the hourly wage - find apartments, budget for essentials, etc . . . . . and, of course, scare the crap out of them when they saw how they would have to live on their 7-11 wages.

Don't know if that program is still running.
Cowperson

Yes, that program is still running. I taught "The Economics of Staying in School" for Junior Achievement to a bunch of grade 9 students at Father Scollen school last year. I would've done it again this year had I not decided to take a trip to California

[Sylvanfan]

Did people not read the entire initial post?

I said I would also not be using my bank/credit cards either obviously thats not fair. I too would be on a cash allowance on a per week basis and mine would be significantly less than hers is. What I guess I failed to mention is that on weekends we'd bring out the bank car to fill the cars, purchase groceries and other neccessary items that we both agree on. We'd also sit down and review all bank transactions for the week. That way everything is out in the open. I mean I understand that I'm going to have to compromise and allow her to spend because she'll never be willing to be different than that. But am I being that unfair by asking an impulsive spender to consult me first before spending a predetermined amount of money? If she wants to spend $300 on clothing she just has to save her weekly allowance until she has enough to buy it, or we both have to agree that yes we have enough money to make such a purchase.

[DementedReality]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

.... If she wants to spend $300 on clothing she just has to save her weekly allowance until she has enough to buy it, or we both have to agree that yes we have enough money to make such a purchase.

i think thats exactly how it should be ... i cant imagine a reasonable argument to suggest otherwise.

[V]

hmmm, I guessed I musta skimmed over that part. Yeah, what you're proposing sounds fair, although I'd say that this kinda stuff is pretty important and should be talked about and figured out before you got this far with her. Maybe she doesn't want to care about the future. Maybe she didn't realize she was going to end up with such a financial hardass that wouldn't let her have any fun (her possible perspective, not mine). Why is your desire for a secure future more important than her desire to buy what she wants when she wants?