[News] Flames claim Beecher off waivers

[Monahammer]

Stromgren, who has better stats at every level, should have been given this chance before claiming Beecher. Morton is good in the dot. Stromgren-Morton-Klapka would be better.

To me it just points at a continued lack of concerted direction and real strategy from management.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

I think people want to give Morton a chance because he has produced at the AHL level and he is the age where he's not going to get any better playing in that league.

It makes sense that people have a bias towards prospects that they have followed for a period of time.

I defy you to show any posts refering to Morton as a prospect they were watching before, say, this training camp (where he did show well and most people were surprised).

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

I defy you to show any posts refering to Morton as a prospect they were watching before, say, this training camp (where he did show well and most people were surprised).

No thanks.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

I defy you to show any posts refering to Morton as a prospect they were watching before, say, this training camp (where he did show well and most people were surprised).

He’s definitely come up a bunch before training camp (he did have a goal in his one game last year remember). That said, Morton was the 24th ranked prospect in 2024 and the 22nd ranked prospect in 2025, according to our user polls.

He’s been officially part of the org for 16 months, and played his first game in the system at 25, one year older than Beecher is now.

So, if people have been following him, it hasn’t really been for long and it certainly hasn’t been with any high expectations.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

He’s definitely come up a bunch before training camp (he did have a goal in his one game last year remember). That said, Morton was the 24th ranked prospect in 2024 and the 22nd ranked prospect in 2025, according to our user polls.

He’s been officially part of the org for 16 months, and played his first game in the system at 25, one year older than Beecher is now.

So, if people have been following him, it hasn’t really been for long and it certainly hasn’t been with any high expectations.

I'd like to see posts from when he was called up. I bet people complained he was called up over other guys.

[Mass_nerder]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

Stromgren, who has better stats at every level, should have been given this chance before claiming Beecher. Morton is good in the dot. Stromgren-Morton-Klapka would be better.

To me it just points at a continued lack of concerted direction and real strategy from management.

I assume Beecher is auditioning for 4th line center.
Based on Stromgren's production in the AHL, I would guess the flames would prefer to develop him into a top 6, or at least middle 6 player. I don't really think they're competing for the same ice.

[Monahammer]

Originally Posted by Mass_nerder

I assume Beecher is auditioning for 4th line center.
Based on Stromgren's production in the AHL, I would guess the flames would prefer to develop him into a top 6, or at least middle 6 player. I don't really think they're competing for the same ice.

It's a false equivalency. You can play on the 4th line and work your way up to the 2nd line or top 6. I posit that that is the best way to get a younger guy better defensive matchups and allow him to build his skill.

Bottom 6 role players are extremely overrated in the NHL. The best teams in the league rarely if ever carry these guys around, and if they do they're usually unicorns that also pitch in solid offense- Coleman is IMO the closest we should ever get to playing bottom 6 role players.

[BigThief]

Originally Posted by bigrangy

Penalty kill specialist is the dumbest thing GMs go out of their way to look for. Play your best players whenever you can and your goal differential will improve

Sure but no one went out if their way to look for this player. He appeared on the waiver wire one morning and Conroy put in a claim.

[gvitaly]

Originally Posted by Bingo

I didn't think he was great.

Just game one with a new team, so you give him time.

His line got filled in but they've never played together before.

But I just didn't see any of that speed in deployment at all.

I actually saw a lot of Nordstrom when I watched him. I thought he finished all his hits, but they didn't look that hard. He seemed to be doing good things defensively, decent stick and positioning. And he looked fine on the PK with Huberdeau.

That said, that line was playing slow, and didn't bring much energy. Meanwhile Lomberg - Morton - Klapka was the best line a day before. What I found a bit strange was that he didn't take any faceoffs despite his faceoff ability being one of the reasons we got him.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

It's a false equivalency. You can play on the 4th line and work your way up to the 2nd line or top 6. I posit that that is the best way to get a younger guy better defensive matchups and allow him to build his skill.

Bottom 6 role players are extremely overrated in the NHL. The best teams in the league rarely if ever carry these guys around, and if they do they're usually unicorns that also pitch in solid offense- Coleman is IMO the closest we should ever get to playing bottom 6 role players.

Stromgren isn't a centre. Beecher is being auditioned to be a Rooney/Lewis/old Stajan/Ryan type.

EDIT: Also, people complain bitterly here when more skilled guys (Zary/Kerins) are playing in a 4th line role, even if it's to work their way into the lineup.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

I'd like to see posts from when he was called up. I bet people complained he was called up over other guys.

Yeah some fans might have preferred seeing other players. Just like now, some wanted to see different forwards called up.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

It's a false equivalency. You can play on the 4th line and work your way up to the 2nd line or top 6. I posit that that is the best way to get a younger guy better defensive matchups and allow him to build his skill.

Sure, you can use the 4th line to work guys in, and that is no doubt what they will do with Stromgren. But that doesn't change or negate the fact that they play different roles and aren't competing for the same ice. Or the fact that you're still going to have some 4th liners on your team.

]quote]Bottom 6 role players are extremely overrated in the NHL. The best teams in the league rarely if ever carry these guys around, and if they do they're usually unicorns that also pitch in solid offense- Coleman is IMO the closest we should ever get to playing bottom 6 role players.[/QUOTE]

Name one NHL team that has 6 Colemans in their bottom 6 (other than the 76 Habs). How about 5, can you name one with 5?

Luostarinen, Boqvist and Greer played every game with the cup champs last year

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Yeah some fans might have preferred seeing other players. Just like now, some wanted to see different forwards called up.

What I mean is, I bet he was called the older dude holding younger guys back. Now supposedly it's (younger) Beecher holding Morton back?

[Enoch Root]

This idea that fans have, that the 4th line should be talented players, and not '4th liner-types' just doesn't add up to me.

Are there ANY teams in the league that try to employ this strategy? Are there any good ones?

Even if you could ice 4 talented lines, you wouldn't be able to keep them, in a cap system. In order to pay the top players, teams have no choice but to have some guys that cost the minimum. And with that, the best you can do is have guys that perform a role - i.e. forecheck and wear down the opposing D. That may seem on the surface to not add value, but it does - it makes the offensive guys more effective.

The problem isn't 4th line types, the problem is having bad ones. Which is why trying to upgrade the position seems like a good idea to me.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

What I mean is, I bet he was called the older dude holding younger guys back. Now supposedly it's (younger) Beecher holding Morton back?

He was just called up a few days ago so you should definitely be able to find some of those posts.

Speaking for myself, I am generally going to be more excited about a promotion from within than a waiver claim.

[D as in David]

Originally Posted by gvitaly

I actually saw a lot of Nordstrom when I watched him. I thought he finished all his hits, but they didn't look that hard. He seemed to be doing good things defensively, decent stick and positioning. And he looked fine on the PK with Huberdeau.

That said, that line was playing slow, and didn't bring much energy. Meanwhile Lomberg - Morton - Klapka was the best line a day before. What I found a bit strange was that he didn't take any faceoffs despite his faceoff ability being one of the reasons we got him.

Klapka didn't have a lot in the tank the whole game after putting it all on the line the night before. Or maybe he's fighting whatever Backlund has.

[dino7c]

Klapka set the Flames all time hit record in a game on Tuesday so its understandable he would be a little low energy

Fans can be biased towards drafted players...they are usually wrong though. Beecher was a first round pick and has played 100+ NHL games for a reason vs. and undrafted FA. Hopefully they can both show more.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

He was just called up a few days ago so you should definitely be able to find some of those posts.

Speaking for myself, I am generally going to be more excited about a promotion from within than a waiver claim.

Why pick up a 24 year old with potential when you can just excite the fans by promoting good ole’ 29 year old Dryden Hunt.

[Monahammer]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

This idea that fans have, that the 4th line should be talented players, and not '4th liner-types' just doesn't add up to me.

Are there ANY teams in the league that try to employ this strategy? Are there any good ones?

Even if you could ice 4 talented lines, you wouldn't be able to keep them, in a cap system. In order to pay the top players, teams have no choice but to have some guys that cost the minimum. And with that, the best you can do is have guys that perform a role - i.e. forecheck and wear down the opposing D. That may seem on the surface to not add value, but it does - it makes the offensive guys more effective.

The problem isn't 4th line types, the problem is having bad ones. Which is why trying to upgrade the position seems like a good idea to me.

Winnipeg Jets 4th line:

Tanner Pearson (former 1st rounder, 20g scorer); Morgan Barron (PPG+ player in college and AHL, role player with 20 pt 10 goal averages in NHL) ; Gustav Nyquist (former top line player on several clubs, 20g scorer)

Canadiens 4th line:

Gallagher (30g scorer) - Veleno (dominant AHL and Junior Stats) -Anderson (20g scorer.)

Maybe you argue that Josh Anderson is a role player but he definitely wasn't always that. Veleno is the weak link but he's definitely not a role player, he's a player they hope has offensive upside.

Dallas 4th line:

Sam Steel -Radek Faska- Colin Blackwell

This is probably the closest that i list, but these guys are all offensive dynamos at lower levels, and all three average over 10 goals a season.

Tampa Bay 4th line:

Bjorkstrand (5 20g seasons)-James (23, not a role player, over ppg in AHL) -Goncalves (24, over a ppg in ahl, not a role player).

LA kings 4th line:

Armia- Turcotte- Perry

Canes:

Hall-Jankowski-Eric Robinson (averages between 20-30 points in a full season.)

Red Wings:

Rasmussen-Copp-Van Riemsdyk

Is this enough for you or should I continue? No one, other than the leafs and oilers, and the very injury depleted panthers, are really running role players consistently on their 4th line these days.

[gvitaly]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

This idea that fans have, that the 4th line should be talented players, and not '4th liner-types' just doesn't add up to me.

Are there ANY teams in the league that try to employ this strategy? Are there any good ones?

Even if you could ice 4 talented lines, you wouldn't be able to keep them, in a cap system. In order to pay the top players, teams have no choice but to have some guys that cost the minimum. And with that, the best you can do is have guys that perform a role - i.e. forecheck and wear down the opposing D. That may seem on the surface to not add value, but it does - it makes the offensive guys more effective.

The problem isn't 4th line types, the problem is having bad ones. Which is why trying to upgrade the position seems like a good idea to me.

Hall - Jankowski - Robinson is a pretty decent, relatively skilled, 4th line for CAR.

Benn - Faksa - Blackwell doesn't sound too bad either.

Now that Detroit is giving Danielson the opportunity as the 3C
Rasmussen - Copp - JVR is a $10M 4th line for DET.

I guess those successful teams(this season) end up sending the likes of Hall, Benn, and Copp to the 4th line in order to give the young guys the opportunity in the top 9 and not the other way around.

LAK: Armia - Turcotte - Perry

I also think that Milano and Lapierre are on WAS 4th line, but that's not a great 4th line.

I'm not advocating for a skilled 4th line.That said, I do think it's possible to develop skilled players like Mangiapane on the 4th line to start.