[Trade] Andersson (50% retained) to Vegas for 27 1st, cond 28 2nd, Whitecloud, Wiebe

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by BigThief

-Vegas Removes Ten Million to next years cap
-Vegas Adds 13.5 Million to next years cap
-Net add 3.5 million

You're in the weeds lost again.

You have lost the whole point being discussed. The net add was a $13.5M contract that potentially took them well over the 2026-27 cap when signed. Just like Rasmus' will take them over the cap (again).

Except when Eichel signed, they had no idea that Karlsson and Carter were going on LTIR (which I suppose may be likely for next season now, at least for Karlsson). So the cap effects would have looked bigger.

[ForeverFlameFan]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

Whitecloud seems like he may have under rated not only on the ice a bit, but maybe as a guy in the room too?

Kind of like Andrew Ference was when the Flames traded him for Brad Stuart.

It was a confusing trade to begin with. I get Andersson being a great player, but to go for a guy that more than likely gets 3x or more cap than Whitecloud at the improvement of a player playing 4-5 minutes more isn't exactly a good investment. Whitecloud was playing decent for them, and the results post-trade show it. Vegas just has the classic case of always chasing the bigger fish, sacrificing some great depth and their prospect cupboard.

[Bingo]

How about a new plan.

If you can't stand someone just don't have a hockey discussion with them? Put them on ignore or just scroll by ...

Because no of us find it interesting to see a Vegas contract situation escalate into a series of personal attacks.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

Whitecloud seems like he may have under rated not only on the ice a bit, but maybe as a guy in the room too?

Kind of like Andrew Ference was when the Flames traded him for Brad Stuart.

When I watched Vegas, he seemed very good.

He's no offensive dynamo, nor is he a big hitter. But he's just very well rounded, a smooth skater, has a good pass, and he has great hockey IQ. He knows how to shed forecheckers.

I was a little surprised Vegas wanted Andersson - he didn't seem to fit a need for them IMO. Sometimes I think Vegas just falls into the mindset of wanting the player that is topping the market. Marner, Eichel, Stone, Pietrangelo, etc.

EDIT: beaten to the exact same comment by FFF

[Locke]

Is this something that we're bothered with? Either he signs or he doesn't, its kind of a big trade for them not to keep him but he ain't exactly lighting the place on fire either.

He is also getting a little long in the tooth.

Maybe there is some buyer's remorse?

[devo22]

the more interesting question to me is: if you're Vegas, are you still itching to sign Andersson long-term after having him in the lineup for a quarter of the season? They probably have to do it, just because they gave up a good package to get him, but it's not like it's been a super successful marriage so far.

22 games, 2 goals, 5 assists, -6, 12 PIM, 21:12 min/game
19 games, 0 goals, 5 assists, +1, 6 PIM, 21:48 min/game

Player 1 is Raz in Vegas, player 2 is Whitecloud in Calgary. Pretty stunning.

[ForeverFlameFan]

Originally Posted by devo22

the more interesting question to me is: if you're Vegas, are you still itching to sign Andersson long-term after having him in the lineup for a quarter of the season? They probably have to do it, just because they gave up a good package to get him, but it's not like it's been a super successful marriage so far.

22 games, 2 goals, 5 assists, -6, 12 PIM, 21:12 min/game
19 games, 0 goals, 5 assists, +1, 6 PIM, 21:48 min/game

Player 1 is Raz in Vegas, player 2 is Whitecloud in Calgary. Pretty stunning.

I am kind of shocked that he hasn't panned out, considering that Hanifin and him had a TON of time played together here in Calgary.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by devo22

the more interesting question to me is: if you're Vegas, are you still itching to sign Andersson long-term after having him in the lineup for a quarter of the season? They probably have to do it, just because they gave up a good package to get him, but it's not like it's been a super successful marriage so far.

22 games, 2 goals, 5 assists, -6, 12 PIM, 21:12 min/game
19 games, 0 goals, 5 assists, +1, 6 PIM, 21:48 min/game

Player 1 is Raz in Vegas, player 2 is Whitecloud in Calgary. Pretty stunning.

And IMO that's despite Whitecloud having a couple games after he came back from his injury where he was clearly adjusting back to game speed. He looked fine last night though.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Macindoc

I'm not calling you (or anyone) a hater, just presenting the argument that the change to the Knights' lineup went beyond the addition of Andersson, and that Whitecloud might have been a better player than they (or many of us) thought prior to the trade.

Another poster did for reporting he got moved away from Hanifin and on to a lower pair. Time will tell. Unless he has a major turn around in the playoffs I doubt they sign him.

[Johnny Makarov]

Originally Posted by devo22

the more interesting question to me is: if you're Vegas, are you still itching to sign Andersson long-term after having him in the lineup for a quarter of the season? They probably have to do it, just because they gave up a good package to get him, but it's not like it's been a super successful marriage so far.

22 games, 2 goals, 5 assists, -6, 12 PIM, 21:12 min/game
19 games, 0 goals, 5 assists, +1, 6 PIM, 21:48 min/game

Player 1 is Raz in Vegas, player 2 is Whitecloud in Calgary. Pretty stunning.

Did people forget that Ras was -38 last year?

[devo22]

Originally Posted by Johnny Makarov

Did people forget that Ras was -38 last year?

it was also meant as a compliment for Whitecloud. Not only is he playing 22 minutes a night, but he's a plus player on one of the worst teams in the league. Raz being a minus player on a team in the hunt for a playoff spot might not be a complete shock after his -38 season, but it's still not a good sign if you're Vegas and have a long-term deal ready. His offensive numbers were always going to dip, since he only gets PP2 time there (they use a 5 forward PP1, I believe) ... but if I'm Vegas, I'm thinking real hard if signing a 29-year-old Andersson to a hefty long-term deal is the way to go.

Like GioForPM and ForeverFlamesFan said, Vegas just falling victim to chasing the bigger fish again. Feels like keeping Whitecloud and his contract would have made a lot more sense for them.

[BigThief]

Originally Posted by devo22

the more interesting question to me is: if you're Vegas, are you still itching to sign Andersson long-term after having him in the lineup for a quarter of the season? They probably have to do it, just because they gave up a good package to get him, but it's not like it's been a super successful marriage so far.

22 games, 2 goals, 5 assists, -6, 12 PIM, 21:12 min/game
19 games, 0 goals, 5 assists, +1, 6 PIM, 21:48 min/game

Player 1 is Raz in Vegas, player 2 is Whitecloud in Calgary. Pretty stunning.

Nine Games, Zero Goals, 5 assists, -2, 2 PIM, 22:24 min/game
Nine Games, Zero Goals, 1 assist, +1, 7 PIM, 21:10 min/game

Which one you want on your team long term?

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by BigThief

Nine Games, Zero Goals, 5 assists, -2, 2 PIM, 22:24 min/game
Nine Games, Zero Goals, 1 assist, +1, 7 PIM, 21:10 min/game

Which one you want on your team long term?

Not the guy that wants 8x9M

The fact that its even close but we get the draft picks and not the retirement contract is the whole point

[devo22]

Originally Posted by BigThief

Nine Games, Zero Goals, 5 assists, -2, 2 PIM, 22:24 min/game
Nine Games, Zero Goals, 1 assist, +1, 7 PIM, 21:10 min/game

Which one you want on your team long term?

Weegar/Maatta, I presume? Another fascinating situation.

Have to commend the Flames' pro scouting. Basically all of their additions have come in and done well immediately (Strome also comes to mind).

[BigThief]

Originally Posted by BigThief

Nine Games, Zero Goals, 5 assists, -2, 2 PIM, 22:24 min/game
Nine Games, Zero Goals, 1 assist, +1, 7 PIM, 21:10 min/game

Which one you want on your team long term?

Originally Posted by dino7c

Not the guy that wants 8x9M

Player A or Player B?

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by BigThief

Player A or Player B?

The player with the shorter and less expensive contract and all the picks thanks. Player A..Duh

[BigThief]

User has selected Olli Maata over McKenzie Weeger.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by BigThief

User has selected Olli Maata over McKenzie Weeger.

Yeah with the contracts and all the draft picks like I said

Conroy did the same...lol you think you got me??

[Mathgod]

Originally Posted by BigThief

Nine Games, Zero Goals, 5 assists, -2, 2 PIM, 22:24 min/game
Nine Games, Zero Goals, 1 assist, +1, 7 PIM, 21:10 min/game

Which one you want on your team long term?

9 games is too small a sample size to draw any conclusions about the players.

[BigThief]

Neither is twenty.