[PGT] Flames 4 Tampa 3 in OT

[D as in David]

Originally Posted by TrentCrimmIndependent

Definitely some post-trade bumps happening with a few individual players. Guys felt slighted and want to make a statement.

If we weren't hoping to finish low I'd be really excited for these three guys. The cognitive dissonance as a fan has been rough.

The bigger issue seems to be playing at home. They're a much better team at the Dome (which is great for ticket holders). Getting away should, hopefully, slow their roll.

What we as fans "hope to see" has exactly zero impact on what will actually happen in the future. We can wallow in those unrealized hopes, or we can enjoy the present, in the moment, while realizing that the hoped-for future wasn't going to turn out the way we hoped.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Thanks tips.

No wallowing, it's just a strange place to be to not want wins but still love the team and players.

[Super-Rye]

Originally Posted by Macindoc

They've been good, but I suspect a true 1C would elevate that line even more. I don't think Frost will ever be that. If the Flames end up picking 4th-5th, maybe Bjork or Malholtra could be that 1C. They should add another top pick in the 2027 draft. Between Malholtra/Bjork, Reschny, Potter, Gross/Castagna, and their 2027 1st, the Flames could have their centre position finally sorted by 2029/30. The wingers are already coming together, with Gridin, Coronato, Wyttenbach, Stockselius, Honzek, and Mews. Goaltending is looking good, so the other position to address is top pairing LD.

Would it be nice to have a true, generational play driving center? Yes of course it would. That's not likely realistic for this team, and most teams, anytime soon. For the most part you want guys who can play with your best players and make guys around them better.

Small sample size but Frost looks great since being on that line. He has chemistry with those 2 guys and if he finds the consistency I could definitely see him pop offensively next season. He has the skill set for it.

Reschny is another guy who I don't think has elite skills but has a skill set to play with elite players and make them better.

Really high on Lawrence and Bjork in this draft but these guys are a couple years away still. Not as high on Malhotra's top end potential but I've only seen him play a few times.

This teams got a lot going for it right now. Goaltending tandem could be amongst the best in the league next season. Bahl has turned into a real stud and looks like a #1 D out there. Consistent and makes every partner he players with look like a million bucks. I think people might be sleeping on just how good Bahl is. Him paired with Whitecloud that's a legit shutdown pair. 3 young defenseman behind them who look like they're taking steps too. That's an exciting young D core.

Forward group seems overcrowded on the wings and the center depth seems a little soft but some of these kids are taking big steps right now. Gridin's line has a ton of skill and energy, Backlunds line continues to shut other teams best players right down.

I know we all want a high pick in 2027 but there's definitely a world where this team competes for a playoff spot next year, and they do it will be on the backs of their young players. That's really exciting to think about.

[Itse]

Originally Posted by TrentCrimmIndependent

Definitely some post-trade bumps happening with a few individual players. Guys felt slighted and want to make a statement.

If we weren't hoping to finish low I'd be really excited for these three guys. The cognitive dissonance as a fan has been rough.

The bigger issue seems to be playing at home. They're a much better team at the Dome (which is great for ticket holders). Getting away should, hopefully, slow their roll.

Well, playing for the home fans is probably one of their main motivations at this point. You want to give Flames fans reasons to show up, both this season and the next.

[AC]

The cognitive dissonance as a fan is spot on. It's perfectly reasonable to be frustrated the team might worsen their potentially best draft pick ever with some moral victories down the stretch but at the same time recognize that instilling a winning culture is important.

Just like it's clear that while Conroy and his staff have done an impressive job in drafting recently (by finding many diamonds in the rough so to speak), this team is desperately in need of elite franchise players. These are almost exclusively found at the very top of the draft.

Almost all of the star players this franchise has had over its history have been underdog players who overcame adversity, or were overlooked by other teams, etc. Iginla, Gio, Johnny, Kipper, Fleury, etc. These types of players have shaped the team's identity for as long as I've been a fan.

No doubt our scouts will come away with some great pieces this draft regardless, but boy would it be nice to get some lottery luck for once and nab an elite player that singlehandedly changes the next 10-15 years of this team's trajectory. That feels like McKenna this year.

I will never cheer for losses, but it's also fair to be frustrated. If we pass Chicago and they end up winning the lottery adding McKenna to play with Bedard for example... these late season moral victories won't mean much. Hoping we get some lottery luck for once regardless, this franchise deserves it more than anyone.

[Savvy27]

That game was really encouraging to watch.

Cooley is keeping up his excellent play.

Brzustewicz showed strength in the D zone and also protecting the puck that I wasn't sure if he would ever be able to get to. He held off big veteran NHL players multiple times and made good plays afterwards.

Parekh appears to have worked on his puck retrievals because he was faking out forecheckers, avoiding contact, and emerging with the puck fully under control. It doesn't feel that long ago when other teams could just put it in his corner and more than likely get it back immediately.

Gridin looks like he is an x-factor kind of player. He wants to be the guy in shootouts, he beats one of the better defensive defencemen in the league in overtime to set up the winning goal.

These games are building up the Flames young players. It's already noticeable and when they come back after a good offseason of training they will be primed to take another step as true regulars. I'm getting to the point where I'd be surprised if we see Parekh go back to the AHL where I was kind of expecting it even three weeks ago.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

That says 30% chance of a top 3 pick for second last. You don't add the percentages together for the first three though. They are separate odds for each result.

I don't think this is correct as they all add up to 100% and only the first 2 picks are determined by the lottery.
31st team has a guaranteed top 4 pick and almost 60% odds of a top 3; you can only drop max 2 spots.
29th position where the Flams sit now drops top 3 odds to under 20%.

Vancouver will draft top 3 baring a miracle win streak and the next last team will draft top 4 with very high top 3 odds.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

I don't think this is correct as they all add up to 100% and only the first 2 picks are determined by the lottery.
31st team has a guaranteed top 4 pick and almost 60% odds of a top 3; you can only drop max 2 spots.
29th position where the Flams sit now drops top 3 odds to under 20%.

Vancouver will draft top 3 baring a miracle win streak and the next last team will draft top 4 with very high top 3 odds.

Yeah, I was incorrect on that.

But the Flames are still in a tie for 2nd last place. They are just ranked where they are because of tiebreakers. And they are only there because of a hot streak powered by new guys who will likely regress.

[dino7c]

If the Flames are not 1 or 2 there is a decent chance they take the same player at 3,4,5, or 6 honestly they likely take the center while others take the dmen

[Mathgod]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

I thought your take was totally reasonable, even if someone might not agree with it. Not sure why it received such an emotion and combative reaction.

When that poster led with "They're not as bad as people want them to be", it came across as disparaging toward anyone who didn't agree with his views, rather than an attempt at level-headed conversation.

It's a disgusting thing to accuse people of WANTING the Flames to be bad. When I saw that I'm like what the hell, what's with the belittling tone and trying to provoke people? Then he goes on to say "maybe people will realize the rebuild started 2 years ago" like oh thanks, us dumb little people didn't realize that. Then I saw his post get a huge amount of thanks and it ticked me off.

Acknowledging that the team is bad is not the same thing as wanting them to be bad. Two entirely different things.

Hoping the Flames get the best possible odds at McKenna is not the same thing as wanting them to be bad. It's also not the same thing as wanting the players to give less than their all trying to win games. It's about hoping they don't get the bounces going their way. It's about wanting hard-fought one-goal losses, with some wins sprinkled in here and there. That kind of hockey is good for draft positioning while at the same time good for the team's competitive culture.

That said, I never hope the Flames are bad. I always hope the Flames are good. If there was a way for them to be legit cup contenders every year and never have to rebuild, I'd be all in favor of that!! But unfortunately that's not the reality of the NHL. In this league, you need talent to contend for a cup. Flames have a number of nice young players, but we need to be realistic about their upside. Parekh has potential, but does he have Makar/Hughes potential? I don't know. Gridin has potential, but will be become an elite player or a good complimentary player? We don't know. Bahl has become a good top pairing guy, but does he have the potential to take another step? We don't know. Wolf was tremendous last season but seems to have taken a step back this season. Is it just a blip on the radar or a sign of possible regression? We don't know. Does Cooley have elite potential? We don't know. Ultimately I think this team has built a good foundation, but there's a lot more building that still needs to take place before any reasonable talk of being a good, or even decent team.

Look, I came into this season looking at the heater they finished off last season on. 11-2-3 in their final 16 games. 96 points, tied for the most ever by a team to miss. So I expected them to come into this season and once again fight hard to try and make the playoffs. Then I saw the 2-9-2 start and it changed my outlook on the season. I switched over to team McKenna, but that doesn't mean I wanted them to be bad. It was just an acknowledgement that they were a bad team, and there was no point in hanging on to this many vets for another run at a playoff spot. Moving vets for the best possible returns they would bring for the rebuild would be the best thing to do, and thankfully, that's what happened.

I want McKenna on this team badly. While it's true that there's 5 or 6 really good players at the top of the draft, to me McKenna is a step above the rest, which is why the odds at 1st overall mean so much to me. With the 3 game win streak, it looks like those odds are getting slimmer and slimmer. As for the "poof gone" comment, I was talking about the situation the Flames were in, they were in 31st place with a bit of a cushion, and now suddenly not only is the cushion gone but they have jumped to 29th. That's all I meant by it. Didn't stop some posters from putting words in my mouth. That said, Chicago and NYR are also bad teams, they are going to lose a bunch of games too (STL in the mix as well). So no I don't think it's very likely that the Flames get back into 31st place (even though it's still possible).

If we don't get McKenna, fine, we will still get a very good player. But I'll still be a bit disappointed.

And all the talk about odds not mattering, sorry, I disagree. Tell any successful poker player that odds don't matter, and see what kind of reaction you get.

Anyways, getting back to that original post. His reasoning of why the Flames aren't that bad of a team didn't make sense. Elite goaltending... debatable, but for the sake of argument I'll grant you that. Up & coming elite defenseman... yes, Parekh is showing signs of growth and getting more accustomed to the NHL game with each passing game. But he's still got a ton more growth ahead of him and he's not anywhere close to elite right now. Just 2 points in his last 10 games. Numerous young 2nd and 3rd line forwards? Yes, ok, but what does that have to do with being a good team right now? It's more an outlook on how good the team could be in upcoming years. Gridin elite? While he's shown flashes of brilliance and elite potential, he's still a ways off from being an elite player.

Simply put - you're reading waaaaaaaaaay too much into a few games vs teams playing the 2nd half of back to backs and/or starting their backup goalies. This is not a sign of seeing results of a rebuild, nor is it a sign that the Flames are "not as bad as people want them to be".

I've seen this team go down the path of rushing a rebuild and throwing draft picks away like candy at the first sign of being somewhat competitive. That's what happened in response to being in the 2nd round in 2015. I have faith that Conny won't repeat mistakes that other GMs have made in the past. But it's frustrating to me to see some posters get all caught up in the idea that we're suddenly "not that bad" because we won a few games against tired teams.

TL/DR - the most important thing I want to convey is that I'm not disappointed in the team or anything they're doing. They're trying to win games, and that's what they're in the business of doing. I applaud that. My frustration has nothing to do with that. My frustration is in some of the not so good takes some of the posters here have been sharing. It's never fun when people get my position twisted and frame me as having views that I don't actually have. That's all.

[dino7c]

82 point team won the lottery last year...thats why its called a lottery. No sense in worrying. Hawks fans werent thrilled when they beat the Pens on the road to eliminate them and bumped the Hawks to 3 but then #3 was the lucky spot.

[442scotty]

No one has commented on Gross. I thought he looked pretty good for his first game. Seems to have pretty good wheels. And as someone asked earlier, was Parekh benched or hurt later in the third? I don’t recall seeing him the last 10 minutes or so.

[AC]

Originally Posted by 442scotty

No one has commented on Gross. I thought he looked pretty good for his first game. Seems to have pretty good wheels. And as someone asked earlier, was Parekh benched or hurt later in the third? I don’t recall seeing him the last 10 minutes or so.

Looks like Parekh didn't play in the last 6 minutes.

[jaikorven]

Not wanting to sound like a broken record, but does anyone know why?

[Lewis_D]

Missed the game last night and just got caught up watching the highlights.... What's with all the lightning jerseys in the crowd lol? Discouraging to know we have so many turncoats living amongst us!

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by AC

Looks like Parekh didn't play in the last 6 minutes.

He played on OT

[D as in David]

Originally Posted by jaikorven

Not wanting to sound like a broken record, but does anyone know why?

I could say why I think he didn't, but I know all too well where that will lead the conversation.

[AC]

Originally Posted by dino7c

He played on OT

No he didn't. Gridin, Bahl, and Strome played in OT, Backs won the faceoff then changed for Gridin right away.

https://www.nhl.com/stats/shiftcharts?id=2025021116

Parekh's last shift was uneventful and he didn't take any contact, but Tampa tied it a couple shifts after so it might have been just to not take any risks.

[dino7c]

Dang maybe I was drinking I thought I saw 19 out there...I guess OT was super short