Alberta Politics & Government Thread 4.0

[DJones]

https://globalnews.ca/news/11709925/...sales-tax-pst/

Finance Minister is pretty much saying we need and he recommends a PST. No ones said that since Prentice. Farkas is pissed Calgary is paying so much property taxes to the province.

They're both right, they both need more money to give people what they want. Jack up Healthcare/Education spending and its still not enough. Calgary is still running short on infrastructure spending.

Now we watch the awkward dance of provinces and cities begging for more money from the feds. Which I imagine the feds will inevitably do. Get some free publicity on a LRT line extension or water infrastructure. Can announce a new housing development once a week!

[troutman]

Originally Posted by Johnny Makarov

Whats up with Nenshi? Can they unleash him yet? I miss pissed off condescending Spenshi!

I like and respect Nenshi but I don’t think he can beat the UCP. Too much baggage from Calgary (fairly or unfairly).

Rakhi Pancholi can do it.

https://rakhipancholi.albertandp.ca/

[MBates]

Originally Posted by DJones

No one raises taxes on poor people. It's not worth the effort. If you make 60k, you pay 5% income taxes to Alberta. There's nothing to cut, a PST would be no different.
Exempt food, utilities, and housing/rent. A rebate wouldn't even be necessary. Maybe if you tax utilities and insurance they get a refund.

The whole point of a PST is to tax corporations more on their activities.

Adding a PST can be made politically survivable and less detrimental to the economy if there is a corresponding reduction in tax burden elsewhere such as raising the basic personal exemption.

Also, I would think that in a jurisdiction with a massive tourism industry that part of the point of a PST is you get to collect significant money from visitors in addition to your own taxpayers.

[Cappy]

Originally Posted by MBates

Adding a PST can be made politically survivable and less detrimental to the economy if there is a corresponding reduction in tax burden elsewhere such as raising the basic personal exemption.

Also, I would think that in a jurisdiction with a massive tourism industry that part of the point of a PST is you get to collect significant money from visitors in addition to your own taxpayers.

We are running a 10B deficit. Provincial debt is now 100B.

How do you justify adding a PST while making it revenue neutral at this point?

"honey, we are spending more money than we make. Im going to quit my 100k p/year job for this other 100k p/y job. that should help

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Cappy

We are running a 10B deficit. Provincial debt is now 100B.

How do you justify adding a PST while making it revenue neutral at this point?

"honey, we are spending more money than we make. Im going to quit my 100k p/year job for this other 100k p/y job. that should help

It's long been said Alberta could count on about $1 billion per percent PST. A 5% PST, implemented 25 years ago would mean we'd have no debt. Yes, I know inflation and all that, but round number, we would be OK right now.


Unfortunately radio shows like Danielle Smith's, The Manning Asylum, Taxpayer Federation, and Fraser Institute made that idea completely toxic for so long. We couldn't even discuss it without "ehrmagerd look how much taxes we pay compared to Americans" as they ignore the extra services like healthcare we have, and all the other taxes paid. But it worked. Here we are. And those people are in power because of it.

[para transit fellow]

Would it be possible to reverse Kenney's Job-creating tax cut to the major corporations?

Alberta's biggest corporations benefited from this lower tax rate with the expectation that jobs would be created...

Has that happened?

[GGG]

Originally Posted by GordonBlue

Alberta needs a sales tax, but they then need to adjust income tax rates so poor people don't get bent over double. (or something. I'm not that smart)
You just can't add a PST and make no other adjustments in taxation.

Well, the UCP can do it but no responsible government that cares about the vulnerable would just add a PST and call it a day.

We can add PST and we can increase other tax rates.

No one in this province pays enough tax.

[#-3]

Originally Posted by IliketoPuck

You add the PST, and give rebates to those under a certain income threshold on a quarterly basis. Keep it simple.

Earn Money ---> Pay 8% Tax ---> Spend Money ----> 10% tax ---> pay portion of credit card bill ----> Pay interest 18% ----> Vendor spends some money and pays 10% tax ----> vendor adds up all of the tax you gave them less all the tax they spend and send it to the government ----> Government audits vendors tax claims ----> Government transfers money to other government ----> Government checks tax records and applies a moderately complex formula to decide to refund you 8% of the 10% because you didn't make enough money to save money on average ---> Government issues you a refund ----> Send Refund money to credit card company ---> Still owe the 18% interest.

Seems pretty simple compared to just collecting 10% or 12% income tax, and having it progressively increase. like every other province.

[Tron_fdc]

Originally Posted by MBates

Adding a PST can be made politically survivable and less detrimental to the economy if there is a corresponding reduction in tax burden elsewhere such as raising the basic personal exemption.

Also, I would think that in a jurisdiction with a massive tourism industry that part of the point of a PST is you get to collect significant money from visitors in addition to your own taxpayers.

I'd add a PST and implement a progressive provincial income tax.

Currently we are at:

$0 – $61,200 8%
$61,200 – $154,259 10%
$154,259 – $185,111 12%
$185,111 – $246,813 13%
$246,813 – $370,220 14%
Over $370,220 15%


So if you add a 4% PST and do this:

$0 – $61,200 2%
$61,200 – $154,259 10%
$154,259 – $185,111 14%
$185,111 – $246,813 15%
$246,813 – $370,220 16%
Over $370,220 18%

It would be revenue neutral while reducing wage inequality, it stabilizes government finances instead of depending on O&G revenues, and carries limited risk of capital flight by maintaining a tax structure lower than Ontario and Quebec, but in line with say BC.

Edit: I'd also add in low income PST exemptions of some kind to help sell it to the masses

[puffnstuff]

If only there had been some sort of organization for Alberta that did this sort of thing before for the health care providers...

https://www.ctvnews.ca/edmonton/arti...alth-agencies/

Alberta is creating a provincial corporation, Health Shared Services (HSS), to centralize corporate services between its four health agencies.

In Budget 2026, $2.3 billion will be going toward HSS, which aims to deliver shared corporate services like information technology, finance, human resources and other supports across Primary and Preventative, Hospital and Surgical services as well as Assisted Living and Social Services, and Mental Health and Addiction.

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by puffnstuff

If only there had been some sort of organization for Alberta that did this sort of thing before for the health care providers...

https://www.ctvnews.ca/edmonton/arti...alth-agencies/

Alberta is creating a provincial corporation, Health Shared Services (HSS), to centralize corporate services between its four health agencies.

In Budget 2026, $2.3 billion will be going toward HSS, which aims to deliver shared corporate services like information technology, finance, human resources and other supports across Primary and Preventative, Hospital and Surgical services as well as Assisted Living and Social Services, and Mental Health and Addiction.

It's almost like they could have just restructured within AHS instead of smashing the vase and then realizing they need to order glue and hire a whole bunch of people to do the gluing.

[TorqueDog]

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

It's almost like they could have just restructured within AHS instead of smashing the vase and then realizing they need to order glue and hire a whole bunch of people to do the gluing.

You know they did that because someone's buddies are gonna be making money selling glue to fix the vase.

There's always a grift with this government. Someone is profiting from this idiocy.

[Fuzz]

It's easier to hide it when you have 10 different piles to root around in.

[Roughneck]

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

It's almost like they could have just restructured within AHS instead of smashing the vase and then realizing they need to order glue and hire a whole bunch of people to do the gluing.

AHS still exists, it's just being transitioned to a hospital services provider.


HSS will provide shared services like finance for AHS, who is currently run by Erin O'Neill who was AHS's Senior VP of Finance and Shared Services.

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by TorqueDog

You know they did that because someone's buddies are gonna be making money selling glue to fix the vase.

There's always a grift with this government. Someone is profiting from this idiocy.

100%. It seems like the first grift is running new rehab centres, which is really frightening in how vulnerable populations may be abused with poor oversight from very questionable people.

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by GGG

We can add PST and we can increase other tax rates.

No one in this province pays enough tax.

I think tax competitiveness is going to get more important over time for keeping high earners/the wealthy. The pandemic and general improvements in technology demonstrated that the highest earners can mostly work from anywhere. If AI works as a multiplier it's likely to increase incomes at the very high end and make those people even more mobile than they are now.

[Julio]

Originally Posted by Tron_fdc

I'd add a PST and implement a progressive provincial income tax.

Currently we are at:

$0 – $61,200 8%
$61,200 – $154,259 10%
$154,259 – $185,111 12%
$185,111 – $246,813 13%
$246,813 – $370,220 14%
Over $370,220 15%


So if you add a 4% PST and do this:

$0 – $61,200 2%
$61,200 – $154,259 10%
$154,259 – $185,111 14%
$185,111 – $246,813 15%
$246,813 – $370,220 16%
Over $370,220 18%

It would be revenue neutral while reducing wage inequality, it stabilizes government finances instead of depending on O&G revenues, and carries limited risk of capital flight by maintaining a tax structure lower than Ontario and Quebec, but in line with say BC.

Edit: I'd also add in low income PST exemptions of some kind to help sell it to the masses

If it is revenue neutral, then we would be getting the same $ from taxes, and thus the provincial government would still be on the O&G rollercoaster. Tax revenue would have to be closer to the total cost of government expenditures to stop the current conundrum.

[bob-loblaw]

Isn't the deficit caused by immigrants? Why don't they just tax them at 100% then?

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by bob-loblaw

Isn't the deficit caused by immigrants? Why don't they just tax them at 100% then?

Why not just implement a bear tax?

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

Why not just implement a bear tax?

Because once Todd and his gang hunt down all the bears, you'd run out of revenue. Sure, one CP voter would swing your way, but that's about it for benefits.