Edmonton is No Good XII: "I Dunno.. it's Just Not Good."

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by Eric Vail

I disagree. Dallas drafted Grushnikov and Calgary traded for him hoping he would develop into a player like Tanev. They both knew he was never going to be a high flying offensive player. Both teams hoped he would be an excellent defensive defenseman.

If they could identify a player at 18 and say with confidence that he was going to be as good defensively as Tanev, he wouldn't be going in the second round. Every defenceman in the draft is an extreme long shot to accomplish that. Such players are not in the same conversation as Makar or Hughes, and nobody is taking them in the top 10.

In the second round, you could be getting a Kuznetsov, a Hutson, a tweener, or nothing. Any scout or GM, and any sensible fan, knows there are no guarantees and a high probability of not getting an NHLer. ‘This guy is the next Chris Tanev’ is not something you would expect to hear at an NHL scouts' meeting unless large quantities of booze are involved.

If anything, though, the fact that these players are being taken in the second round goes against stemit14's idea that teams have stopped looking for them in the draft. The flashy guys with obvious upside and high floors are naturally going to go first, as they always have.

[FlamesAddiction]

Stolen from Reddit:

McDavid has now lost an OHL Final, 2 Cup Finals and a Gold Medal Game while being named MVP almost every time.

I wonder what the record is for being MVP while losing, and will the Oilers raise a banner?

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by united

https://twitter.com/user/status/2025767580930339287

So um there's a lot of swallowing going on according to Frank

[Sofa GM]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

So um there's a lot of swallowing going on according to Frank

Synonymous with the Katzing couch

[bubbsy]

Originally Posted by Eric Vail

I disagree. Dallas drafted Grushnikov and Calgary traded for him hoping he would develop into a player like Tanev. They both knew he was never going to be a high flying offensive player. Both teams hoped he would be an excellent defensive defenseman.

I think that’s the point though. I think there are some pretty strong statistical evidence to the fact that all nhl defensemen (especially including nhl level shutdown guys) almost always have decent to good offensive numbers as prospects. Very (very) few nhl defensive dmen track to having lengthy/good nhl careers without it.

My theory is that any nhl caliber dman has to be comfortable with the puck. Being a good defender only , good at clearing the front of the net, etc , on its own, at junior has a lot lower probability of translating at the nhl level.

[Reggie Dunlop]

Edmonton is no good.

[stemit14]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

If they could identify a player at 18 and say with confidence that he was going to be as good defensively as Tanev, he wouldn't be going in the second round. Every defenceman in the draft is an extreme long shot to accomplish that. Such players are not in the same conversation as Makar or Hughes, and nobody is taking them in the top 10.

In the second round, you could be getting a Kuznetsov, a Hutson, a tweener, or nothing. Any scout or GM, and any sensible fan, knows there are no guarantees and a high probability of not getting an NHLer. ‘This guy is the next Chris Tanev’ is not something you would expect to hear at an NHL scouts' meeting unless large quantities of booze are involved.

If anything, though, the fact that these players are being taken in the second round goes against stemit14's idea that teams have stopped looking for them in the draft. The flashy guys with obvious upside and high floors are naturally going to go first, as they always have.

I should correct what I said I think. It was incorrect for me to say teams would not try to draft the next tanev - they absolutely will be. I think the difference will be that teams will want even their defensive defencemen to be fast and quick on their edges. It’s getting more rare for defencemen to be drafted that are below-average skaters - even the ones that are >6’3” are required to be high end skaters. They might overlook skating in forwards sometimes still but it’s becoming more and more rare in defensemen. Ultimately, as McDavid gets a little slower with age he will also be facing faster and faster defensemen entering the league.

[taxbuster]

Originally Posted by midniteowl

Are people still gonna say McPiggy is the best player in the world? Of course they are, who am I kidding, but, in the most important game of his life, the most important period of his life and the most important shift of his life, well, he is on the ice for goal against. But he is voted MVP, and that's what he is, the MVP in a losing result.

Of course they will. There was some dude on 960 earlier today (noon show?) from Toronto absolutely gushing about McLoser. Nauseating and naturally repeating the BPITW nonsense title.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Social media isn't towing the McLine though.

Plenty of videos circulating today about how McDavid is building a reputation as a guy that can't get it done when the chips are down.

Racking up points against Switzerland and France is child's play.

If any one should be lauded for their tournament with Canada it should be Celebrini.

[midniteowl]

McDavid is prime example of anti-clutch.

[McG]

Let me describe a situation to you, and you can decide if you have seen this before...and how often.

It's a close game, might even be tied, maybe even 3 v 3 overtime. The BPITW gets the puck, and goes 1 v 3. Most nights...it's against at least one player who might not have the quality to play in a gold medal game. Maybe even two, maybe even three! Let's just say that the play breaks down as said BPITW isn't successful.

The other team gets possession and, because they can skate, immediately go on the attack in a 3 v 1. BPITW with amazing crossovers, inhuman speed that differentiates him from even other amazing players, and incredible powers of stamina on a 200 foot sheet of ice, strides a few times and then coasts once he crosses the blue line. Doesn't recognize that the puck carrier is going to be passing the puck. Doesn't bother to pick up the open player closest to the net or position himself to intercept the pass or block the shot or just get in the way.

I don't know about you...but you have to be willing not to learn how to disrupt plays after 10 years of playing in the league. You literally have to go out of your way to not learn what to do.

I get heroics, I get the omnipresence of a permanent display in the HHOF, I get the videos for the next 50 years.

What I don't get is the lack of "if I don't get back fast enough it could be all over". I don't understand how you couldn't use your very last bit of stamina to break up a play. I don't get why you wouldn't recognize the danger.

Coulda, woulda, shoulda.

No good.

===

And to be clear, I was all in on McDavid scoring or assisting on the winning goal for Canada. Stupid me. I have seen this before.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Both McDavid and Makar got caught drifting in no man's land.

But McDavid was close enough to the play to do something about it and certainly had the speed to get there.

He turned off the jets instead of getting in front of Hughes.

Poor awareness and caught puck watching. It's like he expected a d-man to apparate and cover whoever needed to be covered and get him the puck back.

[midniteowl]

Originally Posted by TrentCrimmIndependent

Both McDavid and Makar got caught drifting in no man's land.

But McDavid was close enough to the play to do something about it and certainly had the speed to get there.

He turned off the jets instead of getting in front of Hughes.

Poor awareness and caught puck watching. It's like he expected a d-man to apparate and cover whoever needed to be covered and get him the puck back.

Yeah, that's his problem alright. Expecting someone else to work and get him the puck instead of hustle his ass and go get or fight for the puck.

[Robbob]

I also think part of the issue was he wasn't in sync with his line mates. I think they were also a bit confused when went solo the second time.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by stemit14

I should correct what I said I think. It was incorrect for me to say teams would not try to draft the next tanev - they absolutely will be. I think the difference will be that teams will want even their defensive defencemen to be fast and quick on their edges. It’s getting more rare for defencemen to be drafted that are below-average skaters - even the ones that are >6’3” are required to be high end skaters. They might overlook skating in forwards sometimes still but it’s becoming more and more rare in defensemen. Ultimately, as McDavid gets a little slower with age he will also be facing faster and faster defensemen entering the league.

I agree with all this.

[Groot]

McDavid will miss the games against Anaheim and LA. Perfect timing when your team is barely holding onto a playoff spot and both teams you're playing are fighting for your playoff position.

Leadership.

[shogged]

Originally Posted by midniteowl

McDavid is prime example of anti-clutch.

Generational runner-up

[getbak]

https://edmontonjournal.com/sports/c...lympics-return

Just when their captain catches up with the rest of the team and when he is able to suit back up in Oilers colours, Knoblauch wouldn’t pinpoint. But it doesn’t sound like it will be soon.

It might not even be this week.

“Yeah, I guess it all depends on numerous things,” he said. “Playing in the back-to-back would be difficult, and for him to play 23-24 minutes in back-to-back games after the Olympics, travelling from Europe? I don’t think that’s putting him in a very good position to help us.

“So, we’ll have to lean on other guys a lot more and hopefully he is healthy by the weekend to step right into the lineup.”

Perhaps, you could just not play him 23 minutes a night.

[dino7c]

lol yeah right, they will lose one game and he will be back playing 30 mins

[cam_calderon]

Which guys are you gonna lean on, Knob? You're such a poor coach they needed to get a legend back to babysit you after you made it clear you didn't want him around lol.